Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > Porsche Forums > 911 / 930 Turbo & Super Charging Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
Zeitronix connection to RPM & MAP

I just received my Zeitronix datalogger with LCD display and MAP sensor. The kit looks very neat and installation should be straight forward.

According to the instructions, the RPM signal should be taken from the low voltage side of the coil. Can I use a signal from the tach instead?

Also, where is the best place to pick up vacum/boost signal for the MAP sensor?


I have been going back and forth on the LM systems from Innovate, and although it seems to have many possibilities, I have seen many frustrated posts about getting it to work. So, I ended up with the Zeitronix... The downside to this is the lack of on board logging storage, so you have to have the laptop hooked up to log data for analysis and tuning. I have ordered the necessary parts to build a small "data logging memory plug" that plugs into the serial port on the Zeitronix as any other computer dongle. I am basing this on a small micro-SD card reader. The micro-SD cards can be had with up to 8 og 16GB of storage (if not more) and this should be plenty for logging a cross country trip.
__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-13-2010, 11:05 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 702
I wired the RPM signal to the tach wire, and tapped off the boost hose to the wastegate for the MAP.

You can also use the ZAVT-1 with a solenoid on the boost line to your WUR for mixture control.

BTW I would be really interested in your onboard logging, if you get it to work well.
__________________
1986 911 Turbo
3.3L, K27HFS, Tial 46mm, TurboKraft Intercooler, 964 Cams, Monty Muffler, MS3Pro Evo, M&W Ignition, Zietronix WBO2 Data Logger, Wevo shifter, coupler and motor mounts.

Last edited by WinRice; 09-13-2010 at 01:43 PM.. Reason: Spelling
Old 09-13-2010, 01:24 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
When you tap the waste gate hose, you only get boost. I'm interested in absolute pressure, with vacuum as well. There should be a tap at the manifold somewhere, and I would guess that this vacuum/boost signal is to be found other places in the engine compartment as well. Question is where?
__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-13-2010, 01:46 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 702
This is from memory, but I think the wastegate hose connects to the base of the throttle body, so you should get vacumn/boost.
__________________
1986 911 Turbo
3.3L, K27HFS, Tial 46mm, TurboKraft Intercooler, 964 Cams, Monty Muffler, MS3Pro Evo, M&W Ignition, Zietronix WBO2 Data Logger, Wevo shifter, coupler and motor mounts.
Old 09-13-2010, 02:00 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Next to Mulholland [west]
Posts: 2,307
Garage
I hope you get your Zeitronics to work well and get the data logging and boost to work.

I don't want to sound like a broken record on here plugging the Daytona Sensors unit that our host sells, and I am involved in the distribution of this great unit, so I am biased I guess. I love mine that I have permanently installed.

The Daytona Sensors Wego IV hooks straight into the tach signal on your car. I have one permanently installed on my 1973 2.7 MFI engine, and have a GM Map sensor hooked up to the vacuum line. It does log 2 hours of data on the fly and you just download it and analyze it later.

Our host sells the Wego IV for just over $400 USD and this includes everything. Sensor, cables, software, datalogging, and tach hookup. You do have to supply the MAP/Boost sensor, but there is an input for that.

I know you are committed to the Zeitronix, which is a good unit, I just want other Pelicans to know that there is a good, easy to install alternative that is a good value and very accurate and well built. And you don't need all those boxes and wires that the competition needs and the extra $$$.

here is a photo:

__________________
RGruppe #79 '73 Carrera RS spec 2.7 MFI
00 Saab 95 Aero wagon stick
01 Saab 95 Aero wagon auto
03 Boxster
90 Chevy PU Prerunner....1990
Old 09-13-2010, 04:56 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #5 (permalink)
beancounter
 
