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-   -   How to Reduce 2 in 2 out muffler drone? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/531951-how-reduce-2-2-out-muffler-drone.html)

dw1 03-21-2010 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavey (Post 5249073)
Mine's a 1-in / 2-out and has the same issue.

My '87 3.2 has a Fabspeed euro-style premuffler & Dansk 1-in-2-out (84mm outlet pipes) with the outlets on the corners, not together below the rear license plate.

I doesn't drone, but above 3200 rpm it is too loud for relaxed highway cruising with the windows & sunroof open, IMHO.

Sure, I use earplugs (the partial attenuating kind, so I can still hear horns, sirens, etc.), but that's not a great solution for non-track use. More importantly, the exhaust volume can draw undesirable attention (i.e. the attention of those who "protect and serve") exactly when I don't want it.

I tried baffles, without success. In fact, those gave me a "drone" when I didn't have it before.

I'm looking at different ways to conveniently put a butterfly valve or cap in/on one side, for occasional use.

The blockoffs posted by Wavey look like a good approach, combined with a remote cable actuator (like the muffler cutouts on my old '67 Camaro, back in the day). I just have to find a good spot in the curved Dansk outlet pipes.

-Dan
-----------------------------------------------
black/black '87 sunroof coupe, f/r spoilers, fabspeed, dansk, sw chip, euro ride height, mod rear bumper, CDR220, etc.

efhughes3 03-21-2010 05:36 PM

On the question of horsepower, I once ran my cap on one side of my flowmaster on the dyno, and then uncapped for the other pulls. The cap cost 7 HP.

Wavey 03-22-2010 05:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Garfield (Post 5249383)
Reducing the size of the outlet pipes from the muffler definitely helps. There was a thread 5 - 6 years ago by Jack Olsen that came to this conclusion about solving the 2k - 3k drone. Make your exhaust tips 2 - 2.25" and your problems will disappear.

Tried that (see post above), a bit quieter but no difference in droning.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dw1 (Post 5249621)
I'm looking at different ways to conveniently put a butterfly valve or cap in/on one side, for occasional use. The blockoffs posted by Wavey look like a good approach, combined with a remote cable actuator (like the muffler cutouts on my old '67 Camaro, back in the day). I just have to find a good spot in the curved Dansk outlet pipes. -Dan
.

Or the electronic version. Have one, thinkin' about it!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1269265184.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by efhughes3 (Post 5249719)
On the question of horsepower, I once ran my cap on one side of my flowmaster on the dyno, and then uncapped for the other pulls. The cap cost 7 HP.

Thanks Ed - I'll check that at the next dyno session, after I get my a/f straightened out.

berettafan 03-22-2010 05:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavey (Post 5247299)
I said "almost" all 2-outs drone, and I stand by that. But whatever:D

You weren't the only person to opine on the subject spanky.

SmileWavy

Wavey 03-22-2010 06:03 AM

Got it, Buckwheat:D

dw1 03-22-2010 07:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wavey (Post 5250434)
Or the electronic version. Have one, thinkin' about it!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1269265184.jpg

Wavey - Can you suggest a source for that butterfly valve?

BTW, I agree that almost all 2-outs drone, at least based on most that I've heard.

I think my 2-out is unusual in that it doesn't drone, perhaps because of the location (corners, not center) and shape (kind of an "S" curve) of the outlet pipes on this style of Dansk muffler. Perhaps the outlet pipes being "angle cut" at the ends, not straight cut, (which is a feature of this Dansk muffler) even has an acoustic effect.

This also means it has more of a "muscle car" sound at idle & low rpm's. Sounds ok, but not as suitable to a 911 as I would like. I've even had people ask if it had a V8 engine transplant! [shudder] [cringe]

-Dan
-----------------------------------------------
black/black '87 sunroof coupe, f/r spoilers, fabspeed, dansk, sw chip, euro ride height, mod rear bumper, CDR220, etc.

berettafan 03-22-2010 07:25 AM

Otay;)

Wavey 03-22-2010 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dw1 (Post 5250641)
Wavey - Can you suggest a source for that butterfly valve?

Quick Time Performance
23 Birch Street
Building A
Midland Park, NJ 07432
201-444-0998
QTP »

About $150 a couple of year ago. Come in several diameters.

RWebb 03-22-2010 09:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by efhughes3 (Post 5249719)
On the question of horsepower, I once ran my cap on one side of my flowmaster on the dyno, and then uncapped for the other pulls. The cap cost 7 HP.

Ed - was the engine out, or was that a road dyno?

I ask b/c the dual cowhorn style mufflers don't "add any hp" relative to the stock single outlet mufflers. For years, I've been thinking I might cap the RH side of my Monty, tho I've never gotten around to it (mainly b/c I don't drive much on the fwy).

I'm thinking that the internal construction of various muffler brands might differ, and perhaps cause the differences in relative hp...

efhughes3 03-22-2010 10:12 AM

It was a chassis or road dyno. I run B&B headers to the muffler.

RWebb 03-22-2010 11:55 AM

Thx - I wouldn't be surprised at 7 hp variation run to run on the same motor...

OTOH, if anyone knows what the guts of a Monty look like or has more info...

efhughes3 03-22-2010 12:23 PM

I think the tq was even more. The others were all pretty close-we thought it looked like the cap made a difference.

Jim Garfield 03-22-2010 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tobluforu (Post 5249523)
Mine are 2 inch and it still drones.

I guess I should have said my problems disappeared. ;)

mb911 03-23-2010 03:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tobluforu (Post 5249523)
Mine are 2 inch and it still drones, and at certain rpms it will set some car alarms off. I read that someone wrapped their muffler with high heat header tape and it helped alot, but what a hassle that would be.

cappng 1 tail pipe and the problem does go away. It is simply a harmonics issue with a dual outlet . single outlets have zero drone

WPOZZZ 03-23-2010 03:50 AM

You could always try these, but they are pricey! Dynatech 72-32520 - Dynatech Vortex Insert Cones - Overview - SummitRacing.com

A friend tied 4 stainless pot scrubbers and fastened them inside his dual out and they supposedly reduced the resonance.

tobluforu 03-23-2010 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mb911 (Post 5252438)
cappng 1 tail pipe and the problem does go away. It is simply a harmonics issue with a dual outlet . single outlets have zero drone

Understood, but I would rather live with the drone (don't drive car much), then live with the look of a muffler with a cap on it.
Do the org. sport mufflers drone?

rfloz 03-23-2010 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WPOZZZ (Post 5252465)
You could always try these, but they are pricey! Dynatech 72-32520 - Dynatech Vortex Insert Cones - Overview - SummitRacing.com

A friend tied 4 stainless pot scrubbers and fastened them inside his dual out and they supposedly reduced the resonance.

Unfortunately, 3" seems to be the smallest diameter they make. My pipes, e.g., are 2 1/2".:(

GaryR 03-23-2010 09:49 AM

How about if the two pipes, in GT3 Cup configuration (next to each other, straight out the center) were attached to the muffler using a "collector" of sorts, so the exhaust was all dumping out one hole and just split with the pipes? Has that been tried?

Canada Kev 03-23-2010 09:55 AM

In that same idea, does the GT3 drone? If not, why?

Wavey 03-23-2010 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GaryR (Post 5253025)
How about if the two pipes, in GT3 Cup configuration (next to each other, straight out the center) were attached to the muffler using a "collector" of sorts, so the exhaust was all dumping out one hole and just split with the pipes? Has that been tried?

THAT is a great idea! Maybe 2.75" to 3" at the muffler, split to a couple of 2.25" or 2.5"?


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