3.6 Varioram Conversion Performance Specs?

[spsfiend]

Thanks everyone for the feedback!! Really appreciate it!

Can someone give me a rough idea of the major maintenance that needs to be done on a 3.6 engine? I thought I read that they normally require a top end rebuild around 70-90K. Can someone confirm that? I just want to know what to expect once I get a 3.6 engine what I will need to prepare for by way of maintenance. I believe LA dismantalers sells the 3.6 with about 40k miles for about 8K?

Doug? Is that the Doug I bought the heater control from here in Encinitas??!!? LOL This is Gerry from Carlsbad. Ha ha

[aigel]

I don't think the 993 needs a top end at that mileage more than a Carrera 3.2.

George

[DW SD]

Gerry,
Indeed it is me. I'd propose buying one from a private party, in the car that you can do a PPI on or someone local through PCA. OR maybe a guy like Mark Kinninger (Black Forrest) or Jae Lee (Mirage International). They run shops that value their reputation, but also sell a lot of parts on the side. I bought a 3.6 that was supposedly rebuilt and it had no compression. I had to pay to rebuild it beyond the purchase price, which was quite expensive.

Like the dog - pound who represents that all full-sized dogs are two or three year olds (when they may really be nine year olds ), I'm afraid LA Porsche Dismantler may suggest all their engines are at about 40k miles. LAPD tried to sell me some pistons and cylinders that were supposed great, nearly new and weren't even close to as described.

We can discuss when we meet up.

Doug

[efhughes3]

Doug's advice is good. As I stated above in my post, the 3.6 conversion can get really expensive if you need to get into it. That is one plus of building a 3.4 or 3.5 from scratch. I talked to someone the other day that got the same surprise on a 3.6 conversion-sounds like the tab ended up being $25K when all said and done.

[5.7 GT1]

Does anyone know how much tire is needed in the rear for this conversion on good z rated radials?
What type of brake upgrade is recommended to mach the HP?

What size torsion bars needed in the rear for the heavier 3.6 vram for more bearable street driving with occasional track use in mind?

[Buckterrier]

I can't tell you how much is needed but I can tell you what I have at it all works really well.
255/40/17's in the rear. They are Z rated. I run 27mm bars in the back. I've upgraded to 930 brakes .

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by 5.7 GT1

Does anyone know how much tire is needed in the rear for this conversion on good z rated radials?
What type of brake upgrade is recommended to mach the HP?

What size torsion bars needed in the rear for the heavier 3.6 vram for more bearable street driving with occasional track use in mind?

For the first few years I ran 205/55//245/45 on 7 & 9x 16 Fuchs, they were fine. For more grip on track I upgraded to 235/40//275/40 on 8 & 9.5x17 Kinesis, these also are fine but a lot of work to fit. Currently 225/45//255/40 on the same 17" Kinesis, this is a great all round combination.

When a 3.6 is stripped down for the usual t/p it is very little heavier than a 3.0 or 3.2. I never felt the need to update t/b or sways from stock Carrera, there will be a lot of body sway on track with stock suspension though.

for street, stock brakes are fine, I used several iterations of bbk, settling on 993RS all around, 930 is the best choice for 15 or 16" wheels and would be fine all around.

What I wouldn't do is team a breathed on 3.6 w/ a 915 unless you are very careful. I have had 2x 3.6 and 1x 3.8RS in mine and found the torque from the 3.8 to be a poor match to a 915. The 915 w/ cooler seems to be very comfortablyy matched to both of the 3.6s I've used.

[CBRacerX]

I did an unscientific test today of 0-60 in my '87. I confirmed the speedo calibration with my SatNav. Used the stopwatch on my iPhone (it was available when the urge struck).

I'm good for consistent 5 second times from a "rolling start 0-60" - essentially I just got the clutch out all the way, let the car get down to 900rpm in 1st and then mash it. I simply do not want to perform an intense jackrabbit start, even with the RSR clutch/PP. So this is a run to 6500 in first and then to 60MPH in 2nd. I have the stock 87 gearing/R&P and 255/40/17 rear tires. My car is heavier than stock thanks to extra oil cooling, amplified stereo, Big Red brakes, 993 Cup wheels and so on.

If I was doing this for a pink slip, a real "LeMans Start" would shave some serious time off.

[Randy W]

Originally Posted by 5.7 GT1

Does anyone know how much tire is needed in the rear for this conversion on good z rated radials?
What type of brake upgrade is recommended to mach the HP?

What size torsion bars needed in the rear for the heavier 3.6 vram for more bearable street driving with occasional track use in mind?

