"Questionable" M491 production numbers letter validated by Porsche Cars NA

[viperbyte]

Okay, I'm sure some will doubt this anyway, but this is straight from the Porsche's mouth. (Porsche's - horse's...). I digress. I wrote Porsche Cars North America a letter asking if the letter that has been floating around for a while now regarding M491 production numbers is valid or not. In fact I insinuated that it was not valid, and asked if they could provide me with valid numbers. Well, to my pleasant surprise I got a message on my answering machine yesterday from them. She says that the numbers in the letter check out with Porsche Cars Germany, and are valid. She left a phone number and a case number, if anyone cares to check it out. I haven't as of yet. Not sure if I will get a letter too, but if I do I will post it on this thread. Here is a link to the audio from my answering machine.

https://youtu.be/rPmFCkJOnHw

Here is the pic of the letter that I included with my letter to PCNA.

[McLaren-TAG]

Wow... an actual answering machine!

[viperbyte]

Yes, I still have a land line!

[ted]

Are the cars on the letter reference to cars sold by PCNA in the US only?
Or is this meant to be total cars built that year?
I have a euro 86 M491 that the PO took delivery at the factory and shipped to the states.
Would those cars be included on this list?

[viperbyte]

Originally Posted by ted

Are the cars on the letter reference to cars sold by PCNA in the US only?
Or is this meant to be total cars built that year?
I have a euro 86 M491 that the PO took delivery at the factory and shipped to the states.
Would those cars be included on this list?

In my letter I asked if these were the numbers for cars sold in the USA, but cannot say for certain that they are or are not for all of North America. I don't know for sure if your car would be included, but I would think not.

[ted]

Makes more sense that these are USA only numbers.
I'd be interested in total M491 for these years compared to standard carrera or turbo 911 cars.
Just to see if the M491 worldwide is really nearly as rare as the USA numbers.

[WYDBODY1986]

As far as 1986 Coupes go I know the list is wrong. The webpage below lists a lot more confirmed coupes than 5.

index

[viperbyte]

For what it's worth, here is the text of my letter to PCNA:

Hello,

I was wondering if you can provide me with the production/sales numbers for Porsche 911 M491 (Turbo Look option) cars sold in the USA. There is a picture of a letter that has been circulating on the internet for some time, but its validity is very suspect. I have included said letter for your inspection, but I'm guessing you have seen it before. I am interested in aquiring a similar list from you if even possible, but if not possible, I would be greatly appreciative of just the production/sales numbers for 1986 Porsche 911 Cabriolet M491 Cars sold in the USA, as I am a proud owner of one of them (VIN WP0EB0913GS171433) with a C.O.A. provided by Porsche Cars North America, Inc.. I'd like to thank you in advance for any assistance you can give me with regard to this matter.

Sincerely,

David A. Wilson

[McLovin]

I can tell you that that list is not accurate.

I used to have an '87 M491 cab. I was curious about that list and started researching it.

I was able to find and confirm (through old ads, BB posts, etc.) more than 16 US TL cabs sold in '87. Way more, in fact.

[viperbyte]

Originally Posted by WYDBODY1986

As far as 1986 Coupes go I know the list is wrong. The webpage below lists a lot more confirmed coupes than 5.

index

This is from your link:

"In 2010 the Porsche AG database became available and the VIN numbers could be searched to find the option codes that each car was built with."

Does anybody have a link to such a database?

[McLovin]

There's another list circulating somewhere with higher numbers that is probably closer to accurate.

[WYDBODY1986]

I don't have a link sorry I think the gent who owns the web page is a Pelican so hopefully he will chime in here

[WYDBODY1986]

I remembered his name.

PM dsmeyer, he owns the page I linked and may be able to help you with the database

[DRACO A5OG]

I don't know, I think PCNA data base is not too great. I went to RV at Laguna Seca, waited in that stupid line for the COA only to find out they have my color code as metalic silver, WTD? I know my car was never re-painted and I have the original plaque with original marble grey.

[dsmeyer]

Originally Posted by viperbyte

I am a proud owner of one of them (VIN WP0EB0913GS171433) with a C.O.A. provided by Porsche Cars North America, Inc..

Your Cabriolet is #173 of 226 produced for North America in 1986.

Originally Posted by viperbyte

This is from your link:

"In 2010 the Porsche AG database became available and the VIN numbers could be searched to find the option codes that each car was built with."

Does anybody have a link to such a database?

The "link" was though a software program called Porsche Pet which connected directly to Porsche AG in Germany. At the time you could use this software to search VIN numbers and the option codes that a car was built with. Norbert Franz in Germany went though the time consuming task of finding all of the VIN numbers with the M491 and M470 option codes. I went though a similar process independently to confirm the North American VIN numbers.
The newer versions of Porsche Pet no longer allow this kind of search, but Norbert and I have the M491 VIN lists which he now uses for his registry... Home - Turbo-Look Register

Over 3000 M491 optioned cars in Norbert's Registry... all confirmed by this database.

[WYDBODY1986]

I assume everyone saw the 1986 Guards Red Turbo Look that just sold for $66,500 on BAT?
Very nice original example, wish I had the self control to keep mine that original.

[KTL]

Yep that is a nice car that sold for a big price. I actually thought it was going to sell higher, considering the psychotic craze that is ongoing for these cars.

So are we to assume that the steep drop in TL sales after '85 is because Porsche reintroduced the 930 to the USA market in '86? edit.......... Never mind. The corrected production numbers below answered my question.

Wow, that's some pretty bad production tracking by Porsche

[dsmeyer]

This is what the true M491 production list should show...

[WYDBODY1986]

Even at the corrected numbers that is still a pretty low production run for six years

[James Brown]

if you look hard, most of the workers at Porsche durning the 70's-80's were a bit tipsy! there record keeping was not the best.Did you try a CoA from Porsche?