jwasbury's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Weehawken, NJ
Posts: 3,443
Quote:
Originally Posted by WinRice View Post
This is from memory, but I think the wastegate hose connects to the base of the throttle body, so you should get vacumn/boost.
Wastegate hose is typically connected to the intercooler, which is ported vacuum rather than manifold vacuum. To get a manifold vac signal, you usually tap into one of the lines that are plumbed to the base of the throttle body, below the throttle plate.
__________________
Jacob
Current: 1983 911 GT4 Race Car / 1999 Spec Miata / 2000 MB SL500 / 1998 MB E300TD / 1998 BMW R1100RT / 2016 KTM Duke 690
Past: 2009 997 Turbo Cab / 1979 930
Old 09-13-2010, 05:45 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #6 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 702
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwasbury View Post
Wastegate hose is typically connected to the intercooler, which is ported vacuum rather than manifold vacuum. To get a manifold vac signal, you usually tap into one of the lines that are plumbed to the base of the throttle body, below the throttle plate.
Bingo!

I checked last night. When I plumbed in my EBC I had to run a line to the base of the throttle body, I tapped off of that for my MAP.
__________________
1986 911 Turbo
3.3L, K27HFS, Tial 46mm, TurboKraft Intercooler, 964 Cams, Monty Muffler, MS3Pro Evo, M&W Ignition, Zietronix WBO2 Data Logger, Wevo shifter, coupler and motor mounts.
Old 09-14-2010, 09:22 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #7 (permalink)
Got Boost?
 
IMONBOOST's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 376
Garage
I connected mine to the tach with no problems at all...mi car is a 964 though, not sure if there is a difference.
__________________
"The only motivation to make you go race after race, travel after travel, is winning. The possibility that you have for winning. If you don't have that, nothing else can make you work."
-Ayrton Senna-
Old 09-14-2010, 11:43 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
This is the only line I can find on the throttle body, below the throttle plate. Its going to the front side of the WUR. Would this be the correct place to tap for a signal to the MAp sensor? (red arrow). Btw, what is the connector in the green circle. Its never been connected as long as I've had the car.





Her is a snap of the Zeitronix kit. It seems like a good quality kit. I like the solid connectors for the engine compartment, and the wire for the O2 sensor is more than long enough to reach the controller which I'm placing under the seat. The wire for the display is an ordinary phone cable, with a phone connector for the controller. I think it will be a straight forward install, and I'll report my progress.


__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-17-2010, 04:57 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #9 (permalink)
Got Boost?
 
IMONBOOST's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 376
Garage
My car is a little different but I would certainly tap to the line you have pointed out for the MAP.
__________________
"The only motivation to make you go race after race, travel after travel, is winning. The possibility that you have for winning. If you don't have that, nothing else can make you work."
-Ayrton Senna-
Old 09-17-2010, 07:30 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #10 (permalink)
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
I have trouble getting an RPM reading at this stage. I have tried both terminals on the coil, and the black/purple tach wire.

The negative terminal on the coil give me intermittent signals around 300-400 RPM while the positive terminal give me readings in excess of 25000 rpm. The Tach wire give me a zero reading. I have scaled the arpm input to a 6 cyl. engine..

Any ideas?
__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-19-2010, 09:14 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #11 (permalink)
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
So, the Zeitronix install is complete except for the O2 sensor bung welding that I need some help with.

With the exception of RPM reading problems (previous post), the hole install was really straight forward. My laptop can log data, and everything worked at first try.

I hate lose cables in the car and nasty home made connections under the dash, so I made two sets of wiring looms, one to the engine compartment and one to the fusebox, all wrapped in shrink tube. It makes the installation much more tidy. I included a couple of extra wires for future use...

I mounted the Zeitronix controller and the connections under the passenger seat. The wires to the engine is routed through the transmission linkage tunnel, and over the transmission and in to the engine together with the reverse signal from the tranny.

I mounted the connectors next to the rear-right shock tower.








Temporary mounting of the MAP behind (or actually in front of) the WUR



MAP signal from hose between throtle body and WUR with a simple T-connector.


Very simple installation under pass. seat compared to some of the other installations I've seen here on the forum. Spare cables for future use...



The LCD display is made for the ashtray location. Easy double sided tape install for now. Good display with excellent contrast, and user defined parameters; here with default settinggs




I'm impressed with the simple install, and the nice kit from Zeitronix. I know most of the crowd here prefers the LM-x from Innovate, but seeing that many have problems with the install I opted for Zeitronix. Good price too.

