1973 911T Engine conversion to 2.8 RSR Engine. Need help.

[NavySailor47]

Hi. I have a 911T from 1973. I am starting my RSR project. I want to convert the engine to an RSR Engine. Where do I start? Is there a book out there based on doing one of these conversions? First of all, the 1973 had a 2.8 Liter Engine. I need to find a company which is well known for doing a good job at engine conversions, and for a lower price than other companies. Not trying to be cheap, but I want the best price. From there, I need a good transmission. What type transmission should I be looking for to have better performance from my 911? Did the RSR have a transmission like the one currently in my car? What can I upgrade to make that a better transmission? Thanks for the help!

[Jim Dorociak]

Bruce Anderson wrote 911 Performance Handbook - there is a 3rd edition just released -- seriously a very good starting point to understand Porsche, Porsche engines, all the different versions and most importantly what you can and can not do. Even if you choose to let someone build for you -- you need knowledge. The 2.8 is one of the most expensive, hard to build, and may not actually be the best choice of a hot rod 911 engine. Jim

[NavySailor47]

Thanks for the help!

[TRE Cup]

i could write pages on the differences between a stock 73 cis T and the 2.8 RSR. You can find a LOT of great information on the early 911S registry site.

No matter what , if you are after an ACCURATE reproduction of the 2.8 RSR motor, this will be a very expensive project !

some sample pricing
new high butterfly injection manifolds, with stacks, linkage (excellent reproduction) $8k from europe New old stock original $14k
rebuilt and modified mfi injection pump , new injectors, mfi lines, $6-8k
donor 2.7 engine (your cis motor is not cost effective to use) $1500
full machine shop services to a 7R case, cylinder heads, crankshaft etc $3k +
twin plug distributor, twin cd units, wires, holders $3000 or so
small diameter RSR alternator ring, small diameter fan blade, correct german twill fiberglass shrouding $3k PLUS another 40 hours to make it all fit
RSR oil filter assy- repro, with block off $2500
RSr camshafts- new aftermarket billets $800
2.8 RSR pistons and cylinders- $4200
RSR replica headers with megaphones- mild steel coated $1000
Misc rebuild items needed in the motor- budget $3k
Labor to "blue print" and assemble, run in $6k

Definitely nose bleed territory !

[NavySailor47]

Well I think that I will just try to find another engine to rebuild. How hard is it to bore out the "T" engine to a 3.0?

[TRE Cup]

that won't happen- the case is too small, and the super rare 3 liter andial p/c kit for the 7r case is no longer available

find yourself a decent condition 3.2. it will bolt up to the trans in your car, with just a cut for the sensors in the bell housing. Great motor that delivers a lot of power with a steve wong chip, ssi's and a sport muffler. best bang for the money

[Duckworth]

Quite a few guys want to make the RSR expression to their cars - and one thought might be to just maintain the narrow bodied look of the car....

RSR look cars are certainly nice - but so is an 911R interpretation..... Meaning, what about pitching a few hundred lbs. --- and in keeping with a spartan engine compartment - consider dropping a 2.4 litre that is gone over.

That is a nice combination that wouldn't pin you hard on dollars - and allow you to
sort out the suspension to your satisfaction.


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'82 Targa - sold
'77 Spitfire

[NavySailor47]

Well call me crazy, but I have fallen in love with the RSR. It's just so beautiful. I really have nothing better to spend my money on, and what better way then to spend it on something that I have been dreaming of having my whole life.

[NavySailor47]

Can the 3.0 SC Bolt up to the Transmission in my car?

[regency]

NS47, the best advise i can give you is to research everybody / everything. There's a lot of scammers out there waiting for someone like you ( new to Porsche restoration ), and will promise you the world ( engine rebuild ) for cheap.

If i could start over on my project ( 911 resto start 2005 ), and knowing what I know now, I would go to the best builder out there with the best, reputation. Period.

you can go to all the ass holes that say they can do it faster & cheaper and they're all FULL OF *****.

