Spain: What can you tell me?

[Racerbvd]

[RWebb]

the hot Celtic type chicks are up north

the hot Arab type chicks are down south

as John Keats said, that is ye now about hot chick beauty and Spanish geography, and all ye need to know

[Jim Bremner]

Thread needs more pics

[motion]

Originally Posted by jriera

Motion, vacation, work, living?

I was born in Barcelona and lived in Madrid for a bit over a year ...

What do you need to know?

As always, you guys are full of.... good info

I'm beating myself up these days for living a complacent life in a too comfortable place, so need to start pushing my boundaries a bit. I guess I'd be interested in living there, but not sure of how the logistics would work. It seems romantically simple, but I know better!

I'm flying into Barcelona Dec 2nd. I plan on exploring the art and architecture for a few days, then meandering down the coast to the Marbella area. If I find a place that I fall in love with, well, then I guess that will make the decision that much easier

[motion]

Originally Posted by Paco Anton

There are several climates and cultures in Spain:

- The north is rainy but winters are mild (little or no snow)
- The centre is sparsely populated (except for Madrid). The climate is very cold in winter and the summers are hot and dry
- The Mediterranean coast is where you want to be. Summer is hot and winter is mild.

Currently the economy is worse than bad. Unemployment is over 20% and increasing. Housing prices reached a peak in 2008 buy have not reached the bottom yet because our laws do not allow to walk away from upside down mortgages, so we will need 3-5 more years to reach the bottom. Perspectives are bad asthe industrial base is weak and we do not have good exporting businesses.

Most places in the coast have been developed too much, so there are few quiet places. Also there are a few places where the foreign colonies (British, Germans, Norwegians, even Russians) are so big that they do not need to learn Spanish to go on with their lives.

Culturally you have a lot of history, museums, theaters, sights, etc. Food is very nice, and even world-class in some places.

Comparing to to France and Italy I'd say that it is more open than France although less modern and it is more civilized than the South of Italy, but much less developed than the north (Milan, Florence).

I'll be glad to help you with whatever you need. PM me and I'll give you my email and phone number if you wish.

Paco and Jordi, you guys are a great resource. I hope you don't mind if I PM you with questions....

What are your thoughts on quiet places along the Med coast between Valencia and Marbella? Is there such a thing as place that isn't too developed, has some charm, is a bit quiet, close to the coast, where I can rent a 1bedroom furnished place for say, $2K per month? That's pretty doable in high end places here in SoCal, but not sure about Spain.... I have no interest living amongst Russians or Germans... I'd like to take in the place and learn the language.

[Dottore]

Originally Posted by motion

I'm flying into Barcelona Dec 2nd. I plan on exploring the art and architecture for a few days, then meandering down the coast to the Marbella area. If I find a place that I fall in love with, well, then I guess that will make the decision that much easier

I hate to sound negative, but Marbella and the costa del sol is horribly overbuilt, and IMO truly the ugliest side of Spain. If you want to live among low rent Brits and Germans in tacky tourist developments—that would be the place.

I'd head for the Atlantic coast—or Seville or Barcelona—and try to find some reasonably authentic neighborhood and get stuck into some real local culture.

[motion]

Damn, no kidding? Anything like the south of France? That's the last thing I want...

How is Lisbon?

[Dottore]

Originally Posted by motion

Damn, no kidding? Anything like the south of France? That's the last thing I want...

How is Lisbon?

Like the south of France, but much cheesier.

I like Lisbon a lot. Great architecture. Lots of lovely old quarters, where you should be able to find a high-ceilinged flat. Always a breeze from the Atlantic. Of course you won't learn Spanish in Lisbon, and Portugese food is not as refined as Spanish food. Also Portuguese women will be a disappointment if you are comparing to Spain.

[jriera]

Originally Posted by motion

Paco and Jordi, you guys are a great resource. I hope you don't mind if I PM you with questions....

What are your thoughts on quiet places along the Med coast between Valencia and Marbella? Is there such a thing as place that isn't too developed, has some charm, is a bit quiet, close to the coast, where I can rent a 1bedroom furnished place for say, $2K per month? That's pretty doable in high end places here in SoCal, but not sure about Spain.... I have no interest living amongst Russians or Germans... I'd like to take in the place and learn the language.

You will find such place between Valencia and Alicante, still a few small towns in there, not far from the main highway but not overdeveloped or full of 'foreigners', haven't been there in few years but I will be looking before Benidorm or right before Alicante ... need to look at my notes, I had customers on that area and I use to drive quite often from Barcelona, have a few notes of places.

[Paco Anton]

Motion.

Yes PM me with questions. also I can give you my Skype if you want to chat about the different options.

I agree with Jordi about the area between Valencia and Alicante. Look up places like Altea, Javea, Denia, Calpe. Those are directly in the coast. If you go too inland in that region the weather is colder in winter (high 30s in february).

altea - Google Maps

My family comes from that region (look up Alcoi in the map above), so I have direct experience about the area.

