911 Engine Management Kit

[darud35]

Thanks for sharing David. John is a great guy! Really passionate about the business and helping others. He's making a Sudebaker that's unreal..monster twin turbo V8.

[David Borden]

Originally Posted by darud35

Thanks for sharing David. John is a great guy! Really passionate about the business and helping others. He's making a Sudebaker that's unreal..monster twin turbo V8.

Yeah that Studebaker is unreal... Talk about a sleeper

[evan9eleven]

Originally Posted by evan9eleven

Looks great, Andrew. I love the plug and play aspect-- how much fine tuning on the dyno should customers expect to do once everything is installed and running with the provided programming?

I'm definitely interested in knowing more (also pricing) which we can do via PM or email when the time comes.

Hi Andrew, just a little bump. Can you comment on my question above? Thanks.

[darud35]

Evan9eleven sorry I missed this! Thanks for the reminder.

The base map has been set with my 2.7L with the stock CIS, and I'm dialing in a set of PMO ITB's at the moment. The ITB setup seems to be the focus of my customers, and the maps for this are quite different than the stock CIS manifold.

The main changes you should expect to make will be VE (volumetric efficiency) and ignition timing. I'm creating a tutorial as part of the kit installation document that will outline my tuning method. To give a brief overview:
-VE is straight forward using the AEM software. You will do a pull using the base map, and it will tell you what you're new VE values should be. Depending on how far off the initial values are you may need to do a few iterations of this table.
-Ignition timing is a bit more involved for the tuner. Typically this is done by ear or some knock sensing device (knock ears, knock sensor, ridged wire connected to the engine to feel vibration, etc). This is somewhat of a controversial debate. Personally I tune by ear, and tune the high RPM/high load points on a dyno. There are many shops out there that will support a few dyno runs for a reasonable fee (~$100).

Let me know if there are any other questions you have. Feel free to shoot me a PM or email for pricing at Andrew@rasantproducts.com

[darud35]

Wanted to share some exciting news with the fellow Pelicans, the Rasant Engine Management system is now up and running on a set of 46mm PMO ITB's! The combination of this Engine Management kit with ITB's has completely transformed the otherwise stock 2.7L. Throttle response, acceleration, and sound are as if it's a completely new engine.



With these installed on my engine it offers a much better baseline calibration for those who want to install with either ITB's or the stock intake manifold. Either route is sure to please! I will upload more photos and dyno data soon with the ITB setup.

We have our introductory offer extending to the end of the year. Please email me for pricing on your vehicle.

Best regards,
Andrew Darud
Andrew@rasantproducts.com

[evan9eleven]

Thanks for the reply Andrew. The ITB setup looks awesome, can't wait to see the data on it. I just sent you an email so we can talk pricing and details. Cheers!

[sithot]

46mm carburetors would drown a 2.7. I'm impressed!

Anxious to see the data.

[sp_cs]

That certainly looks good! Is there any loss in low-midrange with the ITBs? Hopefully your dyno plot shows before and after

[darud35]

Thanks guys! Yes, the 46mm ITB's probably aren't ideal on a 2.7L.. The next build started that would really showcase the Engine Management System (ITB's on a twin-plug 3.5L). While waiting on cams the ITB's went on my 2.7L . Here's a sneak peak of the new build:



Even the 46mm ITB's are working very well on the 2.7L. There's a small amount of lag when going WOT at very low RPM's but I'm working on tuning to improve it. Everything above ~2000RPM is improved and that's with minimal tuning time. This is really a testament to the capability of the Infinity ECU. Very interested to see the dyno data as well!

Andrew

[safe]

Engine bay temps.

As Sal stated, its almost ambient in the engine bay during running. At full speed the fan is drawing in 1500 liters of air every SECOND!!

It sure gets hotter when you shut down, but then the ECU isn't on so it will handle higher temperatures.

I have had my ECU in the engine bay for almost 10 years now, not the infinity but Emerald, byt I think that translates to basicly any system. Its way cooler in an aircooled enginebay than in a convensional car.

[darud35]

Safe, it's completely up to the end user if they would like to place it in the engine compartment. I certainly understand your points, and don't see an issue during operation. It's only a risk in the case when the engine is shutoff and heat soaks the engine compartment.

I'm only sharing my opinion. With the cost of an ECU it's not worth the risk (to me).

[Gillies]

Subscribed !

[David Borden]

Are you using MAP or TP for your fuel table with the new ITB? When speaking with the guys at AEM they recommended TP as the primary and MAP as secondary for elevation when going ITB.

David

[JmuRiz]

Very interesting, I was/am debating the CIS/carb/EFI options on my 2.7. Once I do a leak down test I'll do an SC grind cam swap and start the final steps on induction.

I'll shoot you a mail for detail$, with my fingers crossed the leak down is good.