Pay to have a real pro do it right. Or, pay half the price, get a ***** engine that leaks, makes no oil pressure and a million dumb ass excuses from the dumb ass so called builder.

my 2 cents

[boba]

You have gotten some good advice, a '73 RSR is a great car and project, but you should do lots of research and planning befor you start spending your money. Many of the parts are very expensive and hard to source. Dave gave you some ideas on engine parts. There are also transmision, suspension & brakes, body, interior, and wheels and tires. The 9 & 11 x15 Fuchs will run $10K and the tires another $2k.

Look on the engine forum on this board,
www.early911sregistry.org
http://www.pbase.com/slidevalve911rsr

These will give some ideas.

edit to correct link.

[kiwiokie]

Depends whether you want the look of the RSR or to recreate one with a degree of authenticity. From everything I have read on this forum the latter is a very expensive route. There was a nice viper green RSR-look for sale recently so check the for sale forum to see what a good look-a-like might cost to build. I suspect the seller has much more in this car than the sales price. The S/T look is also pretty cool.

[Hebrewhomeboy]

Of the 911 engines, which one is cheapest to modify, in general? Does one trump another, or are they all similarly priced to modify?

[Turboo934]

Find an early 930 and your 80% there.Fifteen years ago it cost 60K to build a RS look car,today it could cost triple that. The Viper Green one is a slamin deal.

[unclebilly]

WORD TO THE WISE... STAY AWAY FROM MOTOR MEISTER

the *inocence* of your initial post lead me to giving this advice.

Why not build a 2.7RS engine? You can do this fairly inexpensively.

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by NavySailor47

Can the 3.0 SC Bolt up to the Transmission in my car?

yes - may need some clutch mods

[racer_X]

Hi I am a new 911S owner- I just bought a 1977 with 139k, with a mint interior, good older original color respray, perfect condition Fuchs, and a nice pulling 2.7 for 7K. Everything works on the car including the sun roof, windows and electric antenna. I have the full history including the rebuild at 81k that upgraded the studs to dilavars, the cooling fan to the 11 blade, then at 121k the tensioners were replaced with oil tensioners.
Other than the points closing up on me on the way back from Lime Rock race park this weekend, and using 7 sheets of a 1981 road and track magazine to set the gap- it has been flawless.
The question in my mind with this "unwanted" 2.7 911 is what are the upgrades that will get me to a carrera 2.7 or 911R in power or should I just look for a 3.2 and put the motor on a stand for resale with the car when I am ready to sell? I am interested in maybe doing some track days.

[Steve@Rennsport]

Originally Posted by regency

NS47, the best advise i can give you is to research everybody / everything. There's a lot of scammers out there waiting for someone like you ( new to Porsche restoration ), and will promise you the world ( engine rebuild ) for cheap.

If i could start over on my project ( 911 resto start 2005 ), and knowing what I know now, I would go to the best builder out there with the best, reputation. Period.

you can go to all the ass holes that say they can do it faster & cheaper and they're all FULL OF *****.

Pay to have a real pro do it right. Or, pay half the price, get a ***** engine that leaks, makes no oil pressure and a million dumb ass excuses from the dumb ass so called builder.

my 2 cents

That is positively stellar advice.

[TRE Cup]

racer_x: go buy a 3.2

[Duckworth]

Originally Posted by NavySailor47

Well call me crazy, but I have fallen in love with the RSR. It's just so beautiful...

I understand what the RSR represents to you... They have a certain charisma all their own. Just raising the possibility of falling out of love with it in favor of something that may return you more enjoyment in the long run.

Navysailor, just shootin' the bull a bit with you. Consider - hoards of 911 enthusiasts are swayed by the flared fenders of an RSR - myself being no exception. Many times I woke up in in bed saying, "I GOT to have an RSR..."




..It took me a good while to evolve out of that mindset. But then I started noticing on Pelican - some of the outstanding early cars like this one :





It has some of the 'feel' of an RSR - without all the sheetmetal work required.


Best wishes to you sir !


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