Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > Porsche Forums > 911 / 930 Turbo & Super Charging Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Forced Induction Junkie
 
WERK I's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 3,291
Garage
STP as an additive in 930's.......observations

I've been meaning to report this for months, but moving and a new job had shifted my priorities somewhat.

Last year I thought with the lower Zn and Phosphorous in today's oils, adding the STP oil treatment would be an easy solution in adding those additives in my present oil. Valvoline VR-1 was the oil of choice and had been using it for about two years with no obvious issues.

After one season of driving with that combination, I would strongly advise against anyone using STP as an additive in a turbo Porsche. I use an inline filter (Canton) between the turbo sump pump and the oil tank and found the filter media to have a very noticeable presence of coke particles that weren't present in filter changes before. I can only surmise that the STP is causing the coking since my driving habits hadn't changed in that time period.
Sorry I don't have photos..................I'll find that damn camera in one of those boxes one of these days!

I have abandoned the "dino oil" ship this year and started using a 50/50 blend of Mobil 1 20-50W and Mobil 1 V-Twin with NO additional additives.
__________________
Dave
'85 930 Factory Special Wishes Flachbau
Werk I Zuffenhausen 3.3l/330BHP Engine with Sonderwunsch Cams, FabSpeed Headers, Kokeln IC, Twin Plugged Electromotive Crankfire, Tial Wastegate(0.8 Bar), K27 Hybrid Turbo, Ruf Twin-tip Muffler, Fikse FM-5's 8&10x17, 8:41 R&P
Old 08-05-2010, 06:23 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
tj930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: England
Posts: 301
Thanks for your thoughts, Dave.

I have to confess that in the nigh-on 8 years I've had my Porsche, I've almost never put pure 'Dino oil' in it.

Before the engine rebuild, I noticed that if I put anything too thin and synthetic (5 or 10W) in would just find a gap and leak onto the garage floor.
Old 08-06-2010, 05:28 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 422
Since I do not know your background I will say no insult meant but what is with all the backyard re engineering of the oils? What is with the mixes??? Ask any oil rep and the 1st thing they will tell you is not to mix anything never mind bike oil and auto oil??? Why do you think VR needs anything? Has the high zinc content?

Sorry but I think like most you are trying to over think the whole oil deal. Send a sample for $25 and really find out what is happening and what you need or have going on. If you are some sort of oil expert I need to know what thy mixes accomplish and why the Co's aren't doing this?

NO INSULT MEANT just trying to figure out why and what.
Old 08-06-2010, 09:14 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Houston
Posts: 3,985
Dave - Off topic, glad you did not sell your car and you are keeping it (I hope!). Did you move from WI and how is the new job?

Back on topic...never been a fan of STP and those additives and I am using Red Line Break-In additive with every oil change to replace the lost Zn in new oil.
Yasin
__________________
Ole Skool - wouldn't have it any other way
Old 08-07-2010, 06:10 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: S. Florida
Posts: 7,274
Redline break in oil additive/ engine oil supplement is good stuff... lots of ZDDP in it and it's a synthetic polyol ester base oil so it can handle turbo heat without coking alot better than all the other zddp oil additives that are made from petroleum or mineral base oil.
Red Line Synthetic Oil - Motor Oil for Racing - Engine Oil Break-In Additive

TECHNICAL INFORMATION

Bottle (16oz) contains:
33.8 grams total ZDDP (zinc dialkyldithiophosphate)
17,000 ppm, 7.8 grams Phosphorus (P)
20,500 ppm, 9.4 grams Zinc (Zn)
16.6 grams Sulphur (S)


Increases of antiwear per quart by using one bottle (16oz.): Oil capacity:
Phosphorus Zinc
15 quarts 610 ppm 736 ppm
12 quarts 763 ppm 920 ppm
10 quarts 915 ppm 1104 ppm
8 quarts 1145 ppm 1380 ppm
7 quarts 1307 ppm 1577 ppm
6 quarts 1525 ppm 1840 ppm
5 quarts 1830 ppm 2208 ppm
4 quarts 2288 ppm 2760 ppm
1 quart 9160 ppm 11040 ppm

