RUF CTR Conversion, Value discussion

[speednme1]

It’s pretty simple...W09 Ruf’s are cars built from “body in white” shells at the Ruf shop carrying Ruf vins.

Next(WP0) is a conversion, whether done at Ruf or a Ruf Authorized dealer. The paperwork will determine the extent of the work and possibly the value(depends on the condition of the car).

Then we have the tributes. Some cars may have a few parts while others may have almost everything (parts..including transmission) Ruf offered back in the day.

It shouldn’t be that hard to determine what you have.

[Mocker]

Rey, didn't the US Ruf authorized dealers allow the customers to choose what Ruf bits they wanted? My car was serviced by PM Motorsports in Sacramento back in the day (they're the shop that burned down 10 or 15 years ago) and I have all the receipts of the work that was done. Included was an Andial intercooler and fuel enrichment system, bigger turbo, Euro headers/muffler and a Ruf 5-speed and oil cooler. Kind of mix and match, but I like it!

Of course, I would never claim it's a Ruf--it's a modified 930!

[speednme1]

Originally Posted by Mocker

Rey, didn't the US Ruf authorized dealers allow the customers to choose what Ruf bits they wanted? My car was serviced by PM Motorsports in Sacramento back in the day (they're the shop that burned down 10 or 15 years ago) and I have all the receipts of the work that was done. Included was an Andial intercooler and fuel enrichment system, bigger turbo, Euro headers/muffler and a Ruf 5-speed and oil cooler. Kind of mix and match, but I like it!

Of course, I would never claim it's a Ruf--it's a modified 930!

Yes they did. One can pick and choose but say for example, if you went with the BTR upgrade then you would get the entire engine kit. Your car sounds like a lot of fun

[Mocker]

Originally Posted by speednme1

Your car sounds like a lot of fun

Thanks--I've done a couple of further upgrades to bring it up to date: G35 turbo, B&B headers and muffler, Griffiths AC, stealth audio system. Pretty much all easily reversible back to stock (except for the cams and P&Cs that I forgot to mention earlier)...

I haven't taken the next step to do the suspension upgrades like the ones you did to your old Ruf tribute 930, but that may happen one day. Have a good weekend!

[speednme1]

Originally Posted by Mocker

Thanks--I've done a couple of further upgrades to bring it up to date: G35 turbo, B&B headers and muffler, Griffiths AC, stealth audio system. Pretty much all easily reversible back to stock (except for the cams and P&Cs that I forgot to mention earlier)...

I haven't taken the next step to do the suspension upgrades like the ones you did to your old Ruf tribute 930, but that may happen one day. Have a good weekend!

You too my friend.

[911heaven]

Originally Posted by Axel84

There was a Ruf developed six speed gearbox fitted too the CTR ,BTR, BTRIII from 1989. The R50.50

Transmission ratios
1st-3.500
2nd-2.059
3rd-1.409
4th-1.074
5th-0.861
6th-0.718
Reverse-2.857
Drive ratio-3.444

Same shell stripped and built up again, there is 0 difference between factory cars and conversions. RUF CTR is a ground up nut and bolt model.

Because there were about 55 original CTRs built, its history - 29 factory cars and 25 conversions, all using Carrera 3.2s as a base. No technical differences between the 15 cars with a RUF VIN and the 40 cars with a Porsche VIN. Half of the original CTRs had Porsche VINs, they ran out of blank shells!

I really hate to labor this, yet sometime before this thread actually bites the dust, it would be nice to know about Axel84's R-50 50 6 speed CTR RUF gearbox. I don't know if he's still on this forum, and I doubt he's listening, but if he is I would like to know more. If anyone else knows for sure, please chime in.

As per his post I quoted, he called this gearbox ratios, said from 89 into 3.2 chassies BTR, BTRIII and CTR. His part no. is 0070 and it is on his RUF docs. As I posted pix of mine from a BTRIII, my part no is 0081. Do you think they are identical components with the same ratios he posted even though his from a CTR and mine from a BTRIII?

If that is true, then isn't my box also a standard CTR 6 speed from the 89 MY era?
bernie

[JMS935]

Bernie, without knowing the answer to that I’d hypothesize that being 11 VINs apart might seem like you should be able to rely on it being the same model as yours, and if it were 11 VINs apart by Porsche that’d probably be a good assumption, but with RUF having such a small number that they manufactured, I’m not so sure that the same assumption would be correct. If you check Axel84’s profile, he’s still on here daily, so just PM him, maybe he can help.

[911heaven]

Originally Posted by JMS935

Bernie, without knowing the answer to that I’d hypothesize that being 11 VINs apart might seem like you should be able to rely on it being the same model as yours, and if it were 11 VINs apart by Porsche that’d probably be a good assumption, but with RUF having such a small number that they manufactured, I’m not so sure that the same assumption would be correct. If you check Axel84’s profile, he’s still on here daily, so just PM him, maybe he can help.

Good tip JMS93! I'll try that.
bernie

[Rawknees'Turbo]

Originally Posted by Bernard Plett

Good tip JMS93! . . .
bernie

???

