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Member 911 Anonymous
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Napa Gold 1283 Disected, Better Filtration = HIGHER OPERATING TEMPS???
Hey all,
This is a very unscientific observation/analysis of the NAPA GOLD 1283 Oil Filter made by Wix. It is advertised as having a "higher filtration" system, capturing smaller microns of debris compared to the OEM/Mahle Filters our baby's use. Car: 3.2 K&N Inverted Cone Filter Valvoline VR1 (Dino) Racing Oil 20W50 ( previously had Brad Penn, flushed with VR1 once before test) Napa Gold 1283 Installed 3 months ago Valvoline VR1 20W50 (noticed Higher Temps during normal driving, only change was brand of oil and filter) Mahle Changed 2/1/2011 Valvoline VR1 20W50 (Magnet had very little shavings attached to it, the least I've observed even with BP & Mahel Filter) (Running temps are lower but ambient temps have been a bit cooler lately, I am sure that is a factor) Will report temps and magnet findings in 3 months/3K miles QUESTION: Can a higher filtration be a bad thing ie. lower oil flow causing a hotter running temps? Click the pics to play the Video, please forgive the quality I am an amateur: Part1 Intro  Part2 Opened  Jim 
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'85 Carrera Targa Factory Marble Grey/Black * Turbo Tail * 930 Steering Wheel* Sport Seats * 17" Fuchs (r) * 3.4 * 964 Cams * 915 * LSD * Factory SS * Turbo Tie Rods * Bilsteins * Euro Pre-Muff * SW Chip on 4K DME * NGK * Sienes GSK * Targa Body Brace PCA/POC Last edited by DRACO A5OG; 02-02-2011 at 07:59 PM.. |
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02-02-2011, 05:56 PM
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Member 911 Anonymous
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Space for Mahle Filter Comparison
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'85 Carrera Targa Factory Marble Grey/Black * Turbo Tail * 930 Steering Wheel* Sport Seats * 17" Fuchs (r) * 3.4 * 964 Cams * 915 * LSD * Factory SS * Turbo Tie Rods * Bilsteins * Euro Pre-Muff * SW Chip on 4K DME * NGK * Sienes GSK * Targa Body Brace PCA/POC Last edited by DRACO A5OG; 02-02-2011 at 07:57 PM.. Reason: spell checked |
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02-02-2011, 07:29 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 3,384
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Mahle.
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02-02-2011, 07:45 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 3,384
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And no. Your filter did not raise the temperature. Neither did you oil. The higher temperatures raised your temperature.
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02-02-2011, 07:46 PM
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Member 911 Anonymous
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Thanks for the spell check
 Strange with BP it appeared to run cooler 3-4 month's ago and then when I switched to VR1 it got hotter driving the same route and same ambient temps.
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'85 Carrera Targa Factory Marble Grey/Black * Turbo Tail * 930 Steering Wheel* Sport Seats * 17" Fuchs (r) * 3.4 * 964 Cams * 915 * LSD * Factory SS * Turbo Tie Rods * Bilsteins * Euro Pre-Muff * SW Chip on 4K DME * NGK * Sienes GSK * Targa Body Brace PCA/POC |
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02-02-2011, 08:01 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Montmorenci, SC
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Your oil filter should not cause an increase in oil temp.. However, there is a big difference in oil filters.. I and my students have cut most of the 'name' brands and some of the el cheapos apart.. You'd be amazed at the differences.. Your Napa/Wix is a very good filter. Of course Mahle is the filter of choice for most P-Car owners.. I use Wix filters on all my vehicles and occasionally pull one apart to 'see' what's inside.. I have never had any oil related failures with any of my vehicles.. Oil.. Take your choice.. There's as many opinions on that as there are Pelicans... Above all, make sure you use the correct weight of oil..
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70 911T Sold  81 911SC Coupe84 Mustang Turbo GT 66 Galaxy 500 Ragtop (my Mother bought it new) 88 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe 69 Torino Cobra (R) Code Last edited by Neel; 02-02-2011 at 10:11 PM.. Reason: wording |
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02-02-2011, 10:09 PM
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Join Date: May 2008
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I use napa oil filters on other cars and I've noticed metal debris around the top of the new filters from the manufacturing process, I have to clean them before using. The Mahle filters are much cleaner.
