Correcting a 'forward-dated' '71T

[tholyoak]

I recently picked up a new project. A '71 911T that was unfortunately 'forward-dated' to a big bumper car and painted black from its original tangerine sometime in the 90's I believe.

The car does have a 2.2 but with Webers and it is not the original motor. Along the way it was also updated to a 915. Since it has a 915, I thought that the 3.2 I have kicking around from my '89 might be fun to stick in the car. Plan would be that the car eventually becomes some form of narrow bodied hotrod.

Intial plans are to return it to its correct long-hood status and colour and I am having some difficulty on decided whether to use fibreglass or steel parts for the hood and fenders. I can get a steel hood locally that needs a bit of work for about 1/2 the cost of a TRE fibreglass hood but a pair of new steel front fenders will be about double the cost of fibreglass. Any experience or opinions that people want to share would be greatly appreciated.

-Todd

[James Brown]

thanks for returning it back, with the 3.2, that thing should scoot! weight reduction is the best performance upgrade. I like the R look fenders in glass but it depends what your going for. under 2000 lbs and the 3.2 is a great combo.

[Elombard]

I noticed that Restoration Design has a metal repro TS housing on the site now. That would avoid the massive work to get FG fenders to fit (not tomention installing head light fasteners and the gas fill stuff). Might be realtively easy to weld these on and go! I think they are about $300 a piece, not cheap but not too bad. I have been hoping to see some one try these as I would like to use them on my 84 one day.

[dave 911]

looking back on the changes now, painting over tangerine w/ black seems pretty foolish....but I know, back in the 80's, black impact bumper cars were the bomb....

I second the 'thanks' - you can't do much better than an orange long hood

[tholyoak]

Even though, Restoration Design is ~40 minutes from my house, I wouldn't reuse the fenders on the car now so converting the short hood fenders to long hood isn't really an option.*I do like James' idea of going the R-look fender route if I do go with fibreglass.

-Todd

Originally Posted by Elombard

I noticed that Restoration Design has a metal repro TS housing on the site now. That would avoid the massive work to get FG fenders to fit (not tomention installing head light fasteners and the gas fill stuff). Might be realtively easy to weld these on and go! I think they are about $300 a piece, not cheap but not too bad. I have been hoping to see some one try these as I would like to use them on my 84 one day.

[Elombard]

yah The R look would look great in Tangerine. Who sells them? I dont think GT sells them? maybe Getty or TRE. I would love to go R look but it looks a little odd with the rear flares on my car.

Another great Orange color since you are going orange might be the orange that McClaren used on their early race cars - Papaya Orange.

[RSBob]

Early car values are going up dramatically. The closer you can get back to stock the higher the value. Engines can be easily swapped but metal fenders and metal hood, etc will mean better resale. Hot rod it but go with metal or changes that can be easily swapped.

I am in the process of converting my narrow hot rod to stock to put it on the block and considering the expense of making everything close to perfect, I am glad I don't have body work on top of it.

[Doug&Julie]

I vote metal fenders for best fitment and some semblance of crash structure. From there I'd say whatever you can work out best for the hood, bumpers, etc.

Congrats on "saving" another longhood. May the Porsche gods be with you.

[Mr.Doback]

I will follow this, I also have a forward-dated 72 that I am considering the backdate to 73 rsr...

Good luck!

[tholyoak]

Thanks for all of the comments. With a 3.2, I don't think the weight of the steel vs fibreglass is a primary concern.
My concern with fibreglass echoes the ones posted above, primarily fitment, especially with the fenders. The discovery of the car pictured below, has me leaning in the steel direction again.


Car is from this for sale posting
1971 911T 3.0 Coupe

I guess I will have to see what steel parts I can find and at what cost. I know a new pair of fenders from Porsche is going to run ~$2500 and I would like to avoid that.

Todd

[wayner]

How about an SC fender for $150 each, plus the parts to make long hood compatible $300? = $450 per side plus labor.

You should be able to find good used fenders here and the work to add the light box will probably be equal to just fitting fiberglass.

