SC wide-body conversion project

[runner4fun]

I just picked up an SC 'turbo look" M491 option car. I plan to redo the car into a poor man's Singer. I want to replace the existing whale tail with a 964/993 rear deck-lid and electric spoiler. Can someone please direct me to the forum thread that discusses the steps to complete this project? Thanks

[75 911s]

Welcome! I wouldn't. Here's why. M491 are really starting to be a thing. I would love one and I would want to keep it a short hood turbo look (well I'd drop a turbo in it!)

A Singer is a long hood, backdated 964 with custom ....er everything. To get a similar look, you need to backdate, which means getting rid of those lovely front fenders, hood, rear bumper etc.

Find a rust free midyear or a fender bender'd 964. Is the SC trashed? Then I might be behind your plan. Also doesn't the m491 have a lot of the turbo good bits like suspension etc?

A good backdate is 20k - 40k depending on paint.

Can we see a pic of the SC?

Here's an old DIY 964 tail conversion page... I think the guy that offers the kit is named mark.. search mark and 964 decklid

[runner4fun]

Thanks for the quick reply. I do not plan to change from the short hood to the long hood. I like the short hook look, particularly on the wide-body turbo look car. I just want to swap the whale tail for the later 993/964 electric spoiler, as i think the whale tail detracts from the coupe lines. I also may replace the flag mirrors with the 993 aero mirrors. I plan to have an old set of 16" Fuchs that I pulled off my 1985 cab years ago rebuilt into 17" Fuchs with the RS style matt finish. I also plan to refreshen the interior with square weave carpet and leather Sport S seats from GTS Classics.

[runner4fun]

The M491 has the 930 turbo body flares, front spoiler and whale tail, the turbo suspension and turbo brakes. The car I got has fresh black paint and is basically in stock form. It's beautiful. I will post a photo if I can figure out how!

[jamesjedi]

I think the first year of the M491 was 1984 or 1985. SC will most likely be a conversion. The M491 would have come with the 930 brakes and the 930 trailing arms.

Unless documentation says differently, which should be obtainable through Porsche.

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by jamesjedi

I think the first year of the M491 was 1984 or 1985. SC will most likely be a conversion. The M491 would have come with the 930 brakes and the 930 trailing arms.

Unless documentation says differently, which should be obtainable through Porsche.

I had that question. Never heard of an SC M491?

[runner4fun]

Correct. The first year in the US was 1984 for the M491. This is a late model 1983 European SC with the M491 option. I had the same question when I first saw it. I also plan to swap the motor for a rebuilt M64 993 varioram 3.6L motor.

[tirwin]

Originally Posted by runner4fun

Correct. The first year in the US was 1984 for the M491. This is a late model 1983 European SC with the M491 option. I had the same question when I first saw it. I also plan to swap the motor for a rebuilt M64 993 varioram 3.6L motor.

The Red Book states that M491 was an option for the SC on pg 68. I always thought that was a typo.

[RSF964]

Search for member Matt-Man, he custom makes the hinges you'll need for this.

[Coastr]

I'll register my protest at touching an early m491 if it is a genuine documented example. That is an incredible rare car if factory wide body sc and the Porsche world would be a better place if it and it's parts were kept together.

Can't you find a normal sc or mid year and weld some flares onto that? There is a modified sc on BaT with a 3.6 in it. That would make a much better singer clone base.

[runner4fun]

That was my original plan, just find a nice SC or 3.2L Carrera and have my way with it, but then the SC wide body fell in my lap. I figured it came with most of the modifications I planned to make already in place: flares, big brakes, turbo tie rods and calipers/vented rotors. All I had to do was drop a 3.6L motor in the car, redo the interior, add RS style Fuchs and away I go. The has already been slightly altered with Gotti Etoile 15" wheels replacing the original 7" and 9" Fuchs and a non-original front air dam. Other than that its stock. Now you're going to make me feel guilty for planning my project!

