Disappointed in Weekend Rides

[Dellaware]

I'm in the process of buying a motor for my 76 targa and I got advise to go to Weekend Rides or some other shops that my mechanic (and others on this forum) recommended. (check my other posts)
When I called last week, Weekend Rides had two 3.2's available. This week there was one available, in a vehicle that had some fire damage. He said he had the transmission sold so wanted me to drive it early this week so he could pull it out of the car sooner rather than later. I work all week but was able to convince my parents to go up and drive it/check it out and maybe bring it home. We had negotiated a price for the engine, muffler, clutch, flywheel, etc. My dad drove it and was happy with it yesterday. At this point we agree to pull it in the morning and check the leak down numbers. I was hoping they would be in the 8% range based on what my mechanic said. Weekend rides said that I was crazy to think that the engine would be 8-10% and I had been talking to too many people on the forum. And so this morning they were in the 10-15% range with two above 30%. I wasn't there, but my dad said he did not put a wrench on when he did those cylinders. My mechanic didn't think that was right either, and thought the engine was still worth the negotiated price and that was fishy without the wrench. Note also that even though the tests were bad, the price did not drop. So they pulled the engine, and my parents went for a hike. When they got back, Weekend rides wanted another 200 for the AC. my dad said leave the bracket on and we will see if the one we have works first if not we will buy it from you later. So the engine is loaded up in the truck. Before they sign the paper work he wants to talk to me. My dad calls and puts him on the line, he says NO warranty once it leave the parking lot. I say ok. He repeats, I say ok. I say, "I just remember that I'm new to this, have been asking alot of questions and am glad i got a motor finally. I just think that you need to realize that not everyone lives and breaths this stuff like you and I needed more information for piece of mind....." and like always he cuts in and interrupts and says something to the effect that xxx vendor and xxx vendor would never spend this much time doing this and I need to stop crying and I'm crazy, and he hangs up on me. So then my dad calls back, says that weekend rides is pulling the engine out of the truck and are saying they need to get off the property ASAP.

So my parents are on the way back to their house (3 hours), no engine, two days wasted.

LET ME MAKE THIS CLEAR: I have no intent to discourage business from them, just laying out my experience. I'm sure many people have had a good experience there, and in fact, that's what led me there. However, if you deal with them i think you have to just accept everything the way it is, assume that they "know everything", and be prepared to walk away from the table if he gets mad. He did spend alot of time with me and my parents explaining things, so I get that; it's frustrating dealing with people that don't know everything about porsches and want to negotiate when things aren't as advertised..... but if you are trying to earn potential customers business, that is not the way to do it in my mind.

Peter

[Grady Clay]

Peter,

Walking away from an A** H*** like that is the best thing you (and your parents) can ever do.
Anyone with a legitimate business works with his customers, not run them off.

I suspect there may have been more (wrong) to the ‘deal’ than meets the eye or you guys know.
Chalk up the two days, effort and travel to “experience”.

Best,
Grady

[dshepp806]

Nicely put, Grady...


BEST,

Doyle

[Tippy]

They got burned themselves buying a car with a bad motor.

[bill's911]

I think that Dan petchel at Cars inc in NJ had at least 1 3.2 for sale recently... Saw it posted in a most recent PCA magazine

[dhagood]

i'm sure this episode was very frustrating for you and your parents, but i think it worked out for the best. two cylinders with a leak down rate over 30% is, to me, indicative of an engine that needs a rebuild.

[gtc]

Not too surprising. They have a lot of dirty, overpriced crap on ebay. I always wondered who bought that junk.
I'm glad to hear you made it out of there without losing anything more than time and some gas money.

[Cairo94507]

Well...I just spoke with Weekend Rides on Monday in my quest to find a nice, later 3.2 for my Six. They seemed rushed in talking to me on the phone and maybe distracted. I actually said would it be easier if you call me back later and they said no they could talk. I ended up not feeling good about the call or them, unfortunately. They came recommended by a member on another site and I dropped their name and they acknowledged selling him his motor, yet they still, essentially, un-sold me an engine.

I ended up buying (well, in process) a 3.2 from a member on here, ShakinJoe.

