of turbos, headgaskets, and catastrophic engine failure

[todwic]

Yep

Apparently blew the headgasket on my '86 951 and didn't know it. I had a leaky hose and she got a little hot. I noticed the temp climb and I shut it down before the gauge came on and the idiot light came on, so I didn't think there was cause for alarm. Replaced the hose, filled the tank, and toped off the rest of the fluids while I was at it. Burped the system like a good owner should, and overfilled the oil level half a qt. because I have a leaky pan gasket.

I have had the car long enough to calc. the oil leakage so that I know when to start checking it based on driving habits and mileage. This was on a sat. Drove back and forth to work all week (@30 mi./day), and Friday I heard a slight ticking sound by the time I got to the shop. 12 hours later I had forgoten that morning and started to drive home. The tick grew louder. Crap.

The knock sensor kept the KLM on default. Yep. Pulled over and saw the water level on the exp. tank, or, rather, the lack thereof. Checked the oil level and it was full. Unfortunately, it was full of milkshake. Bad Todd. Bad.

So now I'm waiting for the tax check to buy another engine. I relate this tale of woe and stupidity to enighten others who don't know any better. And those who know better and do it anyway.

[list=1][*]After any repair, esp. one involving fluids, be paranoid about the levels of said fluids.[*]Check yer oil at least every other day. Every day is better. Paranoia pays. [*]Don't drive vehicle after milkshake is detected. Someone on this board had posted about milkshake in oil, and asked what he should do. Several folks told him to stop dirving, make repairs. He kept driving, and then asked "why did my car quit running?" Juvy tore into him, rightly so. [/list=1]

[AFJuvat]

Ahh yes, I remember that post.....Nipzz or something like that I believe.

and the one that started it all.

Oil cooler seals

another...

oil pressure sending unit

and yet another...

oil cooler help????

THE END

help engin is knocking!!!!!!!!

Todd - really sorry to hear about the turbo. I would try to clean it up first - you may get lucky before you drop the load on a new turbo motor.

Give me a hollar if you need a hand (3AM is ok too....)

AFJuvat

[ronin]

now that was good entertainment

[PCA 944]

There's nothing wrong with a milkshake. Just ignore it and keep driving. Not like anything will happen.....

Wait. Was there a moral to the story?

[livewirevoodoo]

Mmmmm... milkshake... strawberry...


Todwic... sucks to hear man. But at the moment, other than the headgasket, how damaged do you believe the engine to be that it needs replacing?

[todwic]

Originally posted by todwic
The knock sensor kept the KLM on default.

By this I mean it's phuctup. I had the radio up pretty loud and still heard the knock. Having already killed and then rebuild and engine in these cars, I'm pretty savy about what it sounds like when it's dead. I'm so busy with work, I don't have time to rebuild the engine, and where I live doesn't allow engine rebuilds in the driveway.

[todd84944]

I just sold the engine I had!!! We might have another one coming up soon. It won't be as new as the last one, but will still be pretty nice. Drop me a line, when the Gov. drops you some bucks.

[DannoXYZ]

todwic, you should confirm the headgasket. Do a compression check. Headgasket failures do not leak coolant into the oil. It causes the water to disappear out the tailpipe. All that water in the oil is probalby due to the oil-filter housing seals. Intense heat cause those seals to fail and they leak. I've seen 5 cars that's done this and none of them have a bad headgasket. Just two bad 20mm seals. Do a compression check and we'll know for sure.

[todwic]

Far be it for me to refute the Danno. Juvy, SoCal, or Brit care to refute this?

[todwic]

Sorry, Danno, that's good advice, but it's really academic. engine is fubar.

[DannoXYZ]

So what's wrong with the engine? I'll take it off your hands. Will pay for shipping and all.

[todwic]

Got an engine for sale? I'm in the market.

[AFJuvat]

Todd,

Do the compression test.

Can't hurt.

AFJuvat

[livewirevoodoo]

todwic - theres a '87 turbo engine listed on the for sale board

[todwic]

Yeah, I ceded that it was good advice. I'll do the test. It's just that I've heard that sound before. I came from an '84 944 that I heard once. Rings came out in several peices. It'd be great if ya'll were right.

[DannoXYZ]

Sorry no built-up engines. I've got 3 in pieces and various states of terminal damage. One of them had all four sets of rings completely cracked and I didn't even hear any sounds.

[Lawrence Coppari]

Didn't realize there could be water/oil mixing on a turbo engine in the vicinity of the oil filter housing. Would someone please elaborate.

[DannoXYZ]

There is a sleeve that connects the block to the outer filter-housing. This serves to bring oil from the pump out to the housing to the filter. On the ends of this sleeve, there are O-rings to seal against the surrounding water jacket. Heat from an overheating engine tends to ruin these O-rings and cause the water to invade the oil-passages; thus dumping all the coolant into the oil.

Another source of problems with this sleeve & o-rings occur at re-assembly. There is an inside and outside end to the sleeve and some people get them mixed up. The outer end is the one with the groove for the O-ring closest to the end. I recomment the following procedure for installation:

1.Install new O-rings onto sleeve, apply some RTV or Loctite-574 or Yamabond-4 over the O-rings.

2 install new filter-housing gasket. Can use some sealant to hold in place

3. insert outer end of sleeve into oil-filter housing first, seat it fully.

4. line up housing and sleeve with block and push straight in, rotate to line up bolt-holes

5. install bolts leaving last 1mm unthreaded,

6. align oil-pressure-relief valve hole by rotating assembly, tighten bolts. DO NOT pull out the housing for whatever reason. If you do, the sleeve will slide off the housing and cause leaks. If you do pull back on the housing, pull the entire aseembly off and re-insert the sleeve fully into the oil-filter housing. Then go back to #3

The main problem is that the sleeve is slightly shorter than the space between the housing and block. But there's only a narrow lip on the housing to seal. So if you install the sleeve into the block first, or install it backwards, it's going place the outer O-ring too far inwards to seall fully against the filter housing.

I know of numerous people that's been afflicted with mixing oil & coolant after an engine-rebuild. I did it on my 1st engine rebuild and Huntley did it on Gabe's engine (guy from Santa Cruz). We tried everything on that car and had a engine-rebuild party at Bill's house in Gilroy. Rebuilt that engine again and still mixing. Replaced the turbo, still mixing. So he had his car towed all the way down to San Diego to Anderson's shop for a 3rd rebuild where the problem was finally discovered.

[Lawrence Coppari]

Thanks for posting explanation.

[todwic]

Does the turbo manual cover this procedure? If so, is the manual correct? That's a lot of rebuilds for one engine. bet there were several red faces around that hood.