Alignment - Do I need to have the dealer do it?

[Emission]

I just put four new tires on my 86' 911 Turbo (Yokohama AVS Intermediates from Tire Rack at $58 each!). It pulls slightly to the right, so I want to get it aligned. The suspension and tire size are both stock.

I want to take it to Tire Pros, a local tire chain with a nice digital/laser alignment bay. Their alignment is about $80. They can do it immediately.

My good friend, a Porsche owner and pretty good 'home' mechanic, insists the car has to go to the dealership for their $160 alignment. He says they are the only people who 'understand' Porsches, and the 'others' will destroy my car. They can't get me an appointment for another week.

I have the Owners Manual with the factory alignment specs. Can't I copy the page and hand it to the local guys? Am I crazy if I don't go to the dealer?

Thanks in advance.

[Targa77]

I, too, have pondered this scenario. To me, it's a no brainer. I would rather take my car to someone who works on cars like mine on a regular basis rather than someone who maybe does a Porsche 2-3 times a year, if that. Unfortunately, the closest Porsche dealer is almost two hours away.

[jluetjen]

Here's a recent thread that describes how to do an alignment by yourself. You might want to read through the procedures once -- they're not rocket science. That's for sure. Just a straight aligment on a straight car really doesn't take that long. You can do it yourself for about $20-$40 worth of materials the first time. If the car is straight you can be done in about 30 minutes to an hour and not appreciably less accurate then you'd get in a shop. The rub comes in if the car is not square which results in insufficient travel in some of the measurements. That's when you have to start scratching your head and doing some thinking.

Anyhow, being cynical of most auto service shops, I often stand outside the bay and watch the guy doing the alignment. You will get a sense as to how it is going. I always make sure to get a print-out of the alignment when they are done so that you can see the results.

[scottb]

I wouldn't mess with a local tire shop. Take it to a qualified mechanic. I see you're in Thousand Oaks. NARW in Reseda just aligned my car, and it rides great!

[Emission]

To clarify my question...

I am wondering if there is anything 'special' about aligning a Carrera vs. your typical car (torsion bars vs. springs)? If I trust my local shop (they've been doing a great job with my cars for years), shouldn't they be able to align this car too?

[widebody911]

Two points I'd like to make:

• Does the actual dealer do alignments on torsion bar 911's more than 2-3 times a year? The newest of these cars is still 13 years old, and in dealer-parlance, that's worse than being a red-headed stepchild.
• does the dealer actually do the alignments themselves? Or do they in turn farm it out to a local tire shop? Don't laugh, it happens all the time, it's called 'subbing'. You could be paying $160 for the dealer to take it to the $80 tire shop.
• The local tire shop is probably more in tune with doing alignments than the dealer, whose primary function is to do boxster warranty work and install cupholders in 996's

Originally posted by Targa77
I, too, have pondered this scenario. To me, it's a no brainer. I would rather take my car to someone who works on cars like mine on a regular basis rather than someone who maybe does a Porsche 2-3 times a year, if that. Unfortunately, the closest Porsche dealer is almost two hours away.

[scottb]

If your Porsche wrench does alignments, chances are he'll do a good job. When mine did the alignment, he gave me a chart (which the factory uses) detailing all of the adjustments and the current set-up.

[tshih]

Last week I was teching a 993 for the DE at Poconos and found the right front wheel had a loose suspension bolt. Asked the owner if anyone had recently worked on the suspension and he said yep the dealer aligned the car just before he drove to tech.
Bad dealership work is just as prevalent anywhere you look. So unless you know the mechanic and have evalutaed their work before, it's best to get verbal recommendations. Tires are expensive to wear out unevenly prematurely and there's no savings for a decent alignment.

I would trust the alignment shop if the mechanic is willing to give you details or let you watch. Most alignments adjust the toe and camber which affects wear and handling. Pulling may be due to bad brake caliper on one side not retracting. The rear suspension are harder to change because the splines have to be matched and it's harder to do.

[scottb]

When I had mine in a couple of weeks ago, he aligned the front and back. I agree with the concerns about dealers...they just don't see enough older 911 cars to be proficient.

[69Sman]

Call Darren, at West End Alignment. He's THE VERY BEST, I promise you...done my '65 SC CAB, '69S and about to do my '72S:

in torrance, worth the drive: 310-808-9233

[cab83_750]

Emmission,

I've been at TirePros for my Supra, 280Z, etc. When I took my Porsche for alignment, I can't remember what happened but I changed my mine.