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02-02-2011, 10:55 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
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Check your filter to be sure there is a bypass built into it so that cold oil can go around it if necessary. "Finer" mesh in the filter means more work to get the oil thru it. THe Canton Mecca filter does among the best filtering jobs you can buy... but beware running it with a cold motor... there is no bypass. I'm going back to the Mahle (with bypass.) Take a look at this...
Oil pressure problems; Canton Mecca
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jhtaylor santa barbara 74 911 coupe. 2.7 motor by Schneider Auto Santa Barbara. Case blueprinted, shuffle-pinned, boat-tailed by Competition Engineering. Elgin mod-S cams. J&E 9.5's. PMO's. 73 Targa (gone but not forgotten) |
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02-03-2011, 06:24 AM
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Northern, CA
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Oil Flow
Anything that reduces the flow of oil through an engine has the potential to increase oil temps. Whether it be a restriction, mechanical problem, or filter problem. When you reduce flow you can raise oil temps.
I've heard of racers going from a higher viscosity oil to a lower viscosity oil and lowering their oil temps because they increased the oil flow rate. I'm not saying that's what happened with the switch from Mahle to Napa. Just saying that it's possible if there was a substantial flow difference. Let's have the experts chime in! |
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02-03-2011, 08:19 AM
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Member 911 Anonymous
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Well, I thought the Napa had the by-pass valve??? Isn't that what the rubber gasket and spring is for?
In any case, I am watching my oil temp guage very closely with the Mahle Filter and VR1, waiting for a temperate ambient temps (70 degrees) as when I had the Napa with VR1 when the oil temp hit 9:00 o clock on the guage on the free way at 65-70 MPH for 20 minutes. I have to agree with logic that reduced flow will increase oil temps. Unless experts tell otherwise, (Prof Neel, you and your students didn't have to do a flow test with the filters, did yeah?) here is my humble deduction: Higher Filteration = Less Dirt & Debris = Reduced Flow = Higher Oil Temps = Shorter Oil Viscocity Life = Harm to Engine vs. OEM Spec Filtration = OEM Dirt & Debris = OEM FLOW = NORMAL RUNNING TEMPS = Spec Wear & Tear to Engine Geeeeez my attempt to be smart, sorry.
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'85 Carrera Targa Factory Marble Grey/Black * Turbo Tail * 930 Steering Wheel* Sport Seats * 17" Fuchs (r) * 3.4 * 964 Cams * 915 * LSD * Factory SS * Turbo Tie Rods * Bilsteins * Euro Pre-Muff * SW Chip on 4K DME * NGK * Sienes GSK * Targa Body Brace PCA/POC |
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02-03-2011, 10:39 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: So. Cal.
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I can't speak for other years, but if you look down the throat of my 72 oil filler neck there is so much oil splashing around inside that tank I would be very surprised that the filter slows down circulation much.
Just my opinion - not a professional.
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David 1972 911T/S MFI Survivor |
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02-03-2011, 10:55 AM
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Location: Montmorenci, SC
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No, we didn't check flow rates of the filters.. I would think that 'premium' filters would not reduce oil flow.. By premium, I mean Wix, Mahle, K&N, Mobile One, Napa Gold(Wix) etc.. all of which have anti-drainback valves and bypass valves or a combination valve..
Your 'humble deduction' sounds good in theory.. IMO, I believe these 'premium' filters would not reduce flow rate or increase oil temps, again opinion, I don't have stats to back it up.. To satisfy your curiosity (and MINE), I would suggest you change the filter only and try your test again.. Let me know your results.. You've got me interested.. I'd do the same on my P-Car, but I'm doing some upgrades and can't drive it right now.. "Inquiring minds want to know"...
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70 911T Sold 81 911SC Coupe84 Mustang Turbo GT 66 Galaxy 500 Ragtop (my Mother bought it new) 88 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe 69 Torino Cobra (R) Code Last edited by Neel; 02-03-2011 at 02:02 PM.. Reason: wording |
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02-03-2011, 01:14 PM
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muck-raker
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Coastal PNW
Posts: 3,059
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Hey Jim,
just get a Cool Collar and be done with it.  Honestly dude, Frankenstein spent less time with his "creation" than you do with your ride, lol!!! BTW...thanks for the help with the chip. Plugged up another air leak. Gets a little better every time.
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STONE '88 Cabriolet, using EP Slick 20w50 partial synthetic Snake Oil...just as Rommel intended.  Deny Everything; Admit Nothing; and Always Make Counter-accusations 
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02-03-2011, 01:29 PM
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Northern, CA
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Oil Flow Part 2
I agree in principle with Prof Neel. A quality filter should not reduce flow enough to change oil temps significantly. My real curiosity is whether there might be a fault in that particular filter that caused a flow problem. Manufacturing techniques being what they are, @#$^% happens.
