1 pound 9 ounce Lithium Ion Battery, $122, how bad could it be?

[Ds1]

Hey guys,

While doing some lightweight battery research I found this thread, where Steve Wong mentioned how his $67 lightweight Deka EXT14 had no problems starting and cranking his car, with only 220 Cold Cranking Amps and 12 Amp Hour capacity: Light weight battery question.

That battery weights 12 pounds (see specs here: Deka ETX14 Battery)

Then I thought about a lithium battery, and found this one for an amazing $122 with similar specs... 240 CCA with 9 AH. But here is the crazy part... its weights 1 pound 9 ounces. Antigravity Batteries YTZ7 8 Lithium ion Size Motorcycle Battery YTZ7S | eBay

Do you think the Antigravity battery would be fine for a street driven weekend only driver 911 with a 3.2? Of course I would use a battery tender (or quick disconnect), which I should probably be doing now on my "normal" Interstate, anyway.

[ClickClickBoom]

Li batteries are a great concept, but have their own downsides, decide for your self.

Lithium-ion battery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Li ion batteries have torched computers and other consumer electrical devices, Pb acid batteries take a tremendous amount of mishandling, physically and electrically, my concern is will Li ion take the same? Boeing 787 had issues with Li ion batts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_787_Dreamliner_battery_problems

[Jcslocum]

They do say good for an everyday 550cc moto. This is quite a bit smaller than 3200cc. I have a Shorai in my Duc and it does fine with a 1198-12.9:1 compression ratio engine BUT once the temps drop down into the mid to high 30's it goes dead. They are very temperature sensitive to performance. So beware that if may get you started but if it gets chilly, it may not get you home....

[Elombard]

that is just amazing. Ok ok they can double the weight and then will it work?

[RedCoupe]

We are using one in a Jeep Wrangler based Ultra4 racer to start a 5.7 liter Chevy LS1. It's a motorcycle sized battery, but it works very well. Had a PCM problem in a race a couple of weeks ago and it cranked and cranked the big V8 as we tried to start it. Sure is small and light.

[DG624]

I would go to their 6lb battery with more power...costs more but will not wear out as soon. I have a 17lb Braille but it is constant need of charging. Sometimes weight is good especially in balancing the rear weight.

[Ds1]

Originally Posted by RedCoupe

We are using one in a Jeep Wrangler based Ultra4 racer to start a 5.7 liter Chevy LS1. It's a motorcycle sized battery, but it works very well. Had a PCM problem in a race a couple of weeks ago and it cranked and cranked the big V8 as we tried to start it. Sure is small and light.

Do you know the specs of that battery?

I never drive the car in the winter, and its almost always in the garage overnight, so I don't think temperature would be a huge issue.

Good thing is if it doesn't start, the car will be a full 40 pounds lighter, so it will be easier to push and pop the clutch

[Driven97]

A few people in the autox world are using the Ballistic brand battery (pretty much the same thing, different case) in Miatas / Hondas. I hear they're not super reliable, and they carry a spare with them to events just in case. But just look how tiny they are!



I'm thinking of going compact AGM for my car. Partly for the reliability, partly because if one quits away from home my local Wal-Mart has something of the same size sitting on the shelf, and partly because the voltage regulator on our alternators is notoriously flaky. I don't think that works well with the LiFePO4 chemistry.

[Mike Billings]

I'm trying a Braille lithium battery next. 13 Amp-Hours, 6.4 Lbs

https://www.braillebattery.com/index.php/braille/product_batteries/gu1r

[hbkramer]

agm in the sc for 2 yrs now.
no issues.

[Flieger]

Originally Posted by ClickClickBoom

Li batteries are a great concept, but have their own downsides, decide for your self.

Lithium-ion battery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Li ion batteries have torched computers and other consumer electrical devices, Pb acid batteries take a tremendous amount of mishandling, physically and electrically, my concern is will Li ion take the same? Boeing 787 had issues with Li ion batts.

Boeing 787 Dreamliner battery problems - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There are many different Lithium chemistries. Lithium-Iron-Phosphate batteries are inherently safe and don't need the complex temperature monitoring system like Lithium polymers do. In fact, when I worked on an electric FSAE car you didn't need any firewall between you and them, just some insulating material. If you ran LiPo's you needed a full firewall and insulation. We didn't run any temp monitoring on the LiFePo4's, just the charge balancers to prolong their life and capacity.

[Joe Bob]

My yellow top Optima just died after 14 years.....$200 out the door. Ooof....

[Walt Fricke]

Isn't it pretty silly to fuss with battery weight for a street car?

Now a track car, where shedding pounds is the name of the game, that is something else. Plus you seldom need to start a very cold engine.

The little battery (not Lithium) I have in my SC for track use, which worked fine for that as long as I was careful, would not really turn over the motor today at 15 degrees F.

[tazzieman]

That extra 11 pounds of polar moment up front might save your bacon on the limit in a tight curve
Lithium is good for bipolar moments. I'm staying with last century technology!

[oh snap]

Originally Posted by Walt Fricke

Isn't it pretty silly to fuss with battery weight for a street car?

Now a track car, where shedding pounds is the name of the game, that is something else. Plus you seldom need to start a very cold engine.

The little battery (not Lithium) I have in my SC for track use, which worked fine for that as long as I was careful, would not really turn over the motor today at 15 degrees F.

I just replaced a battery and came to the same conclusion. Thought about going smaller and smaller. It doesn't make sense to spend more and risk reliability to save 10-20lbs when I have a radio, AC, heavy power seats etc. Settled sort of in the middle with a ~25lb sealed lead acid battery. A little nicer than the big mother that I had in it before but hopefully fewer compromises than the really small ones.

I do like to see people experiment though. Id love to see more people trying LiFEPO4 batteries in street cars to see how well they work long term.

[slow&rusty]

This thread certainly has my attention. I am willing to be a guinea pig and try a Li battery..amazing how light they are! Wow.

[Ds1]

Isn't it pretty silly to fuss with battery weight for a street car?



Now a track car, where shedding pounds is the name of the game, that is something else. Plus you seldom need to start a very cold engine.



The little battery (not Lithium) I have in my SC for track use, which worked fine for that as long as I was careful, would not really turn over the motor today at 15 degrees F.

I guess I should've mentioned that my car is a lightweight no-A/C no-heat no-radio no-power seats kind of vehicle. Also my car has already been put away for the winter for about 2 weeks now. Maybe I'll just have to try one of these batteries in the spring. Match up the specs, get the $40 lithium battery tender, and see if I can conquer the world with 2 pounds of electricity storage technology.

[Ds1]

I should also mention that Antigravity makes a ton of sizes of battery. You can get a MASSIVE 700 CCA and like 30 AH battery that weights around 6 pounds or so... But it's $400.

[Ds1]

Sorry for the multi-posts, but check this out. That Ballistic battery that Driven mentioned is $133, weights a tiny bit less than the one I posted, and has better specs: 15AH and 275 CCA. The website also claims no trickle charger required since it only looses 10% of the charge in one year of static use. Interesting.
Ballistic Performance 8 Cell EVO2 Battery - RevZilla

And the 12 cell is only a little more $ and has a whopping 410CCA and 20AH at just 2.5 pounds. Ballistic Performance 12 Cell EVO2 Battery - RevZilla

[Elombard]

Awesome. I know its rediculous to worry about a few pounds in a mostly street car but I love the technology and its part of the fun.