Coil-On-Plug for Aircooled Engines?

304065 · 06-06-2008, 07:23 AM

Does anyone have experience with, or photos of, coil-on-plug setups for the 911-based aircooled engine?

I know the water-cooled cars use these, I wonder whether they are suitable for use next to the high temperature cylinder heads of a 911. Often times you see direct ignition with coil packs and short wires running to Beru-type connectors.

I have checked the websites of most of the shops and haven't seen anything for sale which is why I am curious.

Steve@Rennsport · 06-06-2008, 08:10 AM

Herr Professor Von Cramer,

We are working on custom valve covers for these cars to accomodate a C-O-P ignition setup.

We have done some of these using Motec Engine Management that works out just fine but the main issue is securing the ignition modules to the upper & lower valve covers properly.

304065 · 06-06-2008, 01:20 PM

Dr. Ing. Steve,

I was hoping you would chime in. . . I think our man Peter Dawe has done something like this as well. . . hard to find photos out there.

It looks like the Boxster uses a Beru coil with a separate connector to the plug. I wonder what the distance from seated on the plug to the surface of the cover is. . . could one weld a couple studs to the aluminum cover to hold the coil? Hmmm. . . .

I cannot seem to find a good picture of the 996 valve cover design. Tony (911quest) can you help, I know you tore a boxster engine down.

NY65912 · 06-06-2008, 02:18 PM

Hi John,

When Bill and I were disussing my build he mentioned that he had done a few and if I were interested. He knew that I like a very clean uncluttered engine bay.

I said no.

Dennis Kalma · Dennis Kalma's Garage

I am going to do it, I hate spark plug wires, distributors, advance curves, rotors, condensers and all that crap.

I was planning on just modifying the existing valve covers (drill out the holes, put in studs and go from there), but Dr. Steve's stuff may be interesting.

I also have to plug my distributor hole, I have seen Clewett's solution, don't like it all that much and was wondering if a press in aluminium disc with a couple of small retaining screws, all loctited and/or staked in, would look better and still be dry.

My only reservation is that Motec is expensive, but maybe they will make a stripper version for us street guys....

Dennis

Steve@Rennsport · 06-06-2008, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Kalma

My only reservation is that Motec is expensive, but maybe they will make a stripper version for us street guys....

Dennis

They do make a "cheap" version that is VERY good: M48, but it doesn't have sufficient outputs for C-O-P ignitions. One needs M600 to do this and that one is not cheap.

When it comes to Engine Management, you get just what you pay for,...

TimT · 06-06-2008, 04:09 PM

When I built the latest iteration of my motor a few year ago I was all set to do cop ignition, but my funds dried up... so I put a quick waste fire setup together.
I think the coils were almost $100 ea then.. I couldn't swing $1200 for coils then.

Bill and I were talking the other day, and we are going to do COP on his monsters powerplant... Also Dawe has a few out there running COP

kiato4 · 06-06-2008, 04:31 PM

I believe Musante Motorsