3.3 turbo, any way this can be a daily driver?

[Kurt B]

I am at a crossroads with the Carrera. It's time to take it in for a full inspection. I know the engine will need money dumped into it. I'll sell it with full and complete disclosure for a 3.3 turbo because 207 HP, or even 217 if the chip makes that much difference will never be enough, and if I have more HP after a rebuild, what's the point without turbo flares and a turbo tail? Turbos look meaner than any other car on the planet.

I drive to and from work each day in the daily driver, which would be any potential turbo.
1) It's 14 miles in 40-50 minutes, and sometimes, although rarely, an hour.
Should I just shelve the idea completely on these grounds?

Stupid question number 1)? Can I reduce the boost at times and raise it at others, or better yet, let it run NA at times and turbo charged at others?

How much should I be looking to spend on a 78 or 79? I know an 86 or later will be totally out of the question.

I know this has been discussed, but I need to really come to a decision on this.

And finally, how many miles do you get before a turbo rebuild for the 78-79 years. Is it really only 70k even if you baby it 90% of the time? I just can't believe this.



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84 Cab

[RarlyL8]

You will probably get a wide range of opinion on this subject.

I have known turbos to be driven daily, be aware of the upkeep expenses. An often driven 930 is usually not abused and will last longer than a weekend power slut, mileage wise anyway.

I see no reason to reduce boost. You can short shift and keep it low all by yourself. The longevity depends on your driving style and attention to maitaining and tuning.

A very nice low mileage '78/79 can be had for $25K to $30K. A freind of mine has purchased a 25,000 mile '78 garage queen for $25K. He immediately removed the engine and had it built up to ~400HP. He drives it every day and has put 30,000 additional miles on it in a year and a half. No system related problems so far. The car has also seen DE events, auto-x, and drag racing.
Pretty tough machine.

[rvanderpyl]

Sure you can drive everyday. The turbo boost isn't going to come in unless you spool up the revs, the turbo lives longer when it is driven and not left sitting and the lifespan of the turbo (not the motor, the turbo) is around 30000+ miles given normal use and as long as you cool it down properly after you do get on the boost. The only problem would be the normal thing with a Porsche and commuter traffic, the constant clutch work. But you already do that. Not driving a turbo is harder on it than driving it. Of course the real danger is of the other commuters running into you because they're staring at the car instead of looking where they're going. And then theres the parking thing.

Robert

[beepbeep]

Mine 930 has 153000 miles on it's neck w/o engine rebuild, with raised boost. No major problems yet (i hope), usual leak-thingies , 3:rd sync is veary. You don't need to lower the boost, as it won't matter for longevity. Just don't use it too much. Turbo-lag is pretty long for 930 so you'll know when you are in boost-mode, trust me. Engine has very low compression (7.0:1 depending on model) which makes it:

1. Low-stressed if driven off-boost.
2. Thirsty.

Few things are against it as a daily driver:

It's a hard ride (Very hard suspension, different type than 911 SC). It has 4-gears with very tall first gear. It's very thirsty.

Otherwise, no problems. It's not quite the same car as 911 SC, it's mucho faster (300 HP stock), it's not as responsive and it doesn't like to rev hard. (300HP @ 5500RPM)

It's a cool car nevertheless ... and it should be as it was originally sold for twice the price of vanilla 911 SC.

Here's mine 81' (the black one, white is 77'):
http://195.22.79.154/temp/bilmedstil.jpg

After 80' they stroked the engine from 3.0L to 3.3L and added intercooler, with 40HP bump. There are some minor differences as well.

If you baby it and don't sit in traffic jams to much, it should work. I usually drive @ 1500RPM's when in town, just toddling around and trying no to shift that much.

3:rd gear sync is usually busted.

And yeah, parts are mucho $$$...

Cheers!

[Jim T]

I don't think an '86 would be totally out of the question. They are actually a much better value on the market than the earlier cars. 86s seem to command maybe $5k more than the earlier ones. I see them in the low $30s all the time. It is a much newer car, and I think you'll have better luck with it as a daily driver. (Better AC/ventilation, etc. etc.) The extra $$ spent up front will be worth it, IMO. A $32k '86 is a much better deal and value than a $27K '78, IMO. Esp. for a daily driver.

14 miles in 50 minutes each day, though, being the primary use of the Turbo, I suppose I would have some questions. The maintainance, insurance, etc. is more, and at those speeds, you are not really getting any use of the turbo engine!

If you keep your foot out of it, it doesn't really go into substantial boost.

[Kurt B]

I'm surprised at the opinions so far! Thanks, I'm going to get on this then. Turbo or bust!
This time, I know how to go about the purchase with a ppi before I do anything else.

[Jim T]

86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87, 86/87 (that is supposed to be hypnotic and subliminal)

[88911coupe]

I've got a friend who used his 88 Turbo Cab as a daily driver for 5 years and loves it but just bought a 95 cab w/ tip since he's in LA and shifting gets old. Maintenance was pretty high but not shocking. I just drove it from Venice to Santa Barbara and was surprised how easy it was...I guess I expected it to be a lot rougher than my 88 Carrera. Also, barely saw the boost come on unless really pushing it. Its for sale if interested.
Buck
88 Coupe

[Turbo]

Kurt

I originally started looking for a mid 80's Carrera until a test drive of an 86 930 left me glassy eyed and grinning like a fool. After a full year of searching I found a deal on an 89 930 and now use it as a daily driver. I would recomend one to any who love to drive. IMHO it is the best daily driver that has ever been produced. In traffic and around town it is mild mannered and easy to live with (under 4k), but no other car can match the feeling when there is room to stretch it out. The only downside to them is the money thing.

