Please recommend the "right" header/muffler

[wachuko]

Originally Posted by RarlyL8

We offer several options for engines 3.2L-3.6L

Soon, soon, very soon!!!

[mreid]

I'm leaning towards the B&B (yes Bill, 964 air input to the heat exchanger, I said 993 as my engine if from a 95 993). I have two questions:

1. Does the B&B require a different or reconfigured s oil feed hose from the oil tank?

2. If I go with the B&B, I want to use the Magnaflow 2x2 muffler. Which one? It seems the 911s I've seen with this set up are using one input and one output as both inputs (hope that makes sense, but refer to Bills picture in the second post and you will see the bottom tubes on both sides of the muffler are used as inputs). I don't see how this would work unless the muffler has an internal crossover. So, with that in mind, what is the correct part number?

As usual, thanks to all!

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by mreid

I'm leaning towards the B&B (yes Bill, 964 air input to the heat exchanger, I said 993 as my engine if from a 95 993). I have two questions:

1. Does the B&B require a different or reconfigured s oil feed hose from the oil tank?

2. If I go with the B&B, I want to use the Magnaflow 2x2 muffler. Which one? It seems the 911s I've seen with this set up are using one input and one output as both inputs (hope that makes sense, but refer to Bills picture in the second post and you will see the bottom tubes on both sides of the muffler are used as inputs). I don't see how this would work unless the muffler has an internal crossover. So, with that in mind, what is the correct part number?

As usual, thanks to all!

I converted my oil feed to the classic under the trans version years ago, so don't know what other might work

Magnaflo #12568 is designed as a 2 in/2 out muffler 1 inlet on each side

If you already have a 993 it might make sense to go w/ the stock 993 headers and rsscotty's muffler setup, the only reason that I went w/ the B&B was that I originally did this w/ a 964 engine and just kept it w/ the 2 subsequent 993 engines.

For decent noise control you want the biggest can that fit in the available space, some dual out mufflers have a drone issue, this can be tamed by using a single out design or by blocking one of the 2 outs as Jack O does on his for street use. I've never found that to be a problem but then my Flowmaster is so loud that a little drone probably just gets lost in the general din.

[Quicksilver]

Originally Posted by Steve W

. . .
If you want really quiet, believe it or not, huge a single in, single out Super Turbo muffler (a la Bursch style) maxes at probably 86 db but is also only 4 hp off of completely open race pipes.

Do you have a picture of this setup?
Also what part number?

[JeremyD]

Originally Posted by mreid

I'm leaning towards the B&B (yes Bill, 964 air input to the heat exchanger, I said 993 as my engine if from a 95 993). I have two questions:

1. Does the B&B require a different or reconfigured s oil feed hose from the oil tank?!

Yes, in fact they (and I) recommend you go with their funky welded up line. There is no clearance for even a heat sleeved "normal line"


otherwise you end up with:

Originally Posted by mreid

I'm leaning towards the B&B (yes Bill, 964 air input to the heat exchanger, I said 993 as my engine if from a 95 993). I have two questions:

2. If I go with the B&B, I want to use the Magnaflow 2x2 muffler. Which one? It seems the 911s I've seen with this set up are using one input and one output as both inputs (hope that makes sense, but refer to Bills picture in the second post and you will see the bottom tubes on both sides of the muffler are used as inputs). I don't see how this would work unless the muffler has an internal crossover. So, with that in mind, what is the correct part number?

As usual, thanks to all!

I did the magnaflow on my version of the 3.4 years ago (2006) it was a little loud so ended up with a 993 flipped flange

[mreid]

I can only imagine the spectacularly horrible results of a hole melted in that rubber s hose. No thanks!

I would use the 993 headers currently on the engine, but they belong to the original owner of the engine who already has plans for them. I am only using them right now as a stable base for my engine as I finished building it. Time for a gratuitous engine picture:

[Bill Verburg]

Originally Posted by JeremyD

Yes, in fact they (and I) recommend you go with their funky welded up line. There is no clearance for even a heat sleeved "normal line"


otherwise you end up with:







I did the magnaflow on my version of the 3.4 years ago (2006) it was a little loud so ended up with a 993 flipped flange

That oil line is unnecessary, all you need is an angled oil fitting
like this


then a stock S hose fits, a heat shield of some sort wouldn't hurt

[Quicksilver]

Agree with Bill that the funky B&B "sink trap" oil line isn't needed (or wanted).

I went the very simple route of trimming the hose as short to the elbow at the oil tank as looked reasonable.

I then wrapped the headers with insulating wrap. Works great. Been running it that way for more then 4 years and the hose shows no wear or hardening.

