Basic question about jack stands

[jpearson]

This is the first of what I am sure will be many questions I'll have for the forum. I have been lurking awhile but this is my first post.

I recently picked up a 75 911s project car. I don't have a lot of mechanical experience but my plan is to do most of the work on the car myself. The first project will be to overhaul the brakes (rebuild calipers, stainless steel lines, new master cylinder, and rebuild the pedal cluster).

My question may be idiotic but I have never put a car on jack stands before. I have read the chapter in 101 projects about jacking up the car but I am wondering if it is OK to put the 911 on 4 jack stands (so the entire car is off the ground) at once. Is this too unstable? Or does the weight of the care keep it pretty well seated? I don't want to be the subject of the next Darwin awards email.

Thanks in advance for not flaming me too badly.
Josh

[JJ 911SC]

Josh

If this is going to be a long love affair... skip the jacks and buy a lift right away.

I got the jack stands, had a job done at a local shop with disappointing results, bought a lift and never look back. It will pay for itself after a few jobs.

Btw, I was over 50 with no mechanical experience when a got my first/only sport car, she was half my age

[Oh Haha]

No problem at all. I had mine on 4 stands for my engine drops as well as routine maintenance over the years. It is much easier to get under the car when both ends are elevated.

I have 3 sets. 2 medium use, 1 heavy duty, taller ones. I use the HD ones for the rear when I am going to have the car up for more than a day or so. That's only so I have the other set for use on other vehicles if needed.

[plumb4u2]

yes you can use four jack stands at once...I had my car in the air on four all winter doin many projects rear stands should be on torsion bar ends front stands under jack points near front of tub...if you have your owners manual it should show u the jacking points of the car(at least mine does)

take your time jacking up the car and make sure everything is secure and you will be fine

welcome and please post pics of your ride

[timmy2]

Harbor freight has lifts for $999 and up.
4 jackstands for what? $50...
For brakework the jackstands will work fine. Car will sit very stable on all 4.
Dropping a motor, get the lift if you can justify it.

[NOLAsc]

People do it all the time. Jackstands on rear torsion bar covers in front of back wheels. Front jackstands along body seam behind front wheels (maybe with padding). This shot is of a a car on 4 stands at a p-car shop near me. .

Lift would be nice, but not essential even for engine drop.

(Posting from Blackberry, so I hope it works right.)

[HarryD]

Welcome to the best 911 BBS. You will find loads of info on just about any topic. We always like to see everybody's ride so a few pictures would be nice.

This is the jacking and jack stand location drawing I like the best. Has more than just the lift points.

Originally Posted by Bill Verburg

X's for lifting O's(and X's for stands), there are others, the Os are almost impossible to get a jack on

[jpearson]

Thanks guys for all the replies - very helpful. I think that I am going to stick with the jack stands, a $1000 lift might draw a little too much scrutiny from my wife.

I'll get some pictures of my car up soon - it is currently a diamond in the rough.
Josh

[schumicat]

for a project car, I would get 6 ton jack stands. they will make it easier to do the inevitable engine drop (most 3 or 4 ton stands won't go high enough to clear the engine). you can get the 6 tons at autozone for $50/pair.

[aj88cab]

Your '75 will probably not have jack pads at the locations marked with an "X" in the diagram above. Use a length of 2x4 to avoid damage to the body. The two middle X's are the center jack locations (factory jack post or a jackpad insert for use with a floor jack) do not put a jack stand there. The "O" locations are the suspension mouting points or torsion tubes, and will accomodate a jack stand but generally not a jack as indicated above.

Put your tires under the car when working on it in case a jack stand slips...safety first!

[tirwin]

Originally Posted by jpearson

Thanks guys for all the replies - very helpful. I think that I am going to stick with the jack stands, a $1000 lift might draw a little too much scrutiny from my wife.

I'll get some pictures of my car up soon - it is currently a diamond in the rough.
Josh

I got a hardy chuckle when I read this.

I have the same kinds of thoughts as you. Then I get these little phones calls or text messages from my wife -- "the FedEx guy was just here with a giant stack of boxes. gosh I wonder what's inside them!!!" She is very good natured about it all. Yes, the lift is a little obvious but you're not going to be slipping much past the goalie anyway so you might as well come clean up front.

The only reason I haven't gone for the lift yet is that we're thinking about re-locating in 1-2 years so I don't want to put a bunch of money into this garage. I'm waiting on the next one to be THE garage where I can build one fashioned after the stylings of my garage hero Jack Olsen.

