Hello, Introduction and Newbie questions.

[DuckRyder]

Good Morning Board,

An Introduction and Newbie questions.

Hi my name is Robert and I’m a car junkie. I have a 1980 BMW 323i and a 1980 Callaway Intercooled Turbo 320i.

Recently I acquired 2 914-4 for a very good price (*cough*Free*cough*) allow me to tell you about them. One is nice one is a parts car. The nice one was purchased by my father from a local doctor who purchased it new. It was originally silver, but the doctor decided to paint it yellow and they did a very nice job for the most part, he also had AC installed but it has not worked for the time I’ve known the car. Now the problem is that the last time the car moved, I moved it and that was about 8 years ago. It has been parked (inside) other than that short trip for about 15-18 years. The main reason it was parked (then) is that it has a rather strange electrical problem which causes it to stall and not restart (usually when you need to be somewhere) it’s as if you switched it off. The general consensus back then was that the jetronic control unit was bad. Opinions? (I’m thinking dual 44idf) (this is my main question)

Both of these cars have 2.0-4 engines, one has an new top end with euro cylinder and pistons. The heads were reworked as well. However there is apparently a stripped fitting of some sort in one of the heads. (I need to investigate). It also has a set of SSI heat exchanger.

The car is very nice and completely rust free. It is a 74 or 75 factory 2.0 (big black bumpers, weird catalatic converter/muffler set up.) . The parts car is a 72 or 3 and was originally a 1.7or 1.8.

My plan here is to get it running and driving with the better parts and try to get the A/C to work. Eventually I would like to do a -6 and 5 lug conversion which I spent the better part of yesterday reading about. (I’m thinking 2.7 carb)

[paulhagedorn]

If the body on the 72 or 73 is still good, I would consider getting that up and running.

The one that you say is the good one is a 75 or 76 as it has the rubber bumpers and a very bad exhaust system(cat and very restrictive). I honestly don't know much about that fuel injection system. I would offer help, but I don't know how much help I would be.

What part of Atlanta are you in?

[DuckRyder]

I'm about 20 mins south of the airport on I85.

The 72or3 is VERY rusty (as in its going to fold in half real soon)

The later car is really nice. My dad is just too busy to screw mess with it. I have the parts (but I can't remenber which style the are the ssi heat exchangers) to convert the bad exhaust to the earlier 2.0 type. In fact, yhink those are the ones on it right now.

[Bleyseng]

Welcome to the list!
On the FI problem....When the car stalls does the engine have spark and fuel? Does it smell like tons of raw gas at the tailpipe?
The ECU rarely go bad but that always seems to be the first thing to get blamed! Drive the car until it does stall and then go though the check list making sure it has spark and is injecting fuel...

It could be that it just has bad grounds so clean to like new condition the ones on the engine, underneath the the relay board, the tranmission ground strap and under the fuse box.

Do get a better understanding of Djet FI go to Brads website at members.rennlist.com/pbanders and read the troubleshooting section.
Switching to carbs doesnt improve performace at all just a new set of problems!
Geoff

[paulhagedorn]

I forgot a couple of things you could try. First, replace the points and condensor! Second, set the dwell then set the timing. Not sure if the tool Pelican Parts has will work with L-jet, but I do know that they have a diagnostic tool that they can loan to you to check all of the little FI bits. I used it to check my D-Jet '73 2.0. Maybe some day I will come visit your teener and help you with it. I am currently without my teener as it is at my parent's house in storage.

Some advice, stay away from Auto Atlanta. They will rip you off any way they can.

[JWest]

Paul, all 2.0s are D-jet. Only the 1.8s got the L-jet.

[RustyWa]

You should dump that '75-'76 914. Those things are junk. Nobody likes them. In fact I could probably work something out where I could take it off your hands for a couple hundred bucks... You pay me to haul it away of course....

[paulhagedorn]

Something tells me I should have known that....oh well, I will never have as much knowledge as our friend Dave D. Maybe I can help with the car more than I thought.

On a side note, it looks as if I will be selling my car. Anyone interested? 1973 914 originally had a 1.7l now with a fully rebuilt 2.0, many new electrical parts, lots of new rubber parts around top, two tops, one body color, new stereo with cd changer and speakers in the doors. Repainted Ocen Jade Metallic, was originally olympic blue. Has real 4 lug Fuchs, recovered seats, most of the rust has been taken care of, including redoing the passenger floor pan in several areas. New trunk mounts welded in before paint, Bumpers have been straightened and rechromed, has fog lights, about 10 to 15,000 miles on car since rebuild.