[tholyoak]

I'm not keen on converting the front fenders for a number of reasons. If doing steel, personally I want an actual long hood fender not a conversion of a short hood. Also, due to living in the same province as Rest. Design, with tax those signal boxes will be $350 each. Further, they are only the signal boxes and further fabrication will be required to finish the conversion of the fender (time and $$). Also, I haven't seen the result of anyone who has done the conversion.Lastly, as I just got a quote on new fenders from Porsche that totals $2200 ($1100 ea), I would think a good used fender should run no more than $600 each so ~$500 vs ~$600 seems like a no brainer to bolt on some used fenders. Perhaps I am way off on the value of a good used long hood fender. I don't know.

Todd

[lgb240]

Hey Todd,

Looks like you have the makings of a great project ... lots of decisions to make. Best of Luck with whichever direction you take it in. Where in Ontario are you? I may have a few connections for parts.

PM me if you like

Cheers,
LGB

[derek murray]

Todd - nineapart.com might have the steel pieces you need. I have no experience with them, but they seem to have quite a large inventory.

[tholyoak]

LGB, I'm west of elmira towards Listowel. If you have any connections for parts I would be happy to hear them via PM.
Derek, Thanks for the suggestion. I usually deal with Randy at Whaletail since his place is on my way to work and he is a great guy. Hopefully I can round up the parts in need in steel in the next few weeks.

-Todd

[rwrink]

Todd

What a great project. I started in December "right dating" a 71 T as well.

Glad to see you going back to long hood.

I am on the east coast but get to Toronto a few times a year.

Hopefully we can get together for a coffee when we get the cars done.

All the best.

Rob

[tholyoak]

Rob,
Sounds like a plan.

-Todd

[wayner]

Originally Posted by tholyoak

I'm not keen on converting the front fenders for a number of reasons. If doing steel, personally I want an actual long hood fender not a conversion of a short hood. Also, due to living in the same province as Rest. Design, with tax those signal boxes will be $350 each.

Todd

Todd, I hope you find what you are looking for, but I m confused.

On one hand you want originality (not converted fenders)
On the other hand you are concerned about the minimal cost of signal boxes.

Those two thoughts don't go together.

I hope you are able to find a good used set, but consider this:
Virtually any long hood fender that you find that is older than 3 years old will most likely require patch panels welded in. Either this will already have been done or you will have to do it (or you will have a mess of rust hidden under bodyfiller).

New fenders are expensive but have only recently become available again. Before that, the only other options were:

1. Fibreglass
2. Taking later non rusted galvanized fenders and welding in light boxes salvaged from old fenders.

You now have a third option now that light boxes are available as new components.

Like I said, you might get lucky finding used long hood fenders, but they became pretty scarce years ago.

So, the decision would be to either buy new, or have some built if you want steel.

[lgb240]

Originally Posted by tholyoak

LGB, I'm west of elmira towards Listowel. If you have any connections for parts I would be happy to hear them via PM.
Derek, Thanks for the suggestion. I usually deal with Randy at Whaletail since his place is on my way to work and he is a great guy. Hopefully I can round up the parts in need in steel in the next few weeks.

-Todd

Hi Todd,

I'm in Guelph, not far at all. I was going to suggest Randy at Whaletale. A good friend of mine in Dundas has restored a couple of 356 / 911 tubs for Randy. If your stuck for some welding / fabrication, they may be able to help.

Good luck with your project

[joefrantz]

Todd

I admire your desire to do it right and keep it narrow bodied. Long hoods are getting too scare to be cutting up.

A couple of thoughts:

If you haven't already, take off the conversion bumper and bellows to see what's under there. I recently saw a post where someone found the original fenders intact under the conversion bumper.

Check with the major used parts suppliers for availability and pricing of used long hood fenders and hood. That should give you a realistic upper limit on used prices. You can probably also get a breakdown by condition. I would start with EASY. Jim is great to work with.

As to the newly available factory fenders, I think $1100 sounds vary attractive. Unless you are doing your own bodywork you can easily sink that much into a decent used fender that needs patch work and metal finishing. However, don't assume that the new fenders won't need metal work to get a proper fit. There was a lot of custom fitting done by the factory on the panel gaps - plus there is no guarantee that the new fenders will fit as well as the originals.

Good luck.

Joe