[Dellaware]

I hope that what happened is that the engine was not good and that he realized he go burned and he realized we knew what we were doing (a little bit) and would be unhappy buying an engine that needed a valve job. I also hope that he was not doing the test wrong on purpose so he could keep a good motor and had negotiated too low with me. No matter the case, he was not listening to me, talking to me and discussing the situation in a respectful manner that would make me want to do business with him. Thanks bill911, if u have Dans info please send my way. I'll also try to look up.

[Dan J]

30% leakdown is no problem Oh by the way did I mention NO WARRANTY?
Total Douche nozzle

[Dellaware]

I should say that the reason I thought the test was wrong was because when he did the first cylinder he pressurized it and the piston pushed down, so not a good reading. But then did it over a few times and still no good reading. My dad suggested holding the wrench so it didn't rotate but "he knew what he was doing". This happened on number 1 and number 5 I believe, which maybe it's coincidence, but I read a few other threads that those cylinders are common before a valve job is needed

[Mighty2.0]

You did the right thing. Anybody shop who treats people like that doesn't deserve their business. Just make sure you never go back there, and move on.

[DanielDudley]

Considering the importance of finding a good engine, be grateful he didn't sell it too you anyway.

Don't rush getting a good engine. If you want an engine really bad, you might get just that.

[Weekend Rides]

As the seller i feel i must answer this post and put the facts out here.
The poster is a newbie who contacted us looking for a used 3.0 or 3.2, we spent a lot of time answering his questions and giving him advise how to proceed according to his budget. He sent his father who he claimed is a retired former mechanical shop teacher to our place to see the car the engine was in. We had been very careful to explain to both the father and poster we only drove the car which had no service records and no history. It which was an insurance loss due to a fire on the side of the car. During which time we drove it about 20-30 miles and it seemed ok. But as you all know without a leakdown and inspection for any broken head studs no one knows what the internal condition ever is. We we would not accept a deposit or payment until we were satisfied of condition and I never asked for one, as is my policy.

He agrees and we set a price which was fair of 5300 for the engine with DME, wiring, fuel pump and associated conversion parts to retrofit it to his 76. He was unclear on AC and clutch and flywheel what he had so we left those items open.

We agreed if the leakdown was under 10 percent we had a deal. When his father arrived we took him for a ride, he never drove the car himself as he stated in his post. He sat in passenger seat and his mother followed us "looking for engine smoke". The father continued to try to beat me up on price during this time and kept asking me to throw in free items which the poster failed to mention. The father then followed me as the "second smoke inspector" looking for exhaust smoke back to my shop. We had driven it maybe 4 miles each way. He seemed ok with it and due to the late hour we agreed to do a leakdown first thing yesterday.

Again NO money exchanged hands. We started to do the leakdown stone cold with the engine in the car as agreed. The father continued to argue about price and kept saying he could guess we paid less than 5k for the car and i should sell the motor for less. Exasperated I showed the father the invoice from the insurance company which he saw and he was able to confirm it was way more than he thought and way more than the engine sale price. I had hoped this would stop his antics.

We did the first cylinder leakdown which was low, and we could hear the leaking. I informed the father the motor was possibly not as strong internally but would do a few more cylinders, all of which were then in the 10 percent range. #4 was closer to 15 percent.

The father says he does not want the motor and i say ok and give him a few ignition and electrical parts he had asked about for free of charge, simply as my goodwill and as courtesy for his journey to our shop. The poster failed to mention this.

About a half hour later the father returns and asks to do an electrical test of some sort, which i still do not know why or what it had to do with the motor. I say no we do not know this test and frankly whats sending electricity through the motor have to do with valves and cylinder condition. ,Anyway then the father says ok he will buy it AS IS for the agreed price of 5300 and feels he can do a valve job if he wants. In the interim the poster sends me an email saying he would trade his old CD box for the later flywheel and the used clutch, which we mutually agree.

Continually the father keeps trying to get more AC parts now for free, i say i will include the rotary AC pump and brackets and line to the rear condensor for 200 more. I again ask the father to please stop trying to work us over on price. He says "oh its way of doing things". I say well i sell this one with condition of one or two cylinders low i must sell AS IS and that's it and if he wants a warranty or a fresh engine its not going to happen for this price. The poster/son asked for an engine with 7-8 percent leakdown, and this one does not fit his needs as the first cylinder numbers were not good and we should not continue the sale any further.