!!!



Just the ?!?!

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by Rawknees'Turbo

???

!!!



Just the ?!?!

I’ve been told the rest of it is good too Raw. You sure are good at turning every thread into dirty talk, and I’m not referring to sugar britches giving us a dissertation on how to properly clean and polish your Fuchs.

[pmax]

There's a dirty joke in here but I can't quite pinpoint it !

Oil Add Trick

[911heaven]

Originally Posted by pmax

There's a dirty joke in here but I can't quite pinpoint it !

Oil Add Trick

It may be due to my late night red vino typo, which I apologize for, and it won't happen again.
(Just My Size 93, thanks for the tip!) Acronyms, angles and tips? I can't be sure. If you remember the joke I told Matt over New Years -- What did the leper say to the prostitute? Keep the tip!
Only in this case, she nuzzles up and whispers -- I love tips, but when can you drop off the entire fore skin? baby? He say OK, but no tooth scratches!

[Axel84]

Holy thread ressurection Batman.

Yes, I did not get what I wanted from my add on pelicanparts, however RM Sotherbys Paris sold the car for 390 dollars so it all turned out fine. Not gonna gloat however, a car is worth what someone is willing to pay and every valuation is a personal opinion I guess.

Bernard, small world - I Have a 1988 930 Turbo with a BTR 5-speed gearbox and also a 3.4 BTR Engine, with RUF stamped on the engine case. I think it was converted in Japan. I think the engine needs a rebuild though.

If you are interested in the engine give me a PM.

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by Axel84

Holy thread ressurection Batman.

Yes, I did not get what I wanted from my add on pelicanparts, however RM Sotherbys Paris sold the car for 390 dollars so it all turned out fine. Not gonna gloat however, a car is worth what someone is willing to pay and every valuation is a personal opinion I guess.

Bernard, small world - I Have a 1988 930 Turbo with a BTR 5-speed gearbox and also a 3.4 BTR Engine, with RUF stamped on the engine case. I think it was converted in Japan. I think the engine needs a rebuild though.

If you are interested in the engine give me a PM.

That’s confusing Axel84, wouldn’t the engine block only get stamped RUF if it were a RUF (W09) built car, not a conversion (WP0) done by others?

[Axel84]

It could have been stamped by a RUF agent doing the work in Japan - This is 80s remember and things were done a bit "a la carte" - Im not able to verify either way but its a 3.4 litre and mated to the engine is a very real RUF BTR gearbox!

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by JMS935

That’s confusing Axel84, wouldn’t the engine block only get stamped RUF if it were a RUF (W09) built car, not a conversion (WP0) done by others?

People talk about Ruf like they only did things one way. If the car owner doing the conversion wanted an all new engine, he got an all new engine. Ruf wasn't going to force him to do the build on his stock case. They were just as happy to ship a new crate engine over from Germany as part of the build.

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by Matt Monson

People talk about Ruf like they only did things one way. If the car owner doing the conversion wanted an all new engine, he got an all new engine. Ruf wasn't going to force him to do the build on his stock case. They were just as happy to ship a new crate engine over from Germany as part of the build.

I’m fairly certain that wasn’t a thing back then, nor is it even today. They sell engine upgrade kits (or packages), not fully built crate engines. I guess it’s possible they did so on occasion for repeat customers, but it definitely wasn’t the norm - then or now. Engines were (and still are) shipped to RUF for their conversion and then shipped back to the customer once completed, but they don’t offer a crate engine program, at least one that they advertise anyways.

[Axel84]

in the 80s things were done as they were available, including having their own stock of engines ready for modification or sourcing one for a customer - anything was possible - for a price. then and now.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by JMS935

I’m fairly certain that wasn’t a thing back then, nor is it even today. They sell engine upgrade kits (or packages), not fully built crate engines. I guess it’s possible they did so on occasion for repeat customers, but it definitely wasn’t the norm - then or now. Engines were (and still are) shipped to RUF for their conversion and then shipped back to the customer once completed, but they don’t offer a crate engine program, at least one that they advertise anyways.

You've never ordered off the menu?

I didn't say it was a thing. I'm saying that it wasn't always according to "the catalog" that people are looking back on today like they are reference materials. Like Axel said, anything was possible and it was done.

Obviously I have a lot more direct experience with the gearboxes than engines, but I've seen everything imaginable on them, regardless of what the books say. There are even a few 930 based 6spd gearboxes floating around out there.

Ruf, IMO, originally was more of a mad scientist than a coachworks. As his company matured and formalized it became more standardized, but dude was a hot rodder. That's where he came from. He became a tuner and manufacturer as he grew up.

[Axel84]

to add to that - any idea that the 80s rufs were somehow the spearhead of exquisite finish and fit are having a laugh.

Like you say, they were hot rodders - my RUF CTR was taken down to the metal and my coachmaker and painter said look at this shoddy filler quality - I can tell this is original because I swapped the roof on a a CTR last year ( with a real w09 VIN) and the filler style was the same! the cars were made to go fast, they were NOT singer-finish cars!