Honestly, I do not remember.

Have you tried Bob's Alignment? They charge $90.00 for Porsches and Corvettes. They are supposed to be the best in the Conejo Valley. The Asian dude greeted me as soon as I turned off the engine. In 20 seconds, he turned me away because he said that the tires I have have 'curb protection design' and that he could not mount his gizmos.

[Emission]

Funny, I did a drive-by at that place today to check it out...

What tires do you have? My Yokohama AVS Intermediates also have curb-protection ribs.

[Wayne 962]

Home alignments are *only* good for toe-in adjustments after you have replaced tie-rods etc. String and tape measures cannot possibly be as precise as one of those laser guided machines. Alex at PreTech in Marina del Rey is the 911 Alignment expert in the area. 310-822-4566.

-Wayne

[jess p]

Be very very careful as to who you take it to. Porsches require
all four wheels aligned. Just because an alignment shop has
the state of the art laser alignment rack. It dosen't mean you
will get a perfect alignment. It depends on the skill of the
technician. Many are on a tight schedule! Many are really
not sure how to set a porsche up properly! Camber, and castor be be set properly before toe in, on ALL four wheels.
A good friend of mine took his sports car to an alignment
shop ( supposedly a reputable shop) and the technician insisted
on driving the car first before the alignment. The technician
who happened to be under 25, while driving the car lost
control and totaled it. It was later learned the technician
was racing the car! He is still in a legal battle with the
alignment shop and he has no car!
So beware. If I were you I'd spend the extra money and
get it done right. Tires are very expensive these days and
an improper alignment will result in rapid tire wear. There
are ways to do it yourself. I have done it many times using
string and a carpenters bob. One can set Castor, camber
and toe in doing it yourself. It's tedious though.

[Targa77]

I guess that in trying to make a point, I didn't explain my side very well, but you guys keep me on my toes. Take it to someone who does Porsches on a regular basis, not someone who whenever you pull up they start looking at your car like "Oh God, another P car". I took my car to my local Exxon to get it inspected and the guy didn't know how to work anything on the car. I passed with flying colors only after I showed him how to work the various levers on the car. That's the point that I'm trying to make.

[jluetjen]

Home alignments are *only* good for toe-in adjustments after you have replaced tie-rods etc. String and tape measures cannot possibly be as precise as one of those laser guided machines.

Wayne; there's an old saying: "It's a poor craftsman who blames his tools". I think the opposite is also true, just because a shop has great equipment doesn't mean that they are going to do a better job. Serious racers have been using the "String method" for years (generations!) to set up formula cars, sports racers as well as sports cars and stock cars. These cars if anything are more sensative to set-up changes then the average 911 driven on the street by the average 911 driver. Of course the string method is only for setting up toe, to do camber you still need the appropriate tools, such as a camber guage.

It really comes down to who is doing the alignment rather then what they use to do it. New systems (lasers and such) are often faster and sometimes easier to dial in, but I don't see any reason why they are more accurate.

[ChrisBennet]

I have been taking my Porsches to a local tire place for years. The first few times I stayed out there with the tech while he did it. Now I use that same tech every time. So I guess what I'm saying is that you may be able to get a decent alignment if you are willing to stay right out there the first few times and make sure he is doing it right.
-Chris
P.S. I stay with my car whenever anyone but a Porsche mechanic is going to be lifting the car. It only takes a few seconds to crush your oil lines with improper lifting.

[dean]

I think bad cornerbalance will cause your car to pull also.

[Hal & Linda]

Our '83 911SC was aligned by a "local" national chain that takes care of the alignment on our '87 300D Turbo too. I've had the Benz checked after they aligned it at a Mercedes shop, and the local did a perfect job. They even hand torqued the lugs first.

I had them balance the tires before they aligned the 911, and then watched every step they made. The car runs straight and true, and tire wear after 10,000 miles is even front and rear.

Bottom line is I agree with the posts that lean toward experience. The tech knew exactly what he was doing (and I asked first if he was comfortable with 911's) and then did everything right. He gave me the printout BEFORE he took the reflectors off the wheels, asked me if it was ok, and only after I said yes did he finish cleaning up the car.

I tipped the tech $10 - first time I've ever done that - but I was really pleased with how he worked on our Porsche. The local dealers don't want you in their service bays (Insurance, they claim), but this local shop invites customers to watch and talk to the techs. There's nothing "special" about aligning a 911 - but watch out if the shop and their techs don't seem to know what they're doing!!