Miami condo collapse

[nota]

Originally Posted by Joe Bob

They have vacated the sister building. Looks like the City will probably order it to be at least retrofitted/repaired or maybe even demolished before it can be occupied again, if ever.

The HOA Board should have had Errors and Omissions coverage unless Floriduh doesn't require it. I don't think the E&O coverage will be enough to cover the losses.

no the other building is not a sister but in a different area build by others ie no relation
there are two sister buildings both still occupied east and north towers

the condemned build is in north miami beach [on the main land ] as north miami beach
has no beach and is not on a ocean front island

[javadog]

I think it's a mistake to take the other part of the building down right now. The storm doesn't look like a factor and the side facing the rubble pile is the strongest part of the whole building.

I wonder who the "officials" are that are making these decisions, and under what authority... I also wonder if they will be exposed to liablity for any loss of contents not covered by insurance.

My brother owned a building of similar size that went through a very mild tornado. It got condemned, nobody was allowed back in, etc. All of that concern turned out to be nonsense. It's still standing several years later and at no risk of falling down. In the hysteria after the tornado passed through, you couldn't get within a quarter mile of it.

[nota]

still hate the condo's and the condo-maniac's who cause them to exist
as very few locals ever buy or live in them or have any use for the out of towners who do

but wonder if the prices will go up or down on them in a fear crash or not
local prices died long before the depression here starting even before the 26 hurricane

[nota]

the east building residents are calling for the building to be abandon
the gov city county or state is NOT condemning that building YET

the east building is part of the wrecked building complex but is NOT an exact copy
south fail one and north tower are the same

there is also another building in an other city that was gov condemned

[HobieMarty]

The building that was told to evacuate is in North Miami Beach and is called Crestview Towers.

The last reports I am aware of concerning Champlain was that the North and East towers were fine and had not had the water intrusion issues that Champlain South Tower had experienced.

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[dennis in se pa]

Originally Posted by javadog

That’s what it looks like to me, too. I’d be curious how close it was laying to the bottom of the slab. Also wondering if there was any rebar running the other direction.

Like they are Democrats and Republicans. Too close to top of the slab the argument is made that it did not have enough above it to hold he slab up. Too close to the bottom and it would fall out the bottom. I was not a structural engineer, I was a computer networked systems engineer, certified by Novell, Microsoft, and A Plus. So I will defer to someone more competent in this area, but it seems to me if the foundation had not failed there would not have been a failure.

[javadog]

Originally Posted by dennis in se pa

Like they are Democrats and Republicans. Too close to top of the slab the argument is made that it did not have enough above it to hold he slab up. Too close to the bottom and it would fall out the bottom. I was not a structural engineer, I was a computer networked systems engineer, certified by Novell, Microsoft, and A Plus. So I will defer to someone more competent in this area, but it seems to me if the foundation had not failed there would not have been a failure.

What we were discussing there has no bearing on what took place that caused the failure that led to the building falling. It was just an interesting observation from some of the photos that were published.

I would guess that the slabs in between the columns will probably be somewhere around 9 inches thick. They likely had both upper and lower mats of reinforcement steel. Ordinarily, you look for about 3 inches of cover as a minimum, for any rebar. Let’s leave aside the notion that the way that most slabs are designed pretty well guarantees that there will be some deflection/creep over time.

One thing that interested me was the possibility that the rebar may have been placed incorrectly, which might be symptomatic of poor construction quality.

The other thing was whether or not they ran rebar the other direction. I’ve seen instances where engineers left it out of the drawings, or contractors failed to put it in. It’s also possible that it was laid above the bars that pulled out, and is still there. Hard to tell without better photos.

[HobieMarty]

https://youtu.be/epNqN8kSmqU

Here is a live stream. From what I understand, the rest of Champlain Towers South is being demolished this evening!!!

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[dennis in se pa]

Originally Posted by javadog

What we were discussing there has no bearing on what took place that caused the failure that led to the building falling. It was just an interesting observation from some of the photos that were published.

I would guess that the slabs in between the columns will probably be somewhere around 9 inches thick. They likely had both upper and lower mats of reinforcement steel. Ordinarily, you look for about 3 inches of cover as a minimum, for any rebar. Let’s leave aside the notion that the way that most slabs are designed pretty well guarantees that there will be some deflection/creep over time.

One thing that interested me was the possibility that the rebar may have been placed incorrectly, which might be symptomatic of poor construction quality.

The other thing was whether or not they ran rebar the other direction. I’ve seen instances where engineers left it out of the drawings, or contractors failed to put it in. It’s also possible that it was laid above the bars that pulled out, and is still there. Hard to tell without better photos.

I’m hearing stories of shoddy workmanship in soflo back in the day.

[HobieMarty]

Check out what is in the garage!!!

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[javadog]

Originally Posted by HobieMarty

https://youtu.be/epNqN8kSmqU

Here is a live stream. From what I understand, the rest of Champlain Towers South is being demolished this evening!!!

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From what I’m hearing, it will be between 10 PM and 3 AM.

[berettafan]

Originally Posted by dennis in se pa

I’m hearing stories of shoddy workmanship in soflo back in the day.

back in the day?

Fla is where failed northern contractors go to make it big!

[dad911]

Now that the govt has made a decision to take and destroy the remaining units, do those owners get reimbursed for their pre-collapse values? Who pays for the cleanup, who owns the remaining property?

[javadog]

It might be years before all that gets sorted out.

[dennis in se pa]

Originally Posted by berettafan

back in the day?

Fla is where failed northern contractors go to make it big!

Lower codes = bigger payoffs for the admins from the druggies. I did run into one who moved to a fabulous mountain in NC.

[HobieMarty]

https://youtu.be/VGjFG5Lf6EU


Livestream view of the Champlain Towers South. Demolition to be sometime between 10pm and 3am est.
Notice the black skirting around the base of the building.

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[HobieMarty]

^^^ the viewpoint appears to be from the condo "Eighty Seven Park" which is right next to the Champlain Towers South condo.

Says "Pool video by WPLG"

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[HobieMarty]

https://youtu.be/kKcZN_m1YjQ

Another view provided by the "Sun".

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[A930Rocket]

It’s down. Wow.

[HobieMarty]

Originally Posted by A930Rocket

It’s down. Wow.

Yeah, clear shot from the Sun on YouTube. Workers walking around with lights now.

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