I make Parallel Flow Micro-Channel Condensers for 911's front and rear

[KelogGes]

Originally Posted by boba

KelogGes,

Since you are entertaining condenser setup other than the rear decklid or flat front location, I would be interested in the possibility of a front condenser which would be located upright in the front center oil cooler location. I think to get enough condenser to only run a front condenser and no rear decklid unit you might need to double the thickness. This could have a pull thru fan to ensure air flow at stop or low speed.

This would look like a front oil cooler only rather that a single core it would have two cores stacked front and rear.

I am including photos of a oil cooler install to give you an idea of the proposed configuration. The dimensions of the oil cooler are 5.5" x 2.25" x 24"

This is not a rush project as it sound like you have some immediate interest in the parts you are developing.]

Hello Bob,

really cool photos and what you are doing :-)

Yes I am just getting my 63-89, 911 condensers off the ground so at least at the moment I am a bit busy .

On another subject I have been thinking for sometime about making Paralleled Flow heat exchanger for OIL COOLERS

However believe I can build basically any size dimensions I want length and width, and also curved for a Paralleled Flow heat exchangers, think about these possibilities.

FYI; perhaps you should not think so much like you are about thickness of a Paralleled Flow heat exchanger being so thick like you probably are for heat exchangers that are made of tube & fin; serpentine, plate & fin, etc !!

The technology of Paralleled Flow heat exchanger coils for almost any purpose is far more efficient than any other heat exchanger technology invented before it in the neighborhood of 30-45 percent, not only that but the size can be maybe 25-35 percent smaller than previous technologies and still attain the approximate efficiency I stated. To not split hairs it greatly beats anything for before and size can be smaller when using as a heat exchanger.

Try thinking outside the box

But it gets better; it can probably also be used as a multi-tank heat exchanger, this means successive tanks working coupled together as one to enhance each one, have smaller overall size and further increase efficiency, plus the components can be further micro-processor controlled (computer)

Example DENSO Manufacturing Michigan, Inc.

Example This is where the world is already quickly going http://www.r744.com/knowledge/papers/files/pdf/pdf_138.pdf

[KelogGes]

currently only has the 2 rear side windows talk about air-cooled air-conditioning hehe he

The marks on the rear left tire are caused by the Finstone family together operated wooden stick brake pad for slowing or stopping

Pebles and BAM-BAM ride in the back

[boba]

How would you determine the size of a micro-channel condenser required for a cabin the size of a 911, operating in the southwest summers (100+ most of the time). It is just my guess that 5.5" x 24" would not be enough. That is why the question regarding stacking 2 front to back. Reduced efficiency at the rear condenser may be a problem, this is what I do not know. The flow could be continuous thru the two entering one and then flow into the second and then exit to the dryer.

[Joeaksa]

Ok,

Have some measurements. These are rough guesses but a start.

Can you get anywhere close to:

10 X 14
10 X 12
11 X 11

Thx,

Joe

[KelogGes]

Originally Posted by boba

How would you determine the size of a micro-channel condenser required for a cabin the size of a 911, operating in the southwest summers (100+ most of the time). It is just my guess that 5.5" x 24" would not be enough. That is why the question regarding stacking 2 front to back. Reduced efficiency at the rear condenser may be a problem, this is what I do not know. The flow could be continuous thru the two entering one and then flow into the second and then exit to the dryer.

Bob very repectfully; I wish to say My products are patent pending; I have been advised by an attorney to not discuss any specifics like you are asking or anything related to the specifics related to engineering aspects of what I am doing.

I make custom A/C Paralelle Flow condensers for for 911 Porsches built from 1963-1989 that are up to 40 percent more efficent then any other condenser you can currently buy on the open market anywhere to my knowledge.

if you want to know more about Paralelle Flow condensers technical aspects read this patent it might help you click here >>HEAT EXCHANGER WITH MICROCHANNEL, PARALLEL FLOW, ALL-ALUMINIUM FLAT TUBE WELDING STRUCTURE AND ITS APPLICATION - Shanghai Oriental MHE Co., Ltd.

