Hell on earth

[speeder]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

The article doesn't state it, but I'm guessing their insurance company is making them do this.

The insurance company and his lawyer laid out the map for him on Tuesday, I’m imagining. The boat burned and sank on Monday. From a financial ruin POV, he has no choice but to try to defend himself from what is coming.

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

And I'm sure the company has a risk management officer who's working overtime now. Something of this magnitude is not gonna be a goodwill/handshake/sign-an-NDA situation. When the lawyers and insurance companies get involved, any tendency toward human compassion and right/wrong goes out the window. It's very sad in every aspect.

I don’t blame the boat owner for trying to defend himself but OTOH, (victims’ relatives position), I’d want to punish him and his insurance company severely if my loved one burned to death in that oven. Hope he had a lot of insurance, this one is going to break some records.

[speeder]

Originally Posted by Zeke

And lawyers were at a memorial in Santa Barbara drumming up business.

At a memorial.

WTF?

Yeah, legal jockeying didn't even take much more than a week as the boat owners have already received claims per the article you linked.

I saw that, about the lawyers at the memorial. Pretty classless but ambulance chasers need to beat the other ambulance chasers so what’s a snake to do?

Unlikely the boat owners have any say in the litigation. Lawyers are doing what they have to do.

But . . . I left the private practice of law for reasons like this. When you practice on behalf of private clients, there are times when you sign your name to things you wish you hadn't.

[bugstrider]

Just left the dive shop. Nine folks affiliated with the shop were on the boat. Everyone is pretty devastated.

No propane onboard, everything was electric. The O2 tanks and filling stations were all in tact.

I hope NTSB can determine the source.

We are all in shock


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[GH85Carrera]

One thing that I bet comes from this:

Every commercial boat with sleeping quarters will be getting a escape route, that is something realistic to get 30 people out in short order.

[tcar]

Originally Posted by bugstrider

Non propane onboard, everything was electric. The O2 tanks and filling stations were all intact.

No propane, no gasoline....

Probably no lithium ion batts other than personal devices charging...

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by speeder

I saw that, about the lawyers at the memorial. Pretty classless but ambulance chasers need to beat the other ambulance chasers so what’s a snake to do?

You nailed it. But I don't understand your position against the owner of the company. Surely there are more contentions. Where for example does the USCG fit in?

And how does one "punish... (his) insurance company?"

[bugstrider]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

One thing that I bet comes from this:

Every commercial boat with sleeping quarters will be getting a escape route, that is something realistic to get 30 people out in short order.

We can only hope. The stairs and escape hatch led to the same compartment that was fully engulfed in flames.

Different routing to different locations will be included I imagine.


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[greglepore]

Originally Posted by madcorgi

Unlikely the boat owners have any say in the litigation. Lawyers are doing what they have to do.

But . . . I left the private practice of law for reasons like this. When you practice on behalf of private clients, there are times when you sign your name to things you wish you hadn't.

dit fing o

[ossiblue]

Latest reporting, the coroner has stated that the victims perished from smoke inhalation, though forensics are still being run on tissue samples. Burns on some victims were postmortem. Evidence indicates that the fire started in the galley, which is directly above the sleeping quarters. It is also there where the lithium batteries, for personal devices and equipment, were being charged so the batteries have not been excluded. The surviving crewman who last saw the victims alive, left the sleeping area around 2:35 am after checking to see that the stove was cold and all flammables were safely stowed. As reported, the fire was first detected around 3:00 am.

What has not yet been reported is why a fire in the galley area would spread so quickly and with such intensity. The crewman who first discovered the fire stated that he was startled by a sound that made him think someone or something had fallen. When he went to investigate, he found the galley in flames and could not enter. Entry through the front was blocked by windows that wouldn't open.

[bugstrider]

In the galley, where everyone sits to eat and talk about the days dives, share pictures and videos shot is lined with padded benches and padded backrests. Between the two at where the small of the back would be is a cubby area with electrical outlets that allow folks to put devises to charge since it is lined with outlets. Invariably, that same area becomes a storage area for shirts, jackets and other things to be stored.

I am not sure if that is a factor but it “possibly” could have contributed to fueling the fire however it started. Added would be all of the dry varnished wood and the fuel is unlimited until fully consumed. This knowledges with regards to the seating comes from personal experience on the three dive boats.

I know it has been stated before, Truth Aquatics is/was a top notch operation held in the highest regards to all levels of diving. I know that may sound contradictory after the loss of so many people and so many families now devastated by this disaster. Forensic teams are unbelievably good at what they do and I just hope and pray they discover something that will prevent something like this from ever happening again.