[aerodyn930]

Would like to share some recent experiments in the search for the perfect muffler / header combo, The car in question is a 964 , Only alteration : Steve Wong chip configured for LWF and exhaust, The Fabspeed headers /muffler gave the car a noticeable increase in power but the drone at highway speed would drive you out of the car, Next step was a flowmaster with a valve that would close the driver's side tailpipe when cruising, No more drone , Good power with both outlets open but the quality of the sound was " lacking" .
This morning we fired up what appears to be the ideal solution , GT-3 muffler connected to the fabspeed headers, Using the primary inlets and blocking the lower bypass ports, The sound is IMHO perfect , midrange feels stronger , top end we are still testing but feels as strong as the flowmaster with both tips open, We had dynoed the previous combo so another session is in order, One other advantage is the significant weight savings, However unless you happen to have one of these lying around the price may be a disadvantage,
Anyway, Enjoy and Happy new year!

Lou












Now we get to cut a opening on the rear bumper, Raise the tag 1" and fill the corner cutouts,

[Harvey Mushman]

The GT3 muffler is a great solution. Tested today with no drone at any speed and no noticeable change in power but will dyno ASAP. Sound is deep and not objectionable. Flowmaster 1 into 2 and 2 into 2 were good but 74db idle and 104 DB at 15 feet. GT3 flows good, runs cooler, and is 76db idle and 96 db at 15 feet. Muffler weight is GT3 11#, Fabs 30#, Flowmaster 30#, stock exhaust is 89#. Looks like a great alternative. Thanks Lou.

[Steve W]

Harvey the exhaust looks great and is also what I have on my 911, but that titanium version of the muffler will crack in short order on the backside unless you reinforce it. It was not designed to run solo without the side mufflers. My titanium one lasted two events before it blew two 12" cracks on the backside. A friend of mine running the steel version of this muffler has also blown out the backside after six months of events after deleting the side mufflers. The solution on the steel ones is as shown by the Cargraphic reinforcements shown below, after the Germans were blowing out their mufflers too, and Porsche subsequently double walled the muffler there. Not sure if a similar fix would work on the titanium version:





There is about a 10-15 hp difference on a 3.6 between running the exhaust through the upper ports vs straight through the bottom exits. I use vacuum actuated flaps that do a switchover at 3000 rpm to switch to straight out.

[aerodyn930]

Thanx for the tip Steve, Will monitor that area, Possibly re design our bracket to provide more support in the center,

Regards, Lou

[mreid]

Thanks for all the help and beautiful pictures!

Just thought I would update and let you know that I ordered the B&B headers with 1 3/4" primaries, 964 style heat exchanger inlets and 911 outlets. Should be hear in a couple of weeks. I'm going to try the Magnaflow muffler and I'll weld up the pipes and tips.

Thanks all.

[pdtweeks]

keep us updated Mark....I will be doing a similar setup on my SC soon.

Most of the Magnaflow setups I have seen use the #11386 muffler, but I would like to use a little larger muffler for a little quieter setup and will try the #12468 or #12568 for fit.

Has anyone here tried either of these ??

[mreid]

#12568 is what was recommended to me and what I will be using. I won't be ready until the spring, but I'll post on my build thread once complete.

[pdtweeks]

Mark,
any updates on this ?? I seem to be on a similar path (B&B/Magnaflow) & would like to follow your progress & experiences in getting this setup to work.

[Craig_D]

Originally Posted by pdtweeks

keep us updated Mark....I will be doing a similar setup on my SC soon.

Most of the Magnaflow setups I have seen use the #11386 muffler, but I would like to use a little larger muffler for a little quieter setup and will try the #12468 or #12568 for fit.

Has anyone here tried either of these ??

Hey pdtweeks, I've used the 18" Magnaflow #12486 on my custom dual Cat exhaust system, using SSIs cut after the merge, V-band clamps and then Magnaflow Cats into the two in/two out Magnaflow 12486 muffler on my 3.0 liter.

Here's my thread: Craig_D's Dual Cat SC Exhaust

Obviously, you'd want larger diameter headers on anything larger than 3.2 liters, but the muffler works well, fits great and sounds fantastic.

[rennch]

Originally Posted by rsscotty

I did this Monty muffler conversion on a 3.6 early car. Worked out great. We order a Monty without any inlet pipes and fab our own to fit from the 993 heat exchanger flange.

I'm in love with this. It's exactly what I want.

[Joe Bob]

Single 02 sensor......no mix chamber. That's why I went with a single outlet.

[rsscotty]

Not so good picture of the right side, but to confirm there are two oxygen sensors.