Father apologizes and my tech resumes his job of removal of the motor while the father and mother go off to see the local sights. He returns a few hours later, engine is out and again starts trying to beat us up on price again. He starts asking again for free ac components, front trunk mounted ac fan, front condensor and blowers etc. None of which had anything to do with the engine sale or first price.

Finally i say if you keep asking for a lower price don't, we made a deal and that is it. I will be happy to give you a decent price on other parts but the engine is separate deal which we agreed to. Once engine is out, i ask the Father to call his son the poster/newbie so we are all perfectly clear on condition of the engine and any representations he feels were made or should know BEFORE it leaves.

We have established it may need a top end rebuild or valve work or maybe only one valve had some carbon or rust on it to seal better which explained the lower test on #1. I explain to the son and father we did NOT remove the valve covers to check for any broken head studs as the father said don't bother he is ok with it as it is. I explain by not removing the valve covers we did not have chance to knock on the rocker arms to break off any possible rust or carbon which would or could push the numbers higher. The father says NO problem, he understands its AS IS but again starts working me over on price and other parts to include, claiming he has CASH and will i take 3k "CASH GREEN CASH" for it now that its possibly sick.

I said enough is enough and declined to sell him the engine period. The son says we have been down this road and gets rude to me on phone when i am asking him to understand my position as a seller, explaining to a newbie how he needs to know it may have broken head studs and most likely it may need more work.

Once we get the son on the phone, i try to explain again what we found and i want to be perfectly clear about what you are buying since you are not here yourself. The poster/son says on phone, "i have nothing more to say to you we went down this road all day and hangs up".

So what would you guys do? Same as me i suspect. So we unloaded the engine from his truck and sent the father on his way, along with the free electricals i gave him earlier in the day. No money ever changed hands not even for one second. NONE.

We tried to explain it was AS IS and if it had even one or all if all head studs broken we could not guarantee it once we saw a low number on #1. What this shows is we did not attempt to hide one thing, we accommodated a guy who continued to try to get the engine for less despite numbers warnings to stop working us over.

This known, one must wonder if the two of them thought we did not do the leakdown right and wanted to take advantage of a possible mistake??? Did you read his line about this in his post?

I feel he using a forum to bash me for his loss or frustration that we would not sell him the engine as is or for less money? Kindly think this over before rushing to pile on me here, all of you know we never try to hide one thing on used parts ever. This newbie should grow up and not bash me when looking at a 28 year old engine with 117k which clearly had some sort of issue in #1 but wanted it hoping we made a mistake doing the leakdown.

[KTL]

Another example of how its nice to have both sides of the story. NOW let the debate carry on........

[Tippy]

So now after reading this, it seems the father "threw a wrench into the spokes" of this deal.

I'd have this thread removed. Sounds like the seller is legit IMO.

[Dellaware]

I was never rude with you, I was asking questions, and trying to get a good price, as was my father. I think it's ridiculous that you did not change the price after we found out it needed a valve job based on the leak down. Even so, I still was willing to pay that price and take the chance that it could be repaired. I also accepted that it had no warranty/as is on the phone right before you were going to do the paperwork. I actually was trying to apologize to you for the whole situation and that I am new to this wanted to make sure I was getting all the information I could, hence the leak down and questions. You got mad and interrupted me like you have done several times before, and hung up on the phone. I never hung up on you. (WTF?)
Yes my dad is a hard person to deal with but he was trying to get me a good deal on a motor. its a lot of money, especially for an engine with a valve job needed.
Yes, my parents went for a hike and came back and suddenly you wanted to charge more for the AC unit? There was no talk of this before?
Lastly, can you read the post? I'm not trying to bash you, just giving my experience which unfortunately sucked. If you would have been useful, it would have been a good experience I was posting about.

[ThomO]

Yup there is always two sides to a story

[jackb911]

When I read the original post I had serious misgivings that the seller was the "bad guy" in this transaction but I wanted to hear the other side of the story.

After hearing the seller's side of the story, now I am certain he was not..

The potential buyer's father totally screwed the pooch on this deal. I've dealt with people like this and would have had far less patience than the seller did in this case.

However, with that said, I'd have insisted on pulling the lower valve covers to make sure the head studs were intact. A broken stud or two might explain the compression/leakdown numbers.

[CCM911]

But the seller seems to be using the term "newbie" in a very disparaging manner. For that, I tend to think the truth is somewhere in the middle.