[aj88cab]

Also get a floor jack if you don't have one. The factory jack is often called the "widow-maker" for a reason.

And one of these to use with the floor jack.



Pelican Parts - Product Information: 10-6641-030-M230

[Por_sha911]

There are some things you don't want to cut corners on. Jack stands are near the top of the list. Do NOT use HF jack stands. I had a brand new set of stands collapse upon the very first use. HF replaced them and gave me a full refund but, I was 60 seconds away from having my head under there. The replacement set are still in box unopened. Bought a set from Sears on the way home. You can see the difference in quality. I love my HF aluminum jack but I won't use the stands again.
Do a search. There is a ton of info on how to jack up your car and where to put the stands. The search button is your friend.

[CCM911]

+1 for Sears Craftsman stands. We have a car up on four of them at the moment. We have had the engine out, then in, and then back out, with no problems.

A lift is hardly needed. Save your money for Porsche Parts. You will get a lot of good advice on this board. Welcome, and spend your hard earned dollars wisely.

[jeffs9146]

Do Not Use The Type Of Jackstands Shown In The Photo Under The Red Car Above!!!

I have a friend who had his head smashed by a set of those that let go!!

Get the round ones with the pin that goes through them!

[Grady Clay]

While we could (and probably should) re-engineer the jack stand, there is far more to the ‘system’ of elevating a 911.

Those include:
Wheel chocks.
Lifting jacks.
Jack stands.
Safety blocks.
Surface.
Common sense.

Your concern is well placed.
Having a ‘ton-of-iron’ over your body is a serious concern.


Clearly the first place to look is the surface: we all know ‘flat & level’ from pre-school.
That isn’t all.
There is an important balance between ‘slippery’ where you can slide your creeper, stool, etc. about and where there is insufficient grip for wheel chocks, jack stands, jacks, etc.
Another is the surfaces between the jack stand (and jack) and the chassis or suspension of the 911.
That should not unintentionally slip.

That said, almost all floor jacks have either the jack move or the car move during the lift.
When lifting one end or the other, you must accommodate this movement so the movement doesn’t tip-over a jack stand.

There are lots of threads about hydraulic jacks.
Big, heavy, heavy-duty, overrated, ‘professional’ jacks are the way to go.
The flimsier the jack, the greater the risk. Your choice. It’s your 911 (and body).


I won’t try and re-engineer the jack stand but big & HD are important.
Most have too narrow base for my taste.
Draw a triangle from the contact point with your 911 and the ‘legs’ of the stand.
The less the angle, the greater the tip-over likelihood.


Another ‘feature’ of jack stands is grip to the surface.
If the surface is pliable (gravel, hot asphalt), something must prevent the jack stand from ‘sinking-in’.
Many stands have part of the structure that prevents more than a ¼” sink.
I have four plywood ‘pads’ with rubber grip bottoms and stand locating pieces for soft ground.


Safety blocks are a too often neglected safety device.
NEVER should the car be up without a back-up safety device.
This can be as simple as the removed tires & wheels underneath.
I have some wood blocks that go under the chassis, tunnel, transmission, engine … whatever.
If the 911 falls off the jack stands, there is a safety to protect you.


The biggest issue is common sense.
Consider the consequences.


Lifts have their own set of issues that absolutely need to be addressed.
Most important - the car has farther to fall (=mgh).

Best,
Grady

[sballard]

When I crawl under my car on jack stands, I ALWAYS have a floor jack or two under there as a backup.

[CCM911]

Originally Posted by jeffs9146

Do Not Use The Type Of Jackstands Shown In The Photo Under The Red Car Above!!!

I have a friend who had his head smashed by a set of those that let go!!

Get the round ones with the pin that goes through them!

Are you sure? The one shown in your picture doesn't look that sturdy.

[jeffs9146]

Originally Posted by CCM911

Are you sure? The one shown in your picture doesn't look that sturdy.

I put a 2x4 across the front and rear!

My point is the other ones can release (I've seen it happen) or drop down and this one can not possibly! That doesn't mean that you couldn't push it over but it wont drop!

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by aj88cab

The factory jack is often called the "widow-maker" for a reason.

and that is why I carry a scissors jack from a 944 in my car; also a piece of plywood to sit a jack on in case the side of the road is muddy