Abstract:

HEAT EXCHANGER WITH MICROCHANNEL, PARALLEL FLOW, ALL-ALUMINIUM FLAT TUBE WELDING STRUCTURE AND ITS APPLICATION Document Type and Number:United States Patent Application 20110139420 Kind Code:A1

Abstract:The present invention discloses a heat exchanger with microchannel, parallel flow, all-aluminum flat tube welding structure, wherein the heat exchange part of the heat exchanger is formed by flat tubes composed of extruded thin-wall aluminum profiles in parallel arrangement. Compared to existing technology, the present invention has the following advantages: 1. The heat exchange efficiency of refrigerant and the inner wall of flat tubes is increased by 40%, and the flow resistance of the refrigerant in the heat exchanger is reduced by 40%. 2. The heat exchange efficiency of fins on air side is increased by 40%, and the wind resistance of the heat exchanger on air side is reduced by 40%. 3. The heat exchange performance of the entire heat exchanger is improved by 40%. 4. The refrigerant covered is 40% less than that in the conventional technology. 5. All-aluminum structure features longer service life due to no copper-aluminum potential difference when comparing with copper-aluminum structure. The flat tubes adopted by the present invention are provided with the advantages of resistance to high pressure restricted by the existing refrigerant, compact product structure, light unit weight, short process flow, and high manufacturing reliability and relatively low cost. The present invention also discloses the application of the abovementioned heat exchanger.

[KelogGes]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

Ok,

Have some measurements. These are rough guesses but a start.

Can you get anywhere close to:

10 X 14
10 X 12
11 X 11

Thx,

Joe

which is the width and the hight???

[KelogGes]

I have been talking to Cab the owner of RennAir for several weeks, they contacted me after reading here about my condensers, they do not make condenser and expressed an interest in my PFC’s for their clients.

FYI; When I was having Freon line connection problems with a tube and plate evaporator I had been developing for Porsche that was greatly slowing me down from testing my condensers Cab was very kind and sent me one of Rennair’s 911 Serpentine evaporators and thermal expansion valves, which allowed me to finish my testing temps that I reported here;

To return the favor I am sending them the matched set front and contour rear deck lid condenser, its going on a 911 that one of their special clients who is very excited about my technology. The car has been properly prepared, will get a RennAir Serpentine evaporators, RennAir PRO-COOLER, both my PFC’s, new compressor and a/c lines plus the evap box fully insulated etc.

After the installs it will be fully tested and publish the results here;

I expect this 911 they are prepping to get very cold to say the least due to Rennair's expertise

[khamul02]

What are they doing about the evap blower. Are they now providing a stronger fan motor like other two major players are?

[KelogGes]

Originally Posted by khamul02

What are they doing about the evap blower. Are they now providing a stronger fan motor like other two major players are?

no unfortunately, I asked Cab about this a couple of weeks ago

[ODDJOB UNO]

reid, the phone number YOU wrote(954) 599-5234, which i called TWICE and got a "stacy", does not seem to sell a/c parts.



so bottomline.............ya wanna sell some condensers? like 3 for starters.


because my hot lil grubby hands are dying to burn a VISA/AMEX card this very instant so we can start our a/c projects before we get old and die!


so ya have it in writing,what we are looking for:

(1) front condenser for a 1985 targa oem placement

(1) front condenser for a 1987 cab oem placement

(1) rear condenser that fits in oem placement 1987 cab whale tail



do you have these in stock and avail to ship asap?



AND WHAT IS YOUR correct phone number SO I CAN contact you ?

[KelogGes]

Parallel Flow Condenser Efficiency:

Parallel flow condensers maximize the cooling ability of the refrigerant in two ways.

1.On average, a Parallel Flow condenser is 5/8” to 1” in width and consists of not one tube, but many (commonly 10 to 12 or more) passages per flat micro-channel tube, and from the outside looks like a single tube (« see diagram).

2.Instead of having one giant round tube where at least 75% of the refrigerant is not making contact as it flows through the condenser, a Parallel Flow condenser’s passages are between 1mm and 2mm maximizing refrigerant contact to the outside walls and therefore maximizing heat transfer.

When converting to R-134a refrigerant in a classic car, one of the key components to be addressed is your condenser. The original tube and fin design condensers that were commonly used in classic cars struggle to keep up with the increased pressures brought on by 134a refrigerant. This often leads to warmer vent temperatures and premature component failure. And that’s just not cool!

If you replace the factory tube & fin condenser or other prior technology type of condenser with a parallel flow condenser you will increase your vintage auto’s air conditioning system efficiency by approximately 33%.

