996 LS V8 Conversion

[LvSteveH]

Thanks for all the positive comments. In the last few years or so I've had a 3.6L SC conversion, a stock SC, a couple 914-6's, 914-4's, etc. Loved them all and still have over 10 at last count. I do occasionally lose count. I'm not bragging because it's more of an affliction than anything to be proud of. How I'm still married I'll never know.

The point is that I understand the objections from the purists. Putting an older SBC into a 911 or 914 is a significant departure from the typical 4 cyl or small displacement six that comes out. A proper SBC conversion can be a really nice, fun, fast car but there will always be a group that thinks it's decidedly un-porsche-like. Fair enough.

The LS is different. Honestly you can't fully appreciate one of the LS powered cars until you drive or at least ride in them. There's no sense of impropriety. If a porsche engineer brought an LS powered 911 to be evaluated for production it would have been a real consideration (barring the fact that the engine came out of a corvette of course). An older 911 or 914 can actually improve drivability, fuel economy, emissions, and of course performance. It doesn't seem out of place.

I took a 335hp 914 for a ride with a prospective customer who's a very conservative banker. He was very disappointed. What was all the fuss about... it drove around like stock. I was trying to make the point that when shifted below 3000 rpms it was very streetable, got 25 mpg, and could be a daily driver. Of course once the point was made I unleashed a few more horses and he was blown away. He ultimately went on to build one of the nicest 914's you'll ever see. 50k original miles, AC, etc.... and 400hp. He daily drives it something like 75 miles and averaged 24mpg on a recent road trip. There are plenty of 914-4's that can't do that.

With the 996 it's not really a departure at all. Honestly if you took your 996 to a porsche shop to have the stock engine repaired or replaced and they gave you a ride in this without disclosing that it was a conversion you might think that the stock engine giving up the ghost was the best thing that ever happened to you.

I try to look at a car for what it is.... not what it was born as. That's good advice for people as well as cars I suppose. Balance, refinement, drivability, fun-factor, cost, reliability, etc etc should all be scrutinized. In fact, there's a whole industry that does just that. Look at Top Gear, that's what it's all about. If you close your eyes you can just here Jeremy saying, "It's not a porsche.... it's better!!!!". It's really Richards's opinion that would be interesting to hear given his 911 love. It would be very hard not to think it's better from an objective standpoint.

Sorry this has gotten a bit long, I need to get out to work on my car! Emissions will vary by state, but it should be very straight forward. This thing runs so clean one of the mechanics and I were having a conversation by the lift only to realize a few minutes into it that I was standing in front of the right exhaust tip and he was standing in front of the left while the car was running.

The 997 should be similar, but as mentioned due to the cost we really haven't looked down that road yet. The boxster will be a lot of fun too. Anyone who's been in a nice high HP 914 knows how much fun it is to mess with people, the boxster will be a blast.

One of our local GT3 racers was ready to purchase a newer GT3 with a blow motor to put an LS7 in after seeing a 911 Targa we're almost done with. I'll post that some time in the near future. 600hp and it could sneak into most Porsche events under the radar. A 3.2L with a sport muffler had a more aggressive exhaust note!

One last thing in terms of proof of concept, RUF recently came out with a V8 water cooled 911..... who'd a thunk RUF RGT-8 video

[LvSteveH]

The car pictured is an AWD C4, works great. The traction control works too. We had to pull the fuse to get the car loose for the performance shots, so it should work great in the snow.

This is a very high mileage car and the trans is holding up extremely well by the way.

Regarding the engine in the 996, it is a standard wet sump running the stock GM oil pan. We've got national level road racers running wet sump LS motors with our custom pan and doing very well, even without an accusump. Obviously there's a point where going full drysump makes sense but you can do an awful lot without it. I think it's best suited for when you have a $15k+ engine and need it for insurance on the track to protect the investment. When you can run a used $2000 LS motor for a full season of road racing it's hard to argue the need.

Originally Posted by exc911ence

I think this makes a lot of sense. I was never a believer of V8 conversions of air-cooled 911's but the 996 is a different breed. Water-cooled for water-cooled, no reinventing the wheel adding radiators to a car that was never designed to take them, and replacing a troublesome engine with one with impeccable reliability and possibly less weight (aluminum block).

As mentioned above, I'd love a 996 for a daily driver too but their reputation has kept me away. I think driving one of these to work and back would make my commute much more interesting and enjoyable. Can you convert a Carrera 4? Need the AWD for Ottawa's winters.

