Insurance valuation, would you contest it?

[Nathans_Dad]

We got a new auto insurance company and they originally insured my 1984 all stock guards red 911 coupe with 107,000 miles on it for $40k. After we sent them some photos of the vehicle including the engine (which I have never been asked to do before by any insurance company) they sent us a letter this week stating their underwriters felt the car should be insured for $30,500. I think this is probably close to the value of the car, but I am wondering if you guys think I should call them and try to get something more around $34k or just leave it as is?

[nathanbs]

So to clarify is it an agreed value policy for $34k or $34k is just the amount that they are basing their premium on? If the latter then regardless of what you discuss now it will come down to market value at the time of the loss. If this is the case the lower they think it’s worth the better as your premium will be less. In the event of a loss you need to be prepared to argue the value of your car. This would be the case even if you were paying a premium based on an $80k car

[nathanbs]

For the benefit of others Steve is not my dad

[BLACK3.2]

Originally Posted by nathanbs

So to clarify is it an agreed value policy for $34k or $34k is just the amount that they are basing their premium on? If the latter then regardless of what you discuss now it will come down to market value at the time of the loss. If this is the case the lower they think it’s worth the better as your premium will be less. In the event of a loss you need to be prepared to argue the value of your car. This would be the case even if you were paying a premium based on an $80k car

So what's the point of an agreed value policy then?

Also, is Nathan your dad?

[Nathans_Dad]

I would have to look at the letter but from my understanding if they say the car is worth $30.5k then that would mean they would only pay out $30.5 on the car were it to be totaled. Our premium went down a little with the change as well.

I will look at the policy more closely and see if I can figure out your question nathanbs.

And yes, I am not your dad, lol.

[Esel Mann]

Originally Posted by Nathans_Dad

We got a new auto insurance company and they originally insured my 1984 all stock guards red 911 coupe with 107,000 miles on it for $40k. After we sent them some photos of the vehicle including the engine (which I have never been asked to do before by any insurance company) they sent us a letter this week stating their underwriters felt the car should be insured for $30,500. I think this is probably close to the value of the car, but I am wondering if you guys think I should call them and try to get something more around $34k or just leave it as is?

As a data point for you, my 84 is insured for $35,000 agreed value. It has considerably more miles on it than yours. Further I also did receive a letter in the mail a while back informing me that due to market values, I should bump it up as the agreed value is too low. I chose not to as that also raises premiums.

As for the engine bay picture, the one particular insurance company I use asked similarly. First time ever with such a request. Their excuse was that it proves the engine is unmodified. Um ok, sure, whatever. You have to understand even though they are the gate keepers to liability exposure for the actual party insuring, underwriters are also a huge drag on IQ stats.

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by BLACK3.2

So what's the point of an agreed value policy then?

Also, is Nathan your dad?

Originally Posted by Nathans_Dad

I would have to look at the letter but from my understanding if they say the car is worth $30.5k then that would mean they would only pay out $30.5 on the car were it to be totaled. Our premium went down a little with the change as well.

I will look at the policy more closely and see if I can figure out your question nathanbs.

And yes, I am not your dad, lol.

An agreed value policy is exactly what it sounds like. Black I think you may have misunderstood me. Most of what I explained above is in the event that you have a standard policy and not an agreed value policy

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by BLACK3.2

So what's the point of an agreed value policy then?

Also, is Nathan your dad?

An agreed value policy is exactly what it sounds like. Black I think you may have misunderstood me. Most of what I explained above is in the event that you have a standard policy and not an agreed value policy. Yes you can refer to me as Nathan junior

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by Esel Mann

As a data point for you, my 84 is insured for $35,000 agreed value. It has considerably more miles on it than yours. Further I also did receive a letter in the mail a while back informing me that due to market values, I should bump it up as the agreed value is too low. I chose not to as that also raises premiums.

As for the engine bay picture, the one particular insurance company I use asked similarly. First time ever with such a request. Their excuse was that it proves the engine is unmodified. Um ok, sure, whatever. You have to understand even though they are the gate keepers to liability exposure for the actual party insuring, underwriters are also a huge drag on IQ stats.