The result: cooler vent temperatures, increased fuel economy, component and system life. It will even help with your R12 system if you have not upgraded to R-134a refrigerant!

Here are the chief benefits:

◦Dramatically increases system efficiency.
◦Increased fuel efficiency, due to less engine wear.
◦Ideal for converting to 134a, but also improve systems using the old R12 refrigerant.
◦Clean, attractive appearance.
◦Direct replacement, with no modifications whatsoever to the vehicle.

Stay Cool!

[KelogGes]

My Correct telephone NUMBER IS (954) 599-5235 in Fort Lauderdale, Florida
The number is for my mobile phone, Fort Lauderdale is in the eastern time zone same as New York

I had posted my number correctly a couple of times here but I made a typo that had the last digit of my tele number as a 4 only one time in a privious page and which I have now edited it and corrected after being notified it was incorrect

I would post my email address here publicly; but I dont need a ton of spam from Nigeria Africa the bank fraud capital of the world, so if you would like my email adress feel free to Call me directly or you can send me a private message here.

To let you know I am a bit backed up answering my private messeges here because I have been very busy and it takes a long time to properly write proper message replies; please excuse me if you have written me a private message I will try to answer them as soon as I can find the time; but please know you can always call me directly if you are tired of waiting

Best regards,

Reid

[Joeaksa]

I cannot believe you do not want to get LOADS of emails from Nigeria!!!

I was based there for around two years, flying all over the place and trust me, its a lot worse than most can imagine.

Thanks for the contact info, we will be in touch!

Joe A

[KelogGes]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

I cannot believe you do not want to get LOADS of emails from Nigeria!!!

I was based there for around two years, flying all over the place and trust me, its a lot worse than most can imagine.

Thanks for the contact info, we will be in touch!

Joe A

You have been there and done that (smile)

Looking forward to talking to you Joe;

Besides several other things I do
I am a USCG Licensed Captain on smaller vessels and also a USCG Licensed Chief Engineer for vessels up to 3,000 tons; as well as a professional marine mechanical engineer; Although I usually work on Private Super Motor Yachts, (“Superyacht” and "Large Yacht" refers to very expensive, privately owned yachts which are professionally crewed); I have had several well paying job offers over the years working off the coast of South Africa and Also Nigeria in the offshore oil industry and from this area of the world; so in the past I have thoroughly checked this area of the world getting pretty good info I think how things are and what its like to live & work there, lol and its not for me;

I am also a computer expert and have been online since 1986 and I got to tell you that the majority of the worlds internet driven bank fraud money scams come from Nigeria; so a word to the wise is to always beware of any emails coming from Nigeria or that has any reference to Nigeria in them for any reason and this part of the world over all others!

Ohhh, I bet you have flown to a few oil rigs too

[KelogGes]

Originally Posted by Joeaksa

1985 911 Targa backdated to 72RS with a 3.6 stuffed in back
Joe A

Joe; Look at the bottom right condenser, this is my front PFC; this view should give you a better idea what it looks like in relationship to the rear of this turbo

is your 911 with the later model 1990-91 plus, 3.6 engine a Turbo?

I ask because we had in the shop a 1980something 911 turbo; that had a newer updated 1991 3.6 turbo engine I think it was; installed and I looked at it for a few moments; and it has a much larger intercooler and there is no way my deck lid contour condenser would work with this engine. because when I lifted the deck lid to look at the A/C I thought it had, it was apparent my contour condenser would not work; because the intercooler air intake is so huge and almost touches the deck lid air intake sheet metal almost all of the air hole hole, and the owner I think was using a Griffiths condenser in another place in the body for his A/C sys.

I think my deck lid contour condenser MIGHT work with the orginal earlier turbo engine it had before? But with this more modern 3.6 turbo 91-92etc. engine and its huge intercooler there is no way!

I know in your case you are using an RS deck lid or similar, and now after seeing this car I now understand why it won't work for you I did not understand before

This is the car with the I think 91-92 Turbo engine, the condensers are leaning on it so I could see how they would fit, and what a surprise to learn when I talked to Justin Stokes the engine was from a later year Turbo

[Joeaksa]

Reid,

I used to fly one of the guys who owned about 30% of the oil production and half of the banks in Nigeria. An absolute crook in some areas, but took very good care of us. We were based in Lagos but flew to most of the airports in the country, including where you probably docked, Port Harcourt in the delta, the hub of the oil production facilities. Also the kidnapping capital of that part of the world, its not for the faint of heart. Yes, been to an oil rig or three...