[exc911ence]

Originally Posted by mnewport

The 996 in the OP's video link IS a C4.

Didn't get to see the video, work computer has no video card.

Good news that the AWD remains functional!

[tcar]

I'm impressed that you're able to keep the original decklid...

I've seen conversions that had to have a turbo wing for clearance.

Weight difference? I didn't see it.

[Joe Bob]

Scott claims in the video that the weight difference is negligible. The accessories are mounted below as opposed to above on the flat six.

[exc911ence]

Can't find a price for the 996 conversion, but then computers never were my specialty.

[shanghai_todd]

I just completed an LS2 conversion in my 911 and seeing this swap in a 996 has spiked my interest. RH kicks Ass..

[vracer]

I'm a purist, but I appreciate the fact that the Porsche 'Family' encourages "wayward kids". The law of cubic inches has not been repealed.

[Elombard]

Did you look at a cayenne motor for this? Or would that screw up the cost/benefit? Very cool - for some reason I accept this in a 996 - not a fan in the ari cooled cars.

[ej911]

I know that Renegade was working on this, I am glad we finally get to see the finished product. Personally, I would take a 997 Carrera 3.6 and Put in a LS7 and add factory GT3 body parts and wheels. I would be interested in what it would take to keep the dry-sump.

Or lets see the Boxster, even a peak would be fine!!!

[exc911ence]

Originally Posted by Elombard

Did you look at a cayenne motor for this? Or would that screw up the cost/benefit? Very cool - for some reason I accept this in a 996 - not a fan in the ari cooled cars.

Cayenne motor would screw up the reliability benefit. Who needs leaking coolant pipes and drowning starter motors in the back of their 996?

[Outlaw 911]

The Cayenne has huge & heavy, DOHC cylinder heads - that sit way up high - putting that in place of the LS based engine would not be good.

The Grand Am guys that run the Cayenne V8 really complained about being at a competitive disadvantage over the pushrod V8 engines because too much of the weight was up high.

I will agree that 4V DOHC cylinder heads are techically better than a 2V pushrod cylinder heads - but if you factor in power output (hp/ft lbs) vs weight and weight distribution/placement - not much can beat the LS based engines.

Don't get me wrong - love the 911 engine - I have 4, but the LS based engines are a true work of art. They are very very compact, powerful, bullet proof, make power every where. GM does somethings very well and is getting better every year. This engine is one of the best things they have produced, period.

[SinCityCarrera]

Hey Steve why dont you put up some pics of that insane Targa you had down at 900 Series (Carl's) we could from 2 miles away???

[Geronimo '74]

Originally Posted by not_hans_stuck

+1 I'd love to see a 997 GT3 RS converted. It'd be like a RUF. You could also use this Chevy Engine:

A 997 GT3 RS??? Blasphemy, that's what that would be.

[Wil Ferch]

I don't think many here appreciate the design elegance and simplicity of a Chevy V-8. Especially those that ask what about a Porsche V-8. Look at a decades-old Car & Driver magazine article where they voted the Chevy V-8 ( and of course, our 911 flat-six) amongst the worlds 10 best ever engines.

I am reminded that even the 928 was larger, heavier, and had "reverse-oiling" problems. Seems the mains were fighting centrifugal force whereas had it been done "like a Chevy"....it wouldn't ... clear "design" advantage of the '55 based Chevy vs the 70's inspired Porsche.

The X Y Z dimensions of a small block are also amazing compared to the bulk/weight of the all-alloy 911 engine. Yet the myth of "large cast-iron hulk" remains....

Amazing..... love Porsches ...but gotta give credit where credit is due. Let's look at this too--> in the mid 60's ( before the 917/30), if you built an "unlimited" racing car like for the first Can-Am series, what did consummate pro's like Bruce Mclaren chose as a power plant to build the world's fastest road-racing cars?....eclipsing even F1 car's lap times?. Chevy ( OK... "big block"). Cheap, reliable, small-for-displacement, powerful.....got the job done.

[lin7310948]

yes those LS7s slip right into the engine compartment...this is a modified ls7 making slightly over 700 chp in my 78 930 weighing less than 2400 pounds. not on the street yet...but soon!

[ej911]

My favorite Porsche of all time is the GT3 RS and I would take one with a LS7 all day long. I would put the 700+ LS7 like lin7310948 has in his 930.

[rs911t]

What about the Cayman?

[ej911]

Cayman, Sure!!!

[Joe Bob]

What about it? It's a six....and too new to have an engine issue outside of warranty.