Jeff
89 930

[lukeh]

I will disagree with most of you on this topic. If you drive 14 miles (each way?) in 50 minutes you are averaging about 20 miles per hour. I assume this means lots of stop and go driving. I think that is a waste of the car. This car is made to run like a race horse. Driving this car like this would be like putting Man O War on a pony ride. Sure, you can do it, but why? I have always been told that the worst thing for a car is stop and go driving. Don't do it to a turbo. Don't get me wrong, I have an 88 turbo cab and love it. But I also own a Honda Civic that I bought for $1000. It has 176,000 miles on it and gets me to work just fine. It also gets 42 mpg. The turbo comes out on weekends and on the track. If you go ahead and do this anyway, you could get a boost controller to turn the boost up or down. However, if you drive 14 miles in 50 minutes, you will never see boost anyway. In that type of traffic if you ever hit max boost you will be running into the back of cars every few minutes. Also, try and get an 86 or newer. The old cars have very poor exhaust and you would want to upgrade to full B&B right away. This will reduce lag and the car will run cooler. Also, once you start the mods on these cars it will never end. Next will come a k27, larger intercooler, sc cams, 1 bar spring...... Before you know it your at 400 hp. Believe me , I know. Get a turbo, you will love it. But don't put the car through that daily torture of a commute.

[Early_S_Man]

Kurt,

If you want something that beats the feeling of a turbo going thru the gears ... go for a ride with Jack Olsen or Jack McAllister!!!

Numbers(times) dom't tell the story of the feeling and sound of an engine geared with the 7:31 ring & pinion ... and the music of the exhaust note above 4000 rpm with an early, equal-length tuned exhaust! If you haven't ever driven an early car ... you don't know what you have missed!

Just go drive any early 'S' or 911E ... hear and feel the magic when the 'E' comes on the cam at 4000, or the 'S' at 4500 ... listen to the song of the MFI stacks!!! No turbo ever matched that sound, just as none of the turbo 917s ever matched the wail of an MFI 917 singing on the Mulsanne Straight at 8400 rpm! Look and listen to Le Mans ... through a stereo cranked up 'til the walls shake, and ask yourself why a turbo can't make that kind of music come to life?
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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
1992 Dodge Dakota 5.2 4X4 parts hauler

[This message has been edited by Early_S_Man (edited 10-04-2001).]

[5axis]

Luke and I have the same thought's. Buy the turbo but save it for the fun stuff. I have my beater eclipse that get's to do my dirty work. A turbo on the boost will make a VERY LARGE RV seem fuel efficent. I also insure it as limited use and enjoy some nice savings there too. Warren, turbos have their own high pitched song. I can just hear the faint whine of the turbo over all the racket as I blast through the air at 150+. Kurt take one for a spin and you will walk to work if you have to.

David 89 turbo cab

[Turbo]

It all really comes down to the root of Kurt's question. Is the 930 cabable of being a daily driver? The answer to that is yes, replying earlier that IMHO it was the best daily driver ever produced. Some will argue for the early 70's which may be true (I have never driven one), but if you have the choice of getting the car you really want to drive each day, try both .

Jeff
89 930


[This message has been edited by Turbo (edited 10-05-2001).]

[Bruce M.]

I'm with 5axis and lukeh--you could use the car as a commuter, I suppose, but why? It's like using a sledgehammer to drive a penny nail--it works, but it's overkill. My '78 930 is only an occasional commuter, and night-time "date" car (the wife kind of date, that is). Otherwise, it comes out when I want to get my ya-yas out.

Couple of other things. Beep-beep is right on the changes but wrong on the years. The biggest changes between '76-'88 happened in between '77-'78. The '78 car has the intercooler, a 3.3 engine, etc.

I continue to believe the '78 and '79 cars are the best, IF you are a tinkerer and unless money just doesn't matter. They are the lightest, their basic mechanicals are almost identical and they are relatively cheap. I got mine for $25,000 a couple of years ago. Great platforms for mods.

As to sounds, to each his own, but every time that bypass valve flutters on a full throttle shift, with that air-cooled rasp in the background, I smile. It's like a reflex.

[pbs911]

It could probably be legitimatly argued that driving any P-car is over-kill in commuter traffic. With that said, I have a smile on my face the entire time I get in the P-car to go to work, and everytime I leave work in the P-car. It's up to you. In my neighborhood I see several turbos used as a daily communter. For those who posted with 930 it appears the car will hold up well in stop and go traffic. The simple fact is the cost will just be higher. If you don't mind the cost, go for it. You only live one, and life is to short to not to enjoy every day. Just my .02.

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Paul
78SC Targa
My Pelican Parts Page

[erikg]

I drive my Ruf 930 every day to work, and although not as bullet proof as my 85 carrera was, the fun by far outways the additional costs. The milleage also dropped in half, but a short burst on boost makes it worth it every time. I do have a Ruf 5 speed instead of the 4 speed, which helps since I don't have that very long first gear, and the gear ratios make it a little more comfortable around town. So the answer to your question is "YES"