to restore or not to restore that is the ?

[mike gilbert]

hello everyone, i am a new 83 sc owner.its a very nice car that has had only 3 owners before me. my question is, if all the original stuff is still usable and will clean up good should i keep it even though a new part may look better?i mean yes i could get new sun visors but the original ones work and look good other than they are a little fluffy and yes the carpet doesn't look new but it looks pretty darn good to be 25 years old..will it be better in the long run to keep it all original? i want to keep it as stock and original as possible.the original paint is even going to shine up after a buff.anyway i feel very lucky to have got a car in such well cared for condition and want to know if replacing everything that looks older will hurt the value or not effect it at all...thanks, mike

[vreference]

Afraid we're gonna need some pics.

[pranderson]

Mike:
I've got an 83SC with 70K on it and 74 911 with 121K on it. I drive both of them. I've gone through the 74 (new paint, replaced quite a bit of trim etc.), I just replace it with the OE stuff and I think if anything it's increased the value. I'll never get out of it what I've put into it, but that's not why I bought them.
Unless it's a concours original, I think it's all up to your personal taste. I understand what you're asking though, I wouldn't want to "touch up" a Van Gogh and I know that some antique furniture is devalued by "refinishing" it. I don't think that's the case with a porsche. Unless it's an all original classic with less than a hundred miles on it. Use your judgement and enjoy the heck out of it.

[Bill Douglas]

Don't worry Mike, something will come along really soon to spend money on.

Good luck and enjoy the Car. I love SCs.

[rfn026]

The mood is changing. Restoration efforts are now being questioned. Remember, restoration is destruction. When you restore a car you return it to a given point in time. You also destroy the car's history. That's why you will never see the Collier 917 restored. Mr. Collier feels that the car's history is more important than having a shiny paint job.

The current feeling is that preservation and conservation is very important. Restoration is best left for those basket case cars with no significant history. There are some cars that are so bad that you have no choice. They simply have to be restored.

This is going to become a big issue over the next decade. I think at some point preserved cars will be the most valuable. That's already the case at the top end of the market. It's a trend that is sure to filter down to our level.

Richard Newton

Autocross Performance Handbook

Wheel and Tire Performance Handbook

[livi]

Welcome, Mike!

I agree with your basic philosophy to keep it as original and stock as possible. However, freshening it up with new OEM details like carpets etc will not affect its value in a negative way - rather the opposite. You can always keep the original pieces.

With some of the more rare, sought after, models the reasoning can be different. I would, for example, not touch anything original and working in a stock 73RS.

Pics of your car is much appreciated (some claim mandatory)!

[javadog]

If something that is hard to replicate can be saved (carpet, for instance) I'd try to save it. Aftermarket replacement carpet is generally different from the original, so you can generally tell if it has been replaced. Original carpet is hard to find and expensive.

On the other hand, things like front turn signal lenses are easy to get and relatively cheap. The only problem with replacing parts like those is that the new ones will be noticeably better than the parts they are next to, so you will possibly call attention to the other parts, unless you replace/refurbish those as well.

I'd say preserve as much as you can, although I feel that it will still be a long time before the value of a 911SC will be such that the difference might matter.

Enjoy the car,
JR

[jtfreels]

Welcome Mike

I'd say preserve what you can, don't replace things needlessly. But then your car sounds to be in much better shape than mine!

Hey we may be neighbors, I'm by Houston High school.


Jay

[mike gilbert]

ok,all good answers..i need about 2 more days before i post pics...im still doing a major full detail..i think all im going to need are new tan leather seat covers and some tires, its amazing, im so happy....jt freels, im on raliegh lagrange off hy. 205 yes we are neighbors my brother also has a911 we should have a little early morning run on ral. lag. sometime. oh its a seen man...mike

[rusnak]

I had a brilliant college professor named David Easton in college. He used to ask us, "if John Locke kept mending his sock each time a hole was worn in it, and eventually the entire sock has been mended so much that none of the original thread remains, is John Locke's sock still John Locke's sock"?

Does the thread need to match the original, do you need to keep the old thread, or can you replace it, etc etc.

That question drove me nuts. There is no clear answer. 20 years later, it still is driving me nuts. I don't think it's realistic to not replace parts. Replacement when the usable life is almost gone is my general approach. I use factory Porsche parts or oem equivalent.

[Super_Dave_D]

If you bought the car to drive and enjoy but you want to replace a few things that bug you - then replace it with OEM stuff. I doubt down the road, no one is really going to care that the tired carpet was replaced with new OEM stuff.

