Help...mysterious starting problem

kevinseven · 06-04-2003, 07:47 AM

So I go out to my car last night to head home and my 1975 1.8L won't start. I've got an Optima Red that's less than 6 months old and it was giving out plenty of juice. Only the starter wouldn't engage.

I remember another 914 leaving me stranded at a gas station because the PO had jumpered the seatbelt relay. After a couple of highway hours the wire had vibrated loose and the car refused to start. Long hunt but quick fix.

My current car still has the relay in place. I could hear it clicking. I pulled it, jumpered 50 to 30 or 50 to C...whatever Haynes says but still no starter.

I wiggled the key.

I messed with the battery terminals. But still no go.

So I fired up my new AAA card and had it towed about a block to my neighborhood Porsche shop to sit over night. I called them in the moring and told them where I hid the key and they said they'd give it the once over.

About 15 minutes later they called to tell me, you guessed it, that it fired right up. Doh!

When I came by to pick it up, they had it on a lift to check the connections at the starter but could not find anything wrong.

Any ideas? Bad ignition switch? Some relay I missed? I don't look forward to getting standed again.

John Rogers · 06-04-2003, 09:35 AM

Was there a click at the starter? If so then the starter is probably failing which can happen at random times. This happened on our stock 1974 914 and if I wacked the starter with a rubber mallet it worked fine. I bought a hi torque starter. It could also be the key switch which can be bypassed sort of like hot wiring it to see if the switch is failing. Good luck.

HMeeder · HMeeder's Garage

They are notorious for going out. After 30 years sometimes the wiring has difficulty conducting the current necessary to trip the starter selenoid. 2 solutions (if this is your problem) 1-add a hot start relay (this allows a much lower amount of current to trip that selenoid) or 2-install a remote start switch. One way to check if this is your problem; next time it occurs get the car jacked up on the left side, secure with a jack stand, put the car in neutral, leave the ignition off and then with a length of wire 'jump' the hot cable on the starter (comes directly from the battery) to the selenoid switch terminal (typically a yellow wire, around 10 gauge or so.) If you've never done this before, the noise from the starter engaging the flywheel will scare the bejeesus out of you. If the starter engages the flywheel just fine, then it may be the ignition switch. If it doesn't, suspect the starter.

rdupre@houston.rr.com · 06-04-2003, 12:36 PM

I also had a similar problem about two years ago. After doing all that was recommended above and installing the hot start relay kit, it still occassionally refused to start. Eventually I traced it down to a loose connection in the ECU.

Evidently somewhere along the line the connector was not placed back on sufficiently because I've never heard of one working itself off. Nevertheless, once I pushed it back on everything has worked fine.

toman · toman's Garage

Sounds exactly like what my car did when the ignition switch started to go bad. Couldn't figure it out for the longest time, and it just kept happening more and more often. *note* I figured out what was wrong after it finally shorted out and almost burned my car down.

kevinseven · 06-05-2003, 06:04 AM

Sounds like I'll start with the ignition switch. At least it's cheap. Thanks guys.

Dave at Pelican Parts · Dave at Pelican Parts's Garage

It isn't that cheap, and you'll spend a good bit of time doing the swap. And it might or might not fix the problem.

Check the "starter troubleshooting" article in the Tech Articles section of this very website. If you can get the starter to fail again, that ought to let you pinpoint where the fault is. Could be the ignition switch, could be something else. (Are all the connections from the battery to the ignition to the starter through the chassis to the battery all nice and clean??)

--DD

914turbo · 06-05-2003, 11:59 PM

Had a similar prob with a '74. You might want to cut the big leads at the seat belt relay base and solder / crimp then together. Found corrosion on the terminals and up into the wire leads themselves. PO had put a teensy jumper wire in. Jumper wire needs to be large guage (look at the size of the big leads and match that) other wise, you are adding resistance to the circuit.

tod914 · 06-06-2003, 05:36 AM

Kevin,

I just went through that with my 75. To replace the ignition switch, you have to remove the steering column. Unlike the 74 and below, the 75-76 column has a solid plate there so the only way to access the switch, it is to pull the column off the shaft, and remove it from the back. This means removing the steering wheel bushing to pop it off. If you think thats the prob, order a new steering column metal bushing and shim kit while your at it. I ended up replacing the starter on mine. The starter is a breeze to replace. You can get a rebuild with lifetime waranty for about $125 with a core replacement. I would start with that and then the ign switch. Worst end case, you have a new starter and ign switch.

kevinseven · 06-06-2003, 06:07 AM

Ouch. I remember replacing an ignition switch on a 1974 I had and it wasn't too bad. But to hear that the 75-76 is different has me worried. Thanks for the warning.

Of course the car has been working flawless since that one incident. Lulling me into a false sense of security.

Does anybody remember a post about someone who found a better way to replace the switch. I have a vauge memory of reading about how he could do it by the book and it would take 4 hours. Or he could drill out a screw (that was going to be replaced anyway) and pull the switch out from the front in like 15 minutes. Maybe I dreamed it.

tod914 · 06-06-2003, 06:28 AM

Its really only another 30 minutes worth of work from the 74 style. The reason I didnt complete mine was, I couldnt remove the shim that was placed in to tighten up the wheel bearing. Theres like 4 bolts holding the column onto the dash, and then the bearing needs to be removed/pulled out. I didnt have the right tool to pinch it in to remove it. The only other tip - remove the two rubber washer lines that connect to the wiper from the back before trying to take out the wiper and turn signal assemblies. you cant remove them with out disconnecting the rubber lines.