[Coastr]

Well the way I see it is - if you found an original split window 356 coupe would you update it with later 356c parts? I saw someone who had a 4 cam 356 speedster that someone had hot rodded with a mix of parts. They were painstakingly putting it back right but finding all the rare parts was a pain and time consuming. Same goes for early turbos - lots had the later whale tail and 3.3 fitted hen it is very hard to find the correct tail and 3.0 turbo.

An early sc from the special wishes department is ridiculously rare. I would be finding some original Fuchs and front air dam for it and unfit it back, then sell to someone who wants an original car and go find an sc with a 3.6 and some existing modifications and weld some flares on that.

[runner4fun]

I really respect that perspective, as I am inclined to the period correct all OEM approach. I have an all original un-repainted 1985 cab that is fully restored and bone stock. I rebuilt the motor and redid the interior. I've always wanted a coupe and to build my own version of an OEM very strong driving car. The SC car had been in storage un-driven for 9 years until my seller bought it a year ago, installed a new fuel pump, painted it and planned to make some changes. A family event necessitated his sale, and I bought it immediately when I saw it for sale.

[quattrorunner]

I agree with others. And I’m a mod guy! Fit what it needs to be correct, sell that for a premium which I’m sure you’ll get and finance your hotrod.

[Canada Kev]

It doesn't sound like he's making it into a Singer clone. A 964 engine lid is a bolt on piece, reversible in about a half hour. The only thing that's not so easily changed back is the switch to raise and lower the spoiler. I suggest you think very carefully about where you plan to put that; interior mods are often very difficult to go back to original if you start cutting holes in the dash for a switch.

The wheels are nothing and the front spoiler is easy to put back. Personally, I'd not switch out the mirrors for the 993 aero ones.

The V-Ram engine? Your call, and it'd sure be nice to have that power, but, again, I'd suggest you don't sell the original to finance the swap. Mothball it and keep it. Just like with all your other original parts.

Just from this post, Id guess this won't be your last 911, and a 491 would be far more valuable with all the original goodies when you pass it on to another caretaker.

And for the record, I think that the wide body cars look sweet without a big spoiler. With the 964 lid, you'll get the aero benefits and the clean w i d e look when it's retracted.

Good luck and and think carefully about any permanent changes you make to a very limited numbers car in that good of condition. Or go with what Coastr and others have suggested.

[runner4fun]

I would not alter the dash in anyway. Interestingly, the gauge faces are white and beautiful. The plan for the spoiler switch was to install the stock manual switch from a 964 or 993 which is on the floor (I believe). In addition to the change to the 993/964 rear spoiler and the 17" RS style Fuchs, the "permanent changes" I have in mind include (i) the 3.6L variorum 993 motor; (ii) square weave carpet and the retro style sport seats (the car now has very worn sport tomb-stone seats) and a Momo prototipo steering wheel. (The car has a Momo steering wheel now which I don't like.) I'm debating the side mirror swap as I have the flag mirrors on my cab and think they're cool.

[Canada Kev]

If your original carpet is in good condition, keep it. Carpet comes out pretty easily if one wanted to replace it. Same with the seats as they just bolt in. Keep your originals and they can be refreshed and reupholstered if required down the road.

The 964 had the switch for the spoiler in the centre console. Depending how stealth you wanted to go, you could mount it wherever you wanted that was readily accessible. I have this picture for a good location for mounting a switch on the removable panel at the front of the seat base for aftermarket seat heaters. You could do something similar for the spoiler and not modify anything original (that couldn't be put back to stock easily).

[runner4fun]

Thanks to everyone for the helpful perspective and good discussion. I promise i won't ruin the car!! cheers

[Craig_D]

Originally Posted by runner4fun

The M491 has the 930 turbo body flares, front spoiler and whale tail, the turbo suspension and turbo brakes. The car I got has fresh black paint and is basically in stock form. It's beautiful. I will post a photo if I can figure out how!

Hey bud, welcome. Sounds like a beautiful car and an excellent plan! Can't wait to see the before and after pics!

Oh, here's how to do that. You can click on "Post Reply", or "Go Advanced":



Once the advanced reply window opens, click on the "Click here to upload photos":



You can drag and drop photos from your desktop, or navigate to them in a folder.

I hope that helps!

Cheers,

- Craig_D