If you bought the car to resell - get out now while you still can.

[ramonesfreak]

welcome.
ive got an 83 as well. all original except for the stereo & speakers and consumables... coil, wires etc...

i love that my car is original. im not sure what there is to change or why i would change it. if a part was badly damaged or a real eye sore, i would replace with OEM.

if the dash cracked, and its likely to in the next few years, ill have to replace it or repair it. i cant stand looking at a cracked dash. my driver seat is about to split. im undecided about what to do....the seat is otherwise nice....very worn and original which i like. perhaps i will attempt a creative repair using an old cut up brown leather jacket to patch it even though it will look strange. i think i would prefer that to a nice new seat cover. my visors are puffy. if i could find new OEM ones in perfect condition and were brown, i would replace mine. my paint is original. no way im repainting it just because it has chips or dings. i like seeing the cars history revealed on its surfaces

i dont care for 911's that have alot of aftermarket parts unless its a track car.

[4flyboy]

Hi Mike,

I strongly suggest that you sit back for a month or two, drive the car, then sort out the things that are important to you. After the newness/impulse stuff wears off you will be much better equipped to sort out and prioritize what you want vs. need. There will be no excess cash sitting around for long! And you will save yourself countless mistakes/cash.

My opinion and and $1.50 will get you a cup of coffee!!

Oh.......Congratulations!

Scott

[mike gilbert]

flyboy what you said is excactly correct.i just drove the car tonight for the first time more than a block away.(i had to clean the tank and replace fuel pump filter ect) and im totally impressed with the car..i am going to drive it but not everyday.the fact that i own a 911 that runs and drives as it should has really not hit me yet only because i never really thought i could find a nice one in my price range. i have loved the car my whole life..i need time and not to rush to any conclutions just yet of what it needs other than a fuel accumilator, tires and a lot of love...its good to be here and thank for all the comments.i will post pics soon of my 83 sc..thanks, mike

[JV911SYDNEY]

Originally Posted by livi

I agree with your basic philosophy to keep it as original and stock as possible. However, freshening it up with new OEM details like carpets etc will not affect its value in a negative way - rather the opposite. You can always keep the original pieces.

+1

a distinction needs to be drawn between restoration and modification

[whiteSC59]

There are cars that are being dismantled everyday because of wrecked or converted to racers. If you keep a sharp eye out, you can 'trade up' in quality on all the noticeable things like seats, carpet, light lenses, dash, ect. and resell your seat cores, lenses, door panels to someone else who may be less fortunate than yourself for half or better than what you paid. There are deals everyday, get you some!! Congrats on the new ride.

[rfn026]

Actually we have 3 directions for any car.

1-Preservation
2-Restoration
3-Modified

Trends come and go. It used to be a big deal to have a restored Porsche. Now the hot market is in the original cars.

A nicely done RGruppe hot rod is also a pricey car, but it has to be done in the correct style for that period.

Richard

[SCWDP911]

Mike,

Welcome neighbor. Don (his brother) told me you had bought that 83. I think it might be one another guy was looking at on Rennlist. In fact, I thought maybe you had signed up over there as well, but that guy already had an 87 cab as well. At any rate, welcome and good pick on the car. I think Don has already told you about the MTFR group. I organize a monthly get together and the next one will probably be next Saturday, 6/21. We look forward to haveing you and Don out with us. Shoot me a PM with your email address and I will add you to the mailing list for news on MTFR dates. There is also a CPA dinner tonight I think. It is the third Thursday of every month and is somewhere is east part of Memphis area usually. Check out www.pca-msr.org for more info on that. Looking forward to meeting you.

BTW, you do great body and paint! Don's car looks great... Jay, if you have not done anything with your collision yet, you should talk with Mike.

[SCWDP911]

Mike, I just checked and the next PCA-MSR dinner is next Thursday, 6/19. It is a cruise in at one of the Sonics, but can't remember which one.

[mike gilbert]

here are some pics from today. alot still has to be done..im sure that i will paint the hood and front bumper asap..and plent more nick nack bits from what i can tell. i must restore some of the car in order to save it. its a battle with time and the rust will win if let go to long..it has very little but there is some around the lower corners of the front windshield that scare me the most.they are dime size now..so the windshield must come out and the area will be treated, metal etched and painted..other than that its very clean and super smooth, its a blast to drive feels tight and right with alot of low end so i know its running right...