Did haggerty value go up again?

[speednme1]

What is the big deal? If Hagerty values the car at $1 million dollars tomorrow how does that hurt us? If it was a negative I can understand the negative comments but it's a positive problem to have. Hagerty(like others) offers AGREED VALUE ! You don't have to insure for top dollar...just what you feel comfortable with. This works very well for most of us who have spent a small fortune on ours cars. Holy beejezus...who give a rats manure as long as the values keep going up. If Hagerty was saying that the best 930 is worth $25k...then and only then should we be concerned...otherwise..let it go!

[krasuskyp]

>>>facepalm<<<

Brian hit the nail on the head - here we go again. Jeesh.

Especially ^this utter rubbish being spewed above here^ from Mr. Changes His Screen Name for ??? reason (not you Rey / Ronknees).

PAINFUL

and, it has surprisingly not yet been pointed out - *this convo belongs in the _M_A_R_K_E_T_P_L_A_C_E_ section of the forums*

[Ronnie's.930]

Originally Posted by speednme1

What is the big deal? If Hagerty values the car at $1 million dollars tomorrow how does that hurt us?

Rey, I can only speak for myself, butt I don't think anyone is saying Hagerty's ridiculous value scale hurts us, butt that it is deserving of derision considering the scale is absurd and not based on reality.

[bpu699]

My only question when starting this thread is how Haggerty's values have gotten completely out of whack...

Not arguing our cars are great...

Or that they are worth 100k-ish.

Or that we shouldn't under insure them...

But Haggerty says a driver is $180k... and a parts car is $130k...

And there is just NO WAY that comes close to reality. Its not like they are 5-10% off... they are 100% off... at least for a 1987 car...

There are plenty of 930 on here for less than 100k... and I don't think they sold. If they are worth 180k as a driver, they should have been gone in a heart beat...

So, I pose the question again... what is Haggerty smoking?

My car is a driver... But I could probably get it close to a #2 car with some slight body work/a repaint/some original bumpers/etc... Should be easily doable with a topnotch paint job for $15,000... Does that then make my car worth $230k?

I would LOOOVEEE for my car to be worth $230k...

[speednme1]

Originally Posted by Ronnie's.930

Rey, I can only speak for myself, butt I don't think anyone is saying Hagerty's ridiculous value scale hurts us, butt that it is deserving of derision considering the scale is absurd and not based on reality.

The absurdity is happening across all brands. Ferrari is probably king of absurdity when it comes to values. Are they really worth their asking price? As of late I'm getting a lot more interested in an Alfa GTV stepnose and their values as of late have been ridiculous. E30 M3 prices are ridiculous. Now I say the prices are absurd because those are the cars on my bucket list. Truth is I may be wrong, the prices are what they are...and I need to accept that.

Usually reality and insurance don't go hand in hand. The Classic car insurance companies beat to their own drums, so it's not surprising to see high valuations. Example: I called my insurance company to find out the top coverage on a 67 Alfa Stepnose...they said as long as I prove what I paid for it, they would insure me for the amount paid...even if it exceeds their posted limit.

[Ferraripete]

Originally Posted by 93097004xx

Can't lump 78/79 in with the later cars. Totally different market. Totally different beasts too. Early 3.3s drive handle and accelerate totally different from the tamed down later year 3.3s.

After 100s and 100s of 930s selling at $75,000 $100,000 $300,000 we are still having this debate... A nice stock 930 is $75,000. A show car is worth into the low 100k range.




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so the early intercooler cars were more explosive than the tamer 86-88 cars? well my father owned a 76 930...I drove it plenty. I had a 78 turbo for 6 years...I drove it plenty as well. I have had my 87 for 13 years and it was always stronger in every way than the 76 and 78 fact. my tame 87 lol...

[Ferraripete]

sorry for the distraction as this is a haggerty valuation thread. had to protect the honor of the lowly 87 turbo compared to the Rambo early cars

after years of racing cars and motorcycles in scca, imsa, wera, ccs and ama...I can defend my assessment of whether one car is quicker than another

[930cabman]

Yes, the market for the 930 has changed over the last short amount of time.

I would prefer to be over insured as to under insured

The actual value to any car is whatever somebody will shell out

THREE TRUTHS, just my .02

When its all said and done, they sure rock on many levels. I am not sure if I like the way our turbocab looks, or sounds or drives the best??

Happy Holidays to all

[MZ3 SBC]

I am relatively new to these discussions. Seems like the the bid ask is wider than the Haggerty Values represent....but there has to be a basis for thier valuations. I don't think it's an attempt to arbitrage 930 preimiuns...that will not move the needle for them- someone else pointed out that they would overstate values across the board if that was thier MO...to at least do it with a more popular brand?

Until reading this thread- I was putting more credibility into EBAY as a proxy for the value..but will discount that as the 'market' moving forward. Perhaps there are 'flipper' and cars of 'questionable pedigree'" on EBAY and the poor results of the auctions are on account of the vehicles represented?

I bought mine unaware with an objective to enjoy it and bring it back to its glory after a few decades of neglect. The more I own it the more I am getting into the restoration. Unfortunately - if the "suspect " values are remotely attainable...I might have to whack the bid because I need a driver car. My History has proven that cars are a consumable when I get my hands on them....not an appreciating asset!

Hopeful??