[jpnovak]

Originally Posted by darud35

Even the 46mm ITB's are working very well on the 2.7L. There's a small amount of lag when going WOT at very low RPM's but I'm working on tuning to improve it. Everything above ~2000RPM is improved and that's with minimal tuning time. This is really a testament to the capability of the Infinity ECU. Very interested to see the dyno data as well!

Andrew

Great progress. The hesitation is mostly due to the large swept area of the 46mm throttle plates compared to the ingested air requirements of a small motor at low rpm coming off-idle and closed throttle. There are ways to tune around it but you have to be creative. In a high speed datalog it should register as a lean spike.

You are very correct that the fuel requirements and map/table shape for common plenum and ITB are very different. Amazing what good resonance tuning can do.

[darud35]

Hi David, good to hear from you! I started tuning by MAP alone which of course was erratic on the transients. Then I started including TPS compensation for enrichment/fuel cut on throttle transients (very easy to do with the AEM Infinity). This seemed to work well.

I was also suggested to try tuning by TPS. I updated my tune and have been running this configuration for about a week, and it seems to be marginally better than the MAP + TPS compensation. It could still use some refinement however.

I will keep trying both configurations and report my findings. That's a good point about elevation. I'll have to take it up to the mountains one of these weekends to see if one prevails.

Nathan, thanks for the email! Hope to work with you on your 2.7L + ITB's. I'm sure you'll be happy with the results.

Thanks Jamie! That explanation helps quite a bit. I can improve data log frequency by logging on a USB memory stick, rather than the PC. It would be interesting to see if that helps narrow in what portion of the maps will address the lean tip-in.

[evan9eleven]

Andrew, reading this thread has really got me interested in EFI again though I must admit I am a novice and still at the stage of gathering information and trying to understand what challenges I might face with doing the swap. As I mentioned in a previous post the tuning aspect is a concern for me though it sounds like you have this covered.

In reading ddifferent sites on the web and posts here on Pelican, I've come across a lot of differing views and solutions. Could you help me to understand the differences between your kit and the other options on the market?

Thanks!

[hawaii83cab]

Just sent you an email Andrew.

[darud35]

Hi all! Sorry for the delay on emails this weekend. Had a big life event...got engaged to a great girl! Now competition with the P-car really begins

Evan, that's a great question. I can certainly understand the ambiguity when looking at all the options out there. Several companies have "kits", but they aren't all an equal level of completeness or technology. I'll mention some of the benefits of the Rasant kit and things to look at when comparing your options.

Benefits of the Rasant Kit:
The biggest difference is that many kits are not complete nor intended to be "plug-and-play". While this can be ok for some, it's important to know what you're getting yourself into. There are a lot of other components that need to be purchased along with extensive labor time. When you start adding up the pieces you need to complete these kits the Rasant kit is very affordable and comes with a much more advanced ECU! Also, the user interface of the AEM Infinity computer software is very convenient. I provide documentation with each kit and support for any questions you may have.

Things to look for:
-Are fuel injectors included?
-Are fuel lines, fuel pressure regulator, or fuel fittings included?
-Do you also need to buy spark plug leads?
-Does it include a complete harness? (this requires special tools and could easily be a 15 hour job of crimping terminals, wrapping the harness, taping, etc)
-How recent was the controller designed? Many of the options out there include technology from over a decade ago!
-Is it simply batch fire ignition/fuel? Some kits only include a crankshaft sensor. The distributor adapter in the Rasant kit provides both cam and crankshaft signals. This allows the engine to know exactly what stroke it's on (power, exhaust, intake, compression) not only what position they're at.

I'm happy to help with questions you have along the way. Hope this clarification helps you and others who are debating the kit. I have some customers out there I'm hoping will chime in with their feedback soon!

Thanks,
Andrew Darud
Andrew@rasantproducts.com

[David Borden]

Andrew, CONGRATS on your engagement, thats awesome news!!

For some just looking at this kit, I know its been mentioned before, but its important to keep one of the most important features of the Infinity ECU on top of mind. The engine protection strategies!

If the engine goes lean, it can automatically pull timing, limit RPM or whatever you want it to do. If you install a fuel pressure sensor and at any time start loosing fuel pressure due to a bad filter, dying fuel pump etc, the ECU will automatically start adding fuel and keep the mixture in check.(till you reach the limit of your injectors flow rate)

If any of these issues occur, the ECU can be programmed to throw a warning light.

It has built in knock control as well and its reasonably easy to tune once you have sensors installed.

For turbo owners, with an ethanol sensor, the ecu can automatically adjust timing and boost to compensate.

Also, unless its changed, traction control along with many other features is included without additional cost.

Many of these features may not be included in the plug and play portion of Andrews kit... BUT they can be easily implemented in the ECU. its all there and ready to take advantage of when the time comes.

Andrew, hope you dont mind the post. Let me know if you want me to edit anything.

David