US$ 2000 is more than doable. Even US$1000. Even US$800. You can navigate www.idealista.com to explore the areas and prices. Idealista is the largest housing website in Spain. Here are some examples:

http://www.idealista.com/pagina/inmueble?codigoinmueble=VW0000004020325&numInm=7&edd=list

http://www.idealista.com/pagina/inmueble?codigoinmueble=VW0000000636500&numInm=10&edd=list

http://www.idealista.com/pagina/inmueble?codigoinmueble=VP0000004695357&numInm=9&edd=list

http://www.idealista.com/pagina/inmueble?codigoinmueble=VW0000003894920&numInm=12&edd=list

If you want to stay just a few months look for "vacation rentals" in the site. You could take advantage of low prices in winter and stay 1 month in each place!!!

Although I am partial to the area above, you should also explore Andalucia, especially if you go say 50 km inland. Explore the area between Ronda and the coast:

http://maps.google.es/maps?q=ronda&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:es-ESfficial&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0xd0d314685035fad:0x9b8879fb40db634,Ronda&gl=es&ei=qoSlToCfFZPS8QOe18zbDA&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=image&resnum=3&ved=0CFEQ8gEwAg

I do not have direct experience in the area, but it attracts retired foreigners while still maintaining its character. I warn you that the accent is very think in that area.

If you decide to come to Madrid I can show you around and maybe help you with your planning. Also I can help you during the process with translations, negotiations with locals and so on.

BTW, as soon as you get off the plane get a cheap prepaid phone to help you contact hotels, landlords and such.

Shoot your questions!!!

Saludos

[speeder]

I have a good friend who relocated to Barcelona ~10 years ago from SoCal, just cashed in his chips here and moved. I've lost touch with him but I can get his info somehow because our Moms are friends. You would almost certainly get along well, he hitch-hiked to Wyoming and worked on an oil rig when we were 18 in the '70s and came home 6 mos. later with $35k in cash in his pocket. He is smart and a real survivor, like you. I think he's a day trader and just wanted to move somewhere where he could sleep until noon and wake up with the NYSE. (In L.A. this requires waking @ 5am every day).

Let me know. There is some great info on this thread.

[RPKESQ]

Originally Posted by Dottore

Yes. Still, I find the Atlantic coast more charming than the Med. side—which has been horribly overdeveloped. Cadiz has very charming quarters by the sea—and a brilliant central fish market. And of course the Basque coast has many gorgeous spots—with San Sebastian being one of the most civilized cities in the world IMHO.

In my next life I will dance flamenco and run with the bulls.

San Sebastian is as close to heaven as one can find in Spain. The only downside is they closed the fantastic live pigeon shooting club on the cliff West of the Bay. I fondly recall the shoots, camaraderie and superb meals I had there.

Sigh..................

Even heaven has its limits.

[Dottore]

Originally Posted by RPKESQ

San Sebastian is as close to heaven as one can find in Spain.

San Sebastian is pretty close to heaven, period.

IMO the civility and beauty and charm of San Sebastian is of a wholly different order from that of the costa del sol.

Worlds apart in livability!

But that's the last I'll say of in deference to my Spanish colleagues up-thread.

[Dottore]

Still have a few pics of San Sebastian in the computer—though I'm not sure how Joeaksa snuck into that one picture :

[tevake]

Way to rally guys, great flow of info.

Paco, good on ya for putting together the list of houses and hooking our bro up with all the detailed information. Great to get local knowledge.

Dottore, cool you could come up with those photos, that does look like nice countryside there. Probably a chance of some waves on the coast, eh?
But you are saying that this area is relatively undeveloped compared to the med coast?

Whew!! I haven't been there since the 70s and I know that most places have grown over the years, but whew!

Its neat to see this forum work so well with the help of pelicans from all over The world
I enjoy being a part of it:-)

Cheers Richard

[Dottore]

Originally Posted by tevake

But you are saying that this area is relatively undeveloped compared to the med coast?

San Sebastian is an old city in the basque country. It is in a highly developed area, lots of high tech— and mucho $$$$. So high tech that we saw mountain villages with escalators instead of sidewalks! But this is local development that has grown organically over time.

The med coast is fully of very tacky instant tourist developments. And it is really over-built. Lots of Irish pubs, Bierkeller and old and pale tourists whooping it up.

[motion]

Originally Posted by Dottore

Like the south of France, but much cheesier.

I like Lisbon a lot. Great architecture. Lots of lovely old quarters, where you should be able to find a high-ceilinged flat. Always a breeze from the Atlantic. Of course you won't learn Spanish in Lisbon, and Portugese food is not as refined as Spanish food. Also Portuguese women will be a disappointment if you are comparing to Spain.

Well, I guess Lisbon is out, LOL. I'll have to check it out anyway

[motion]

Paco, thanks very much for the information and your kind offer of assistance. I'm not sure where this adventure will lead me, but its a great feeling to know you and Jordi are there and willing to help! I checked out all your links and you are right, those are amazingly affordable rental rates for places so close to the ocean. I'm going to have to spend some serious time on Google Earth exploring the Altea area before I head over.

Mark, the food in your photos looks like it will do just fine San Sebastian looks beautiful, too.