FWIW- 78 930 went for 130K at Mecum / Kissimee ( programmed aired yesterday - not sure when auction was held).

[zakira]

Originally Posted by Ferraripete

lol...I have no problem when my good taste in cars is affirmed when the market or market experts say my car's value is rising. I got lucky with my 308 gtb, my 512 bbi and my 930...market likes each of them

So jelly. Especially the BB.

Don't understand why some people are angry over being overvalued.

[reed930]

Nothing wrong with using eBay to determine values, at least as far as asking prices. There are many reputable dealers selling 930s on there at any particular moment. And I'm knowledgeable enough about these cars to make a pretty good assessment based on photos and description.

The take away? Hagerty's values are a pipe dream. Not even a question. There are some VERY nice 930s being offered in the marketplace right now in the low- to mid-$100Ks. I mean very nice cars with sub-30K miles.

[JacobS911]

Originally Posted by zakira

So jelly. Especially the BB.

Don't understand why some people are angry over being overvalued.

I don't think anyone is getting angry about being over valued here. I think some are scratching their heads on where Hagerty is getting their numbers from to justify the rise in valuations. Guessing they're using actual data though from sales.. maybe

[RarlyL8]

It is legitimate to be angry about being incorrectly valued. I'd hate to be the poor sap who swallows this $hit and pays $100K for a driver 930 only to find if he has to sell it that he cannot recoup his "investment".

[JacobS911]

Originally Posted by RarlyL8

It is legitimate to be angry about being incorrectly valued. I'd hate to be the poor sap who swallows this $hit and pays $100K for a driver 930 only to find if he has to sell it that he cannot recoup his "investment".

Agreed. I was looking at it from a current owners point of view rather than someone looking to buy or just made a very recent purchase.

[zakira]

People overpay things in life, I've done it, too. It happens.

[Tug68]

Just had my 87 appraised last month by an appraiser that is used by my insurance co. A few here know my car and the shape it is in. All original paint(paint metered by appraiser) all performance bolt on's and a g50 trans. When all said and done it came back at $90k from the appraiser.

[IMR-Merlin]

Originally Posted by Ronnie's.930

^^^

Claiming to be a successful salesman does not prove that you know anything about these cars, which you clearly do not, and there is nothing to "get done" as I have never once expressed an interest in selling my car.

I read a bunch of books on MMA and know some guys that fight MMA.... So now I think I am ready for the Octagon....

[Ronnie's.930]

Originally Posted by Tippy

Based on the eBay 100k cars that never sell, I believe is what Ronnie is referring to.

^^^ This, and also how members here list 930s in the Pelican "for sale" forum for "high" prices (much less high than the Haggerty guidelines which are definitely the result of being high) and they do not sell (like other posters in this thread have mentioned).

Originally Posted by cover

I don't think you can substract any solid information from eBay.

First of all, 930s are generally not eBay material anymore.
An nice 930 offered on an eBay auction will appear "fishy" by definition now.

Furthermore, there is so much going on behind the scenes that it distorts the appearance of things.

I disagree that no solid info can be gleaned from eBay - maybe just not info that supports Haggerty's claims?

Someone lists a 930 on eBay (regular Joe dude or dealer) for a high price and it runs for weeks/months/years and remains unsold - that is useful information.

Not sure about the "behind the scenes" distortion, but one thing that probably has contributed to the values stupidity is the fact that some oddball 930 examples have sold for big money (aka - ones that have been parked in garages under car covers since new, and ones that have seats filled with the farts of famous previous owners - that gets some folks all wooded up and ready to pay more). I guess if a few have sold for $300K plus then that means all examples are affected by the oddballs - is that how some insurance companies think? Seems really dumb, if so.

Originally Posted by krasuskyp

Especially ^this utter rubbish being spewed above here^ from Mr. Changes His Screen Name for ??? reason (not you Rey / Ronknees).

Good thing you clarified that, Paul, as I was preparing to female-dog-slap you, again!!!

Originally Posted by IMR-Merlin

I read a bunch of books on MMA and know some guys that fight MMA.... So now I think I am ready for the Octagon....

Ha ha! No doubt!

[speednme1]

Originally Posted by RarlyL8

It is legitimate to be angry about being incorrectly valued. I'd hate to be the poor sap who swallows this $hit and pays $100K for a driver 930 only to find if he has to sell it that he cannot recoup his "investment".

Many ways to look at it. If a buyer pays $100k today and wants to sell tomorrow ...he or she may take a bath. If he or she sells 5 years from now...they may do well on their "investment". Truth is no one really knows. Color, options and condition vary from car to car. When one finds the "right" one for them. They may have to pony up the coin today. It's not like one can just run to another dealer or private seller and find the exact car that matches their previous want. Some buyers are not flexible. They want what they want. The days of the excellent $35k 930 are gone for now, may not ever return. It is what it is. Most never really pay too much...just too early

[cal007]

Careful about values from Hagerty.
In you read the condition they refer to, there will be hardly any "1" in the market, even a "2" will be hard to find, some "3" may be around (they would be a "1" with the German condition descriptions) and a "4" would mostly be a driver ( but a good one). That is hier the Hagerty condition description appear to me.
Taking this into account, the prices become a bit more realistic.
For past 1977 models the values seem not to be realistic though.

In the financial times the 1974 to 1977 models just were called as blue-chip models. Like it or not this is likely to boost those models on the next price level....

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