When you replace the filter why don't you dissect it for a quick look. |
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02-03-2011, 04:18 PM
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Member 911 Anonymous
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Hey Hey Kidrock!
LOL, yeah what the heck is wrong with me??? I just want to make certain the filter or oil is not the culprit of higher oil temps. Most have ruled out the oil, only a few renegades pointed towards the oil but vets insist it can't be the oil. Never heard of a filter effecting the oil temps but logic dictates low flow would result in higher oil temps i.e. crushed brass oil lines??? Anyways, will know as soon it get a bit warmer in SoCali.
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'85 Carrera Targa Factory Marble Grey/Black * Turbo Tail * 930 Steering Wheel* Sport Seats * 17" Fuchs (r) * 3.4 * 964 Cams * 915 * LSD * Factory SS * Turbo Tie Rods * Bilsteins * Euro Pre-Muff * SW Chip on 4K DME * NGK * Sienes GSK * Targa Body Brace PCA/POC |
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02-03-2011, 04:20 PM
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Northern, CA
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Oops!
Sorry. Before the arrows start, I admit I missed the first pics of the dissected filter.
Me bad.... |
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02-03-2011, 04:21 PM
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Member 911 Anonymous
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No problem, I plan to dissect the Mahle Filter for a side by side comparison focusing on the valve/spring and Filter. This time a pic of the magnet as well.
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'85 Carrera Targa Factory Marble Grey/Black * Turbo Tail * 930 Steering Wheel* Sport Seats * 17" Fuchs (r) * 3.4 * 964 Cams * 915 * LSD * Factory SS * Turbo Tie Rods * Bilsteins * Euro Pre-Muff * SW Chip on 4K DME * NGK * Sienes GSK * Targa Body Brace PCA/POC |
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02-03-2011, 04:24 PM
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Registered
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Montmorenci, SC
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Quote:
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70 911T Sold 81 911SC Coupe84 Mustang Turbo GT 66 Galaxy 500 Ragtop (my Mother bought it new) 88 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe 69 Torino Cobra (R) Code |
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02-03-2011, 04:32 PM
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Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 3,346
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Since the 911 has a dry sump system, a more restrictive filter will simply increase the pressure on the scavenge pump. It will not have any effect on the oil flow through the engine unless the tank runs dry! If the tank runs dry you will have much more to deal with than higher temps.
-Andy
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72 Carrera RS replica, Spec 911 racer |
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02-03-2011, 04:54 PM
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Member 911 Anonymous
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From Wix site:
Part Number: 51283 UPC Number: 765809512832 Principal Application: Porsche (71-93) All Applications Style: Spin-On Lube Filter Service: Lube Type: Full Flow Media: Paper Height: 5.879 Outer Diameter Top: 3.663 Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed Thread Size: 1-12 By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 28-30 (Am I reading correctly here, it takes more pressure to activate the by-pass valve?) Anti-Drain Back Valve: Yes Burst Pressure-PSI: 365 Max Flow Rate: 12-16 GPM Nominal Micron Rating: 21 Gasket Diameters Number O.D. I.D. Thk. Attached 2.834 2.462 0.255 VS. Mahle Specs per Wix Part Number: 51774 UPC Number: 765809517745 Principal Application: Ford Tractors & Wheel Loaders All Applications Style: Spin-On Lube Filter Service: Lube Type: Full Flow Media: Paper Height: 5.205 Outer Diameter Top: 4.282 Outer Diameter Bottom: Closed Thread Size: 1-12 By-Pass Valve Setting-PSI: 18-22 Burst Pressure-PSI: 430 Max Flow Rate: 10-12 GPM Nominal Micron Rating: 32 Gasket Diameters Number O.D. I.D. Thk. Attached 2.834 2.462 0.200 Image from Mahle: Looks very Similar to the Napa Gold 1283 
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'85 Carrera Targa Factory Marble Grey/Black * Turbo Tail * 930 Steering Wheel* Sport Seats * 17" Fuchs (r) * 3.4 * 964 Cams * 915 * LSD * Factory SS * Turbo Tie Rods * Bilsteins * Euro Pre-Muff * SW Chip on 4K DME * NGK * Sienes GSK * Targa Body Brace PCA/POC |
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02-03-2011, 04:59 PM
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Marble Grey