I would recommend a 245 rear tire as a minimum, 225 minimum in the front. A 205 in the front will be inadequate if you drive enthusiastically.

You will want turbo all around or 964 fronts and Carrera rears minimum.

28 rear bar would be the minimum I would recommend.

A later aluminum 915 is fine (as long as you do not abuse it), just make sure you have an LSD and the side cover is a the reinforced type.

[Wilywilly]

Lots of speculation here. Here is the version I'm almost through with:
67 911N
SC Front Suspension complete with steering.brakes, anti-sway bars and bigger torsion bars as well as Koni's and turbo tierods.
94 Porsche Motor-sports longblock 3.6 with Electromotive Crank fire twin plugs, PMO's and Bursch. Front fender mounted Carerra oil cooler with manual switched cooling fan and SC tank.
Rear adj spring plates, SC brakes, weltmeister antsway bar, re-enforced trailing arms and Konis and big torsion bars.
915 Transmission from SC
Wheels / tires Forged Alluminum (10 1/2 pounds each) 951 space saver rims 5 1/2 X 15 with Goodyear Eagle GT 195/65/VR15.
Narrow body, no flairs. Rear fog light. Metalic Silver org color, h4's.
Interior RS carpet set over dynamat, GTS Classics Sport Seats, Black Headliner Vintage roll bar, 6 pt harness and full SC instrumentation. Waiting on some custom made driveshafts, should be sometime this month. Had a couple of threads going on. Don't know, don't care what the 0-60 or 1/4 mile is or will be. Just know that it's gonna to a bad ass damn fast car.

[img]http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads16
/At+Franzs+on+12+30+091265073715.jpg[/img]

[jac1976]

Goose that thing and that "rear" fog light may become a "front" fog light.

[Dolphin911]

I cant tell you the 0-60. But i ran 13.3 with my 86 911 with a 993 varioram and a G50.

[-Levi-]

Bump- anyone else do the swap care to chime in? Bringing thus thread back from the dead

[gliding_serpent]

0-60 times are not very useful as they will depend on the clutch, gear/final drive ratios, weight of the car, tune of the engine, and tire choices.

Now, in my mind, power to weight ratios are more informative. A local 300hp varioram 3.6sc that is 2400lbs has 8 lbs per hp. A nissan gtr has 7:1. A 991 911s about 7.8:1. A 3.2 stock is about 13:1. My slightly hot, and lightened 1984 carrera with a mildly hot 3.4 will be about 8.3:1 (2300lbs, 275hp)

[Duc Hunter]

I have a nice 3.2 (stock) that just got a top end. I also have a rickety-a$$ 3.6 conversion in a 75 steel widely with a 915 that I am trying to bring back to life. With a Steve Wong chip, headers and exhaust on the 3.6, even with it still not running quite right (esp on the top end) the 3.6 is MUCH faster to the butt dyno. Like substantially! Keep in mind a 3.6 makes more torque from about 3,500-redline than a 3.2 does at its peak. This, combine with the low weight of a 75 converted car, will make is quick for sure, and it should feel even quicker than it is.

Drag racers always say 10lbs=1hp in the quarter mile. Now to go deep into theory.....my 996 turbo's curb weight is 3,395lbs, and my 75 3.6 is right around 2,370lbs. That 1,025lbs translates to 102hp...meaning the 75 can have 102hp less than the turbo and in theory be as quick 0-60 and quarter mile. At 420hp for the turbo, the 75 can be at 318hp. Steve Wong's website shows 964 3.6's (which mine is) with sport cats, sport mufflers right around 295HP on 91 octane. I live in Florida where I have a 93 octane chip in mine, and I have headers, not a sport cat...which means I should have a little more power than the cars on SW's site.....so my MATH says my turbo and my conversion would be very close (minus the AWD in the turbo).

As for driving experience......to me the air-cooled cars win, and the earlier ones the better. To me a 993 has a lot of 996'esq qualities (weight, suspension refinement, high quality interior, etc). With the cars in my quiver, the turbo rarely gets driven simply because it is a far more modern feeling car. It was my first, and yet it feels the least like a "Porsche" to me. I have realized I like the experience of closing my eyes (insert closed course, professional driver clause here) and hear/smell/feel what the racers in the 70's felt at LeMans, or Spa.....and that is the earlier air-cooled cars for sure. Also consider 993's are going up in value (have been for a while). I did not want to cut up a "good car" to make my project. Instead I found a converted car others struggled to finish. Then I am resurrecting/saving a car, vs cutting up a good one.

Good luck! Good news is al of your options will be great cars.