I had coverages denied for a roll bar. Picture of the motor is also important in the event of a theft to prevent claims that it was a rothsport motor lol

[nathanbs]

I will add that a agreed value policy would be what you would want if for any reason you value your car higher than you think the market will support and/or you don’t want to hassle as significantly with your insurance. I will add that agreed value policies are not available from all carriers and are often times more expensive. Don’t confuse a stated value policy with an agreed value policy. Stated value you still have to validate with the market

[JMS935]

If your insurance company is fighting you on simply an agreed value - even before there is a claim, I would cancel that policy and run from this company as fast as you can! Most insurance companies welcome a higher agreed value, as they get paid more in premium. I would take this as a sign of trouble to come if there were ever the event where you actually needed to file a claim. I would highly recommend Hagerty, they insure my entire 930 collection, and at whatever values I want. I think I’ve got it comfortably over insured, and they are totally fine with it. I can recommend a great insurance agent if you want, pm me and I’ll give you his info if you want to shop this around. You also want a great agent in your corner to go to bat for you for if and when you do need to file a claim, so just the insurance company itself isn’t the entire package in my opinion. You need a really good agent that has been in the business a long time and will continue to be. You don’t want to be in the position where you need to file a claim, and then come to find out you don’t know a single person in the office that sold you the policy. You need both a great agent and insurance company to be fully and properly protected.

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by JMS935

If your insurance company is fighting you on simply an agreed value - even before there is a claim, I would cancel that policy and run from this company as fast as you can! Most insurance companies welcome a higher agreed value, as they get paid more in premium. I would take this as a sign of trouble to come if there were ever the event where you actually needed to file a claim. I would highly recommend Hagerty, they insure my entire 930 collection, and at whatever values I want. I think I’ve got it comfortably over insured, and they are totally fine with it. I can recommend a great insurance agent if you want, pm me and I’ll give you his info if you want to shop this around. You also want a great agent in your corner to go to bat for you for if and when you do need to file a claim, so just the insurance company itself isn’t the entire package in my opinion. You need a really good agent that has been in the business a long time and will continue to be. You don’t want to be in the position where you need to file a claim, and then come to find out you don’t know a single person in the office that sold you the policy. You need both a great agent and insurance company to be fully and properly protected.

In case I’m partially responsible for the confusion I will help clarify that the OP does not know if it is an agreed value or a stated value that he is discussing with his insurance company. He is going to look into it. In regards to Hagerty one must park the vehicle in a garage daily and there are pretty limited mileage allowances to qualify for a policy

[sugarwood]

You can insure it for $90k if you want.
You will just pay a lot more in premiums.

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by nathanbs

In case I’m partially responsible for the confusion I will help clarify that the OP does not know if it is an agreed value or a stated value that he is discussing with his insurance company. He is going to look into it. In regards to Hagerty one must park the vehicle in a garage daily and there are pretty limited mileage allowances to qualify for a policy

It sure seems like a pointless conversation to have with your insurance agent if it’s not an agreed value policy. One in which the agent you’d think would’ve made it very clear that there is no point to this question since your policy isn’t written as such. If this is the case, it also confirms my earlier point, that you need an equally good agent to go with your insurance company.

And while mine are insured for limited use, I’d think that unless you’re daily driving this, there’s a policy that would work. But if this is being daily driven, then the whole value issue become somewhat moot, as it’s being driven to such a diminished level it really shouldn’t be a factor anyways.

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by JMS935

It sure seems like a pointless conversation to have with your insurance agent if it’s not an agreed value policy. One in which the agent you’d think would’ve made it very clear that there is no point to this question since your policy isn’t written as such. If this is the case, it also confirms my earlier point, that you need an equally good agent to go with your insurance company.

And while mine are insured for limited use, I’d think that unless you’re daily driving this, there’s a policy that would work. But if this is being daily driven, then the whole value issue become somewhat moot, as it’s being driven to such a diminished level it really shouldn’t be a factor anyways.