Half Bottle (8oz.) When Treating:
12 quarts 382 ppm 460 ppm
10 quarts 458 ppm 552 ppm
8 quarts 572 ppm 690 ppm
6 quarts 763 ppm 920 ppm
5 quarts 915 ppm 1104 ppm
4 quarts 1145 ppm 1380 ppm
Old 08-07-2010, 12:29 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #5 (permalink)
Forced Induction Junkie
 
WERK I's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 3,291
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by WANNA930 View Post
Since I do not know your background I will say no insult meant but what is with all the backyard re engineering of the oils? What is with the mixes??? Ask any oil rep and the 1st thing they will tell you is not to mix anything never mind bike oil and auto oil??? Why do you think VR needs anything? Has the high zinc content?

Sorry but I think like most you are trying to over think the whole oil deal. Send a sample for $25 and really find out what is happening and what you need or have going on. If you are some sort of oil expert I need to know what thy mixes accomplish and why the Co's aren't doing this?

NO INSULT MEANT just trying to figure out why and what.
No insult taken.
First off, I posted this because of a fellow Pelicanite (from the U.K.) had asked last year about using STP(red cap) in his 930 to raise the Zn/ZDDP levels. I told him, via this site, that I had been using the additive for a short period of time and saw no ill effects. I'm posting this to report that the additive is ill-advised for turbo engines. It would work fine for NA engines, but turbochargers present a whole set of circumstances.
Secondly, Valvoline VR-1 does not offer adequate Zinc/ZDDP protection, hence the additive route taken. Read "cnavarro" responses in thread Ultimate Motor Oil Thread
Mixing V-Twin Mobil 1 and Mobil 1 20-50W is perfectly fine and is the only way to get high enough Zn/ZDDP levels in Mobil 1 syn oil. In fact, synthetic and dino oils can be mixed with no harmful effects what's so ever. Again, I use the above thread and CNAVARRO's research and posts as a basis of my "experimentation. He is a strong advocate of Brad Penn oil, but I chose the Mobil 1 blend mainly due to availability. It is certainly a more expensive solution, but since I change oil now once a year because of the limited driving season, the overall cost maintenance of oil changes on a yearly basis, is not that dramatic.
Oil Rep's, be it engineers or sales reps, tow the company line. I find hard to trust any of them with what they say. I have heard and read reps say the new CJ4 and SM Oils are perfectly safe for flat tappet engines, but I have read and witnessed far too many cases where two valve, high spring pressure, flat tappet engines experiencing excessive lobe wear. Research the web on Corvette, Mustang, Jaguar, Ducati and you'll see what I mean.


Quote:
Originally Posted by slow&rusty View Post
Dave - Off topic, glad you did not sell your car and you are keeping it (I hope!). Did you move from WI and how is the new job?

Back on topic...never been a fan of STP and those additives and I am using Red Line Break-In additive with every oil change to replace the lost Zn in new oil.
Yasin
Yasin,
Well, the jury is still out on selling the slant.
I've owned the car since '98 and I'm still intrigued with the idea with playing with the C2 '90-98 engine/chassis or early chassis with 964 or 993 engines.
I'm still in Wisconsin, but relocated from the "frozen tundra" to the North Central part of the state. No substitute for work, IMHO, and would have gone anywhere in the lower 48 to be a part of the workforce. Work is ok. I've gone from being an IT engineer to a Sales Rep.....Yikes! What a different environment.
Hopefully, one of these days, we can meet at one of the P-car events in the country and hoist-a-drink (or two) to celebrate our experiences.
__________________
Dave
'85 930 Factory Special Wishes Flachbau
Werk I Zuffenhausen 3.3l/330BHP Engine with Sonderwunsch Cams, FabSpeed Headers, Kokeln IC, Twin Plugged Electromotive Crankfire, Tial Wastegate(0.8 Bar), K27 Hybrid Turbo, Ruf Twin-tip Muffler, Fikse FM-5's 8&10x17, 8:41 R&P
Old 08-08-2010, 08:20 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #6 (permalink)
 
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 03:31 AM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.