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

The 74s have the old (AKA "tinfoil", cause that's about how tough they are in an accident) bumpers. The 75-76es have the Rubber Baby Buggy Bumpers.

On a car that has sat for a looooong time, the first thing to do is to change all of the fluids. Engine oil, tranny oil, brake fluid, and fuel. Yes, fuel. It's probably old, nasty, and gummy by now.

There's a decent chance that the whole brake system will need to be rebuilt.

A little Marvel Mystery Oil (or other favorite) down the plug holes can help fight some of the rust that is in the cylinders.

All the fuel hoses and vacuum hoses should be replaced. Vac leaks cause annoying driveability problems, but fuel leaking at ~30 PSI onto the exhaust can ruin your whole day.

The "sudden shut-off" sounds electrical to me. The power lead to the coil might have a fault in it. It's almost certainly not the ECU for the FI; those things are nearly bulletproof.

A slightly-easier to read (partly because it has less info) page on D-jet EFI is: http://www.914fan.net/djet.html .

--DD

[DuckRyder]

II think I will try to drag it out in the next few weeks. I'm aware of all the problems with it sitting for so long. The last time it was driven was so I could overhaul the brakes on it. I seem to recall that I put non hydroscopic fluid in it. (ATE super blue) but I'll have to double check.

I think my first step will be to access what we have, I know it has no rust, and that the paint and interior are basically in the same shape they were when it was parked.

I know about the rubber problems and fluids. I also need to repeat all the old diagnostics. and see what I come up with on the stalling. We switched parts one at a time way back and never helped it. (remember this is very old recollection.)

Thaks for all the replies so far.

[Dave at Pelican Parts]

ATE blue, like all other Glycol-based brake fluids, is indeed hygroscopic. The silicone-based fluids are not, but it requires a complete overhaul of the brake system to use them, as seals that have been exposed to glycol will fail when silicone is used with them.

The silicone fluids are also generally not recommended for anything other than show-cars that are never driven.

--DD

[DuckRyder]

I looked at the cars today the “good one” is a75. It has the engine and trans out of the 73 in it right now, has stainless early style heater boxes on that motor with an old non descript glass pack type muffler. My dad put that one in when the stripped fitting in the “good engine” began to leak. Car is showing 71000 miles and has never “rolled over”.

My opinion has always been that it’s electrical problem. As I said it is as if you switched it off, no spitting, no sputtering and no warning. It will crank but not start after. It goes away as mysteriously as it appears, and seems to have no temperature / time / weather pattern. The car may do it 3 times in one day or might go several weeks without acting up, which makes it pretty hard to diagnose. There appears to be no pattern of any kind to it. It does this no matter which engine is installed. (Which should effectively eliminate most of the injection and ignition system). I have never believed that it was the Jetronic Control Unit either, my dad was told that was the problem by those guys who are close to us that used to be the only game in town. Do the ignition switches go bad in these things a lot? It acts a lot like 320i’s act when the switch goes bad? As far as I remember neither of us thought to try the wiggle the key switch trick. Again considering the time that has passed since either of us worked on it, our recollection is that it has neither spark nor fuel when it quits.

In the next few weeks me and my buddy will head over to dad’s and get the “good car” out of the garage, change the oil, trans fluid and fuel, pull the plugs and apply a little Mystery oil and/or PB blaster to the cylinders and see if we can get it to run at all. (As a note, all it took when I moved it last time was a battery.) If I can get it to run, I’ll bring it and the spare motor home. If I have to do anything to the brake system (other than fluid) I’ll be looking to go ahead and do the 5 lug / Carrera brake swap.

If we can get it road worthy then I’ll run back through all of the diagnosis and see if we (meaning me and you guys here) can figure out the problem. My preference would be to get it running with the injection as I’ve always said I would never convert a properly operating fuel injection system to a carburetor set up.

Any one with any clues or “common failure mode” comments (or any other for that matter) feel free to chime in.

And to the gentleman that offered a few hundred dollars............... UMMMMMM...... NO!

[rockaria]

Here is my .02:

Ignition switch going, going... almost gone!

I just replaced mine and those cracks in the switch can do wild things. Sometimes it works, sometimes it does not, sometimes the car just quits on the freeway. It was the ignition switch.

Maybe?

[DuckRyder]

Running this back up to the top.

See also "The Rescue"

Ignition swith huh, how would one check that out (without just replacing it), any test for the common failure mode?

How much and where?