The downside to the Zeitronix, is that you have to use a computer to log data. No internal buffering. So, I have started a project to make a small battery driven dongle to connect to the Zeitronix serial port. This will hopefully log to a small built- in micro SD reader in the dongle.
__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-19-2010, 12:04 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #12 (permalink)
 
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 702
Nicely done!

For the display, I bent a metal angle and used the ashtray bracket screws to secure the angle to the dash, then used double stick on the back side of the display to the angle. You might want to offset the display slightly to the left so you can get your pinky finger in there to hit the 'max' button.
__________________
1986 911 Turbo
3.3L, K27HFS, Tial 46mm, TurboKraft Intercooler, 964 Cams, Monty Muffler, MS3Pro Evo, M&W Ignition, Zietronix WBO2 Data Logger, Wevo shifter, coupler and motor mounts.
Old 09-19-2010, 03:42 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #13 (permalink)
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
Still have problems with the RPM signal, any suggestions?
__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-26-2010, 03:07 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #14 (permalink)
Registered User
 
lite75's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bellingham WA
Posts: 859
Garage
I'm using the tach signal wire with no problems.
__________________
75 930, 76 930, 83 SC EFI turbo
Old 09-26-2010, 06:48 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #15 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 702
Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
Still have problems with the RPM signal, any suggestions?
Just checked mine, and I definitely used the tach signal wire.

Do you have a stock ignition? MSD or other aftermarket?
__________________
1986 911 Turbo
3.3L, K27HFS, Tial 46mm, TurboKraft Intercooler, 964 Cams, Monty Muffler, MS3Pro Evo, M&W Ignition, Zietronix WBO2 Data Logger, Wevo shifter, coupler and motor mounts.
Old 09-26-2010, 07:43 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #16 (permalink)
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
I have stock ignition.......
__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-26-2010, 11:52 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #17 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Tomy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Porsche World
Posts: 380
Garage
I bought Zeitronix some months ago and like to install so I am subscribe and cross finger for your results...
__________________
TET930 996 TT 2003 X50 996 GT3 2004
930 1988 black on black -fast...
944 TURBO S 1989 WHITE/BLACK # 1 944 TURBO S 1989 #2
911 S 1970 Targa /ex porsche werks car!
911 S 1969 Targa (under rebuild)
Old 09-27-2010, 07:25 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #18 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Colorado
Posts: 702
Quote:
Originally Posted by aseem View Post
Still have problems with the RPM signal, any suggestions?
And you stock tach works fine, without any jumping or weird behavior?

Have you traced the wire all the way to the tach?

I tapped mine off of the ECU under the drivers seat, but that only works on lambda cars.

You might run a test wire from the ZT-2 to the tach itself and try it there, just for fun.
__________________
1986 911 Turbo
3.3L, K27HFS, Tial 46mm, TurboKraft Intercooler, 964 Cams, Monty Muffler, MS3Pro Evo, M&W Ignition, Zietronix WBO2 Data Logger, Wevo shifter, coupler and motor mounts.
Old 09-27-2010, 09:48 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #19 (permalink)
Registered User
 
aseem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Oslo, Norway
Posts: 543
Garage
I have tried both sides of the coil AND directly from the tach. Tach itself works fine until I unplug the black/violet wire to connect directly to the Zeitronix.

Now I'm playing around with the grounding for Zeitronix. I first led +12V and ground from the fusebox in front (a grounding point under the vacuum booster. Now I've picked up ground from the CDI without any better result. There is a signal ground on the CDI connector that is used for the coil, but I don't if I should try this.....
__________________
Arnljot
1980 930 GT35R, TurboKraft IC, 965 P&C, 964 Cams, Tial WG, ported heads, BLWUR, RarlyL8 hdrs&mfflr, Zeitronix logger & wideband
1989 928GT
1972 BMW 3.0S
Old 09-27-2010, 10:22 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #20 (permalink)
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 02:42 PM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.