911 vs. 964 comparison

[nickd]

Just a note on this discussion: Will all those with first-hand experience of additional C4 problems speak up?



If you plan on lots of track time = C2
If you plan on seeing rain/snow = C4
If you don't plan on either = don't worry about it.

A four-door has more parts than a 2-door, but how often do doors break?

[911JC911]

Originally Posted by nickd

Just a note on this discussion: Will all those with first-hand experience of additional C4 problems speak up?



If you plan on lots of track time = C2
If you plan on seeing rain/snow = C4
If you don't plan on either = don't worry about it.

A four-door has more parts than a 2-door, but how often do doors break?

True...but doors aren't connected to the drivetrain.

[KTL]

Check out the 993/964 forum here for better traffic. You also need to go to Rennlist to find out about the woes of 964 C4 owners. Rennlist is the place to be for 964 and 993 discussion.

What I do know from some discussions i've ran across over the years, the C4 drivetrain is electro-hydraulically complex and not cheap to service if repairs are needed. I recall there are two sensors in the system that have been known to fail and are $1K each to replace. I believe Panorama did a C4 to C2 "conversion" a few years ago and I recall the article saying it is not an easy task, so one should just start with a C2 and avoid the grief of even attempting retrofitting a C4 drivetrain.

[89911]

Nobody mentioned what I consider the most important feature I like about my car (89 911). Road feel. The pre 964 cars have this in spades. It struck me the first time I drove it and it hits me every time I drive it after driving my suv and minivan. There is so little between the tire and the steering wheel, I can feel every part of the road. I don't question the 964 has more "upgrades" but it depends on what you are looking for. As far as smiles per miles, I'll never trade my torsioned bar classic.

[nickd]

I've only come across a few instances of hearing of C4-specific problems. In fact, I hear more instances of C2-trans problems...

There is no substitute for seat-time in each model. Just be sure that they are solid examples that you're testing. Road feel is pretty subjective. An SC feels like a Cadillac compared to a 356 after all. The 964 is a perfect balance for me.

I will agree that rennlist has a much bigger 964 section if you want to more research.

[RideShoot&Drink]

With upgraded suspension 964 has plenty of road feel and a better car in every respect (aero, cooling, engine, tranny, suspension, stiffness). But...weight is the enemy...which is easier/cheaper to deal with than adding HP to your SC. I hear C2's do well at the track too.

[alniki]

If you like the road feel of the 964, try the Mercedes 190E, which happens to be my daily driver. That's my rationale for choosing the Carrera 3.2. And the 190E is more trouble-free and much cheaper to run. Probably better balanced, too, thoguh mine is a Euro spec one.

[89911]

Originally Posted by nickd

Road feel is pretty subjective. An SC feels like a Cadillac compared to a 356 after all.

How do you figure. They are practically using the same components, a arms and torsion bars. The 964 has power steering and coil over suspension. Theres your Cadillac

[Dan (almaden)]

let me get this straight you think a Merc. 190E is better balanced than a 964?

Whose diesel exhaust have you been sniffing

Originally Posted by alniki

If you like the road feel of the 964, try the Mercedes 190E, which happens to be my daily driver. That's my rationale for choosing the Carrera 3.2. And the 190E is more trouble-free and much cheaper to run. Probably better balanced, too, thoguh mine is a Euro spec one.

[nickd]

Originally Posted by 89911

How do you figure. They are practically using the same components, a arms and torsion bars. The 964 has power steering and coil over suspension. Theres your Cadillac

An '89 has 600+ lbs on a 356! I spent enough time in an 1800 lb car to know that a Ford tempo feels like a Caddy in comparison.

The 964 power steering has a very nice and substantial feel in my opinion. Bilsteins and H&R springs don't let you forget that you're driving a sportscar either.

Still, it's all relative. Go drive them both!

[alniki]

Well, guess I just said 'probably'
The 190E does feel pretty neutral at cornering though you also feel its potential is not that much as a 964 or 911 without some suspension mod. FYI, I've driven a US spec 190E, quite different animal. Just my 2 cents and YMMV

Originally Posted by Dan (almaden)

let me get this straight you think a Merc. 190E is better balanced than a 964?

Whose diesel exhaust have you been sniffing

[aigel]

If you want road feel, go faster!

George

[RideShoot&Drink]

Actually, C2 in a way reminded me a Mercedes that's how solid that car was built...not 190 of course, but a more substantial one.