I think it’s an important conversation for the agent to have because he may learn that you think your car is worth way more than his computer screen is saying the car is worth. It is his duty to warn you of the potential worst case scenario. My agent did this with me and I simply told him not to worry as their computer is wrong and I feel like I would have no problem proving my cars are worth considerably more. In the event that someone just perceives their car as being worth more an agreed value policy is pertinent.

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by nathanbs

I think it’s an important conversation for the agent to have because he may learn that you think your car is worth way more than his computer screen is saying the car is worth. It is his duty to warn you of the potential worst case scenario. My agent did this with me and I simply told him not to worry as their computer is wrong and I feel like I would have no problem proving my cars are worth considerably more. In the event that someone justvperceived their car as being worth more an agreed value policy is pertinent.

It doesn’t matter one bit what the agent thinks a car is worth, that is solely up to the underwriter. It’s a useless conversation to have unless they are speaking on behalf of the insurance underwriter (when I have these conversations, they are always with both my agent and the underwriter on the phone at the same time). And even then, unless it’s an agreed value, there is nothing holding them to it.

The bottom line is that unless you have a stated agreed value, you really don’t know for certain what your insurance payout will be if you total the car and need it to be paid out. Without the agreed value you should surely expect a negotiation, in which case you may not feel like you’ve been made whole. With the agreed value they cut you a check no questions asked (if it’s totaled that is).

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by JMS935

It doesn’t matter one bit what the agent thinks a car is worth, that is solely up to the underwriter. It’s a useless conversation to have unless they are speaking on behalf of the insurance underwriter (when I have these conversations, they are always with both my agent and the underwriter on the phone at the same time). And even then, unless it’s an agreed value, there is nothing holding them to it.

The bottom line is that unless you have a stated agreed value, you really don’t know for certain what your insurance payout will be if you total the car and need it to be paid out. Without the agreed value you should surely expect a negotiation, in which case you may not feel like you’ve been made whole. With the agreed value they cut you a check no questions asked (if it’s totaled that is).

Yeah sorry I’m referring to the agent conveying what underwriting is valuing the car at. I agree with your summary of a total loss without an agreed value policy. I don’t mind the fight and underwriting significantly under values my carrera 3.0’s which translates to cheap premiums. Win win for me.

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by nathanbs

Yeah sorry I’m referring to the agent conveying what underwriting is valuing the car at. I agree with your summary of a total loss without an agreed value policy. I don’t mind the fight and underwriting significantly under values my carrera 3.0’s which translates to cheap premiums. Win win for me.

Mine is a win-win because I’ve got a mutli car discount that benefits from having a daily driver insured by others. So my rates are in comparison lower than most due to the size of the collection, the limited use of them, and a daily driver being insured outside of Hagerty. The unlimited towing offered by Hagerty Plus is also a nice feature.

[nathanbs]

Originally Posted by JMS935

Mine is a win-win because I’ve got a mutli car discount that benefits from having a daily driver insured by others. So my rates are in comparison lower than most due to the size of the collection, the limited use of them, and a daily driver being insured outside of Hagerty. The unlimited towing offered by Hagerty Plus is also a nice feature.

Yeah Hagerty policies are super cheap and now that you say it I’m reminded that now all of my cars are indoors and I am eligible for Hagerty. Not to mention State Farm blows

[JMS935]

Originally Posted by nathanbs

Yeah Hagerty policies are super cheap and now that you say it I’m reminded that now all of my cars are indoors and I am eligible for Hagerty. Not to mention State Farm blows

I had all of mine including my daily driver with State Farm for a while, but as the values continued to increase so did the likelihood that I wouldn't be made whole if I needed insurance coverage, so I moved my Porsche collection over to Hagerty. The owner of the agency that wrote the policy (I’m told) has an even larger collection of Porsche’s than I do. So I suspect that if I ever need coverage, I’ll have not only my insurance agent’s help, but probably also the boss as well in my corner. You should really quote it with Hagerty, there isn’t a better insurance policy out there (that I’ve found). If you want my insurance agent’s info just PM me.