My 911 has a 1992 3.6 in it but its a normal engine, no turbo. The car has a ducktail style spoiler/decklid on it and just no room back there for the original style deck mounted condensor that worked on the car when it was stock.

Wonder if two of the smaller condensors pictured above would be enough to cool a 911? Put one in the original position under the front bumper and a second in one of the wheel-wells? Would have a fan on both of them but also am leaning towards not using R-134 but R-12, which cools a bit better.

BTW, in about two years of flying in Nigeria I made a couple of friends there. Three of them turned out to be pretty nice people and out of those one, only one was a person that I felt that I could really trust. The rest were worthless. BTW, the one that we all felt we could trust and a really nice guy, a gent named John Cooper who was not Nigerian but from Liberia was murdered 15 months ago. Sad to see...

[KelogGes]

After much soul seaching I have finally decided on prices

FYI; I have an ebay listing now that includes both front and rear condensers for the general public I will change as I decide too.

Besides my personal marketing my products will soon be made available to Porsche after market parts world wide distributers, and maybe to specal dealers

Oh Not to forget Pelican Parts, I will offer my products to them too. Pelican is a good company!

I suggest you do not use ebay for my condensers if you want them and you're a registered user here! because if you were registed before today you will not have to pay the ebay listing price and will receive a substantual discount when I verify your registration date here

If you would like to know the specal prices I have decided on for people who are registered users here on or before today Friday 7/29/11
private message me

Ohh I am further thinking of making PFCs for other model Porsches and I might make them? depending on demand

Note: I will soon be offering complete kits including PFC's, evaporator, hoses & connection fittings, reciever dryer, maybe even PRO-COOLERs, etc. etc.

Oh and I almost forgot Justin Stokes@Stokes Automotive a 30 year Porsche repair company will do custom installations & rework for those that would like high quality A/C work & service here in south Florida to Porsche Standards for Excellence and DEMANDS COLD

[hcoles]

Would a kit look something like this?

Request for quote: R12 to R134a
Car: 89 3.2 Coupe
1 - Sanden 507 Compressor
2 - Bracket for Compressor
3 - full barrier hose kit, all seals/etc.
4 - new receiver dryer
5 - better rear condenser (micro channel?)
6 - better front condenser (micro channel?)
7 - over/under pressure switch
8 - correct expansion valve (assume evaporator is good enough)
9 - inline filter(s) to protect expansion valve and/or compressor
10 - mechanical install instructions, will take to shop or your shop for filling if within reasonable driving distance
11 - oil if doesn't come in the compressor
options:
12- new evaporator

Parts are to be bolt up compatible or easy modification, e.g. no front condenser hanging down, fits in the stock space.

What is wrong with this kit? Adds?
I don't want to add condensers e.g. under fenders/etc. I feel like better design condensers available now compared to 25 years ago or more should get the performance needed. Max. dry bulb 103F.

[zippy_gg]

Originally Posted by hcoles

Would a kit look something like this?

Request for quote: R12 to R134a
Car: 89 3.2 Coupe
1 - Sanden 507 Compressor
2 - Bracket for Compressor
3 - full barrier hose kit, all seals/etc.
4 - new receiver dryer
5 - better rear condenser (micro channel?)
6 - better front condenser (micro channel?)
7 - over/under pressure switch
8 - correct expansion valve (assume evaporator is good enough)
9 - inline filter(s) to protect expansion valve and/or compressor
10 - mechanical install instructions, will take to shop or your shop for filling if within reasonable driving distance
11 - oil if doesn't come in the compressor
options:
12- new evaporator

Parts are to be bolt up compatible or easy modification, e.g. no front condenser hanging down, fits in the stock space.

What is wrong with this kit? Adds?
I don't want to add condensers e.g. under fenders/etc. I feel like better design condensers available now compared to 25 years ago or more should get the performance needed. Max. dry bulb 103F.

That what I need also. I have been in contact with the Captain via PM, and in all reality I need more than just the 2 condensers...

[hcoles]

you need more because you don't think two micro channels is not enough condenser performance?