F1: 2019 thread

[Turbo_pro]

Unsafe reentry or unfair advantage.
If what we're now talking about is an unfair advantage (Vettel's intentional move) why not offer Ferrari the chance to swap places.
If racing is the goal, the hero move from the stewards might have been a position swap. If Ferrari refused, then impose the penalty.

If Vettel got an unfair advantage, surrender the place and race for the victory.
Fans win, F1 wins and the stewards get a chance to be relevant without being ridiculous.

[svandamme]

a gap means, a space thas is roomy enough for a car to pay through
Do you see such space here?



Is sure as hel don't, Vettel closed it.
Hamilton is so close to the wall, he can't move out another mm to find more gap

please note , that the room is closing on whatever gap there already is, making it even smaller.

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by Turbo_pro

Unsafe reentry or unfair advantage.
If what we're now talking about is an unfair advantage (Vettel's intentional move) why not offer Ferrari the chance to swap places.
If racing is the goal, the hero move from the stewards might have been a position swap. If Ferrari refused, then impose the penalty.

If Vettel got an unfair advantage, surrender the place and race for the victory.
Fans win, F1 wins and the stewards get a chance to be relevant without being ridiculous.

I don't get it, that's exactly what happened.. they swapped places.

So not sure how your suggestion would do different?

[svandamme]

Vettel used up all the space he could to block
He clearly could have held left more but that would have meant Hambone would have taken #1 spot.
Vettel closed the gap when he should have yielded after going off track

His angle changes after he comes back on the track, and it changes away from the direction he was going, to move closer to the wall then he would have if he had kept his steering wheel straight.

[oldE]

Stijn,
Looking at those images it looked to me like Vettel was pretty much a passenger for about 100 meters.
I think the underlying problem has been the Ferrari gets loose in the rear end in some situations. We've seen it before in other races where Hamilton forced Vettel into an error and the car's balance is so fine he lost the rear.
I was watching the telemetry in the last 8 laps and noticed any time Hamilton dropped back he had made up the time very quickly. I also noted LeClerc was catching both Hamilton and Vettel in those last laps.
I wonder if Ferrari told Charles to not get within 5 seconds of Sebastian.

Best
Les

[aston@ultrasw.c]

Watching at normal speed it appears to me as if Vettel goes off, rejoins the track and regains control (just), then makes a move to close the gap to the wall.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt

What we got from Toto was "virtue signaling". "It's only RIGHT". Mercedes lobbied for the penalty and got rewarded for their efforts.
It would have been the height of hypocrisy to then mollify the decision.

Sorry, that is not what I was referring to. The announcer asked Toto what he would have done when he was a driver and then made a suggestion, to which Wolff replied something to the effect that he didn't know what he was talking about and that he (Wolff) was never put in that position as was implied.

I know that's vague and I'm not going to review the interview just to prove that you are not close to addressing my comment.

[legion]

If Vettel's rear end was loose, wouldn't it oversteer and not understeer?

[oldE]

The incident started when the rear of Vettel's car broke loose. He counter steered to keep it from looping. That took him over the grass (or painted surface ) and it looked to me like he just kept it out of the wall on the other side.
I'm surprised he didn't collect Hamilton. Lewis backed off enough to avoid contact. Amazing driving from both.

Best
Les

[450knotOffice]

Originally Posted by svandamme

I don't get it, that's exactly what happened.. they swapped places.

So not sure how your suggestion would do different?

In the scenario he suggested, the swap would've been immediate. From that point on they would have been free to race; for Vettel to try to regain the lost position.

But this...

This was stupid. They added 5 seconds to his time, so all Ham had to do was stay inside of 5 seconds and he would win.

Horrible decision and horrible show for the fans, who after all are the point of all this. The race literally was over as soon as the stewards handed out their lame decision.

And as far as Toto, of COURSE he's going to defend the verdict. He runs the Mercedes team and it is war out there. Gotta do what he's gotta do.

[chapo]

F! used to settle differences on the track, now it is whiney ***** fests. They are all making so much money that Mercedes and Ferrari play nice. Racing is better when more is on the line and nobody plays nice.

[chapo]

I like how I was auto corrected for the word b/it/c/h. This board is losing it as well. 1984 is here get in line

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by 450knotOffice

In the scenario he suggested, the swap would've been immediate. From that point on they would have been free to race; for Vettel to try to regain the lost position.

But this...

This was stupid. They added 5 seconds to his time, so all Ham had to do was stay inside of 5 seconds and he would win.

Horrible decision and horrible show for the fans, who after all are the point of all this. The race literally was over as soon as the stewards handed out their lame decision.

And as far as Toto, of COURSE he's going to defend the verdict. He runs the Mercedes team and it is war out there. Gotta do what he's gotta do.

They don't do that because such a swap is immidiate admission and then they can not appeal it anymore

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by aston@ultrasw.c

Watching at normal speed it appears to me as if Vettel goes off, rejoins the track and regains control (just), then makes a move to close the gap to the wall.

he was slowing down and already had plenty of track under his wheels he was powering out and steering right to close the gap

[CurtEgerer]

It is telling that the 'incident' is the most exciting and talked-about thing to happen in F1 in years. Up until the incident, this was another major league snoozefest. TV were following midfield battles in an attempt to show something - anything! - competitive (i.e., "camera 2, get on that battle for 15th place. Now!"). Had the incident happened in the 70s/80s, it wouldn't have warranted a replay, much less the attention of the stewards.

[javadog]

Originally Posted by svandamme

They don't do that because such a swap is immidiate admission and then they can not appeal it anymore

I don’t think they can appeal a time penalty, either.

[URY914]

I thought the FIA and Ferrari were best buds? Everyone used to say Ferrari got treated special by them when it came to rules enforcement. Oh well....

[Clint Lando]

hamilton Wolff Mercedes got what they want

vettel Ferrari fans got screwed

[Clint Lando]

Originally Posted by svandamme

he was slowing down and already had plenty of track under his wheels he was powering out and steering right to close the gap

no

[cairns]

Vettel screwed himself by going off under pressure. Period.