Found a short video demonstrating how Lithium-Ion batteries react and what causes the issue. I am not saying this was the cause but it might cause some to rethink leaving items charging like power tools, cameras, gps, etc. even the little batteries cause significant fires, and it’s a chemical fire to boot.
https://youtu.be/YuKF8XfCVKQ

An article about the toxicity of such fires
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/319368068_Toxic_fluoride_gas_emissions_from_lithiu m-ion_battery_fires/fulltext/59a745590f7e9b41b7892228/319368068_Toxic_fluoride_gas_emissions_from_lithiu m-ion_battery_fires.pdf?origin=publication_detail

[Mahler9th]

A high school teacher from my neighborhood perished along with his adult daughter. I extend my thoughts and prayers to friends and families of the victims and the survivors and their families and friends.

The teacher that died was also a part of our local car community (BMWCCA). I raced against him early in my racing career more than 20 years ago.

Very sad.

[dewolf]

Surrounded by water and no fire extinguisher systems throughout the boat. Surely it wouldn't be that hard to plumb in a building type system while the boat is being built.

[rfuerst911sc]

Without knowing any or all the facts obviously we are all speculating on the cause . It may turn out that this is just a horrible accident and the boats crew and owner are not responsible . Unfortunately horrible accidents do happen . From all accounts this boat , the crew and ownership ran a top notch outfit and I'm guessing were inspected by the USCG on a regular basis to pass the required safety standards .

One thing that may come out of this is that the minimum safety standards are not good enough , as an example ingress/egress to lower decks . Or that fire suppression systems will be mandatory on boats of a certain size or with X amount of sleeping space below deck . I don't want to minimize the pain/suffering for all involved it is a horrible tragedy but it could ........ I repeat could just be an accident . I can only imagine what the pressure on the investigators will be to find the route cause of this tragedy .

[KFC911]

^^^ Agreed...looks to be a first class operation...accidents and tragedy happen....when no one is at fault imo. Live & learn from those that lost their lives....make changes.

RIP and condolences....

[drcoastline]

I think we will find it was just a horrible accident. As a charter boat it is a USCG inspected vessel with very strict requirements to pass inspection and remain licensed to carry passengers. Some of the inspections are very costly and invasive on a wood hull boat. It would have been required from time to time to be hauled and have random planks removed in order to determine if the fasteners were properly holding. A vessel like this would have had a fire suppression system, most likely Halon but, more likely than not it would have been in the engine room.

It is going to take some time to determine cause, but I think you will find the boat was in compliance and maybe even exceeded USCG requirements (of course this is all speculation).

The only issue I see (and it is not a violation) is the location of the escape hatch. I think it goes with out saying having it above a bunk is a bad location. Obviously it is not easily accessible and can become blocked by an incapacitated person or what may have happened in this case the bedding catching fire. In addition the hatch exits the below deck area into the same compartment as the stair case. We may find this fire wasn't as quick and sudden as originally thought but was burning within the galley for a little while heating the materials to just below combustion temps, then oxygen was introduced an exploding O2 tank, Nitrox, a window breaking or a door being opened causing a backdraft instantly igniting the pre-heated materials.

[ossiblue]

Something telling, IMO, from the above illustration is the fact that the ladder from the wheelhouse to the main deck was already on fire by the time the crew recognized the situation and they had to jump down from the wheelhouse. That, to me, underscores the rapid spread and intensity of the fire, given the ladder is outside at the aft end of the galley/dining salon. Since both the fore and aft exits where blocked by fire, that means the fire had engulfed the entire galley/dining area by the time it was even detected and no smoke alarms, apparently, were even tripped. I am also assuming there was a smoke detector in the galley area, at least.

Speculating, as we all are while awaiting the investigated facts, this appears to be a fire of unusual characteristics.

The L.A. Times published the pictures and short bios of the victims today. Placing faces and names with the number "34" brings this tragedy to a deeper level of sorrow.

[bmcuscgr94]

https://lompocrecord.com/news/local/coast-guard-issues-safety-recommendations-after-dive-boat-fire/article_106e40fb-5bc5-52a2-87aa-0549b707108b.html#1

[bmcuscgr94]

https://www.edhat.com/news/coast-guard-concludes-salvage-efforts-for-conception-dive-boat

[Vipergrün]

No one was on night watch. Game over for the captain, owner and company. A true tragedy, and perhaps speculation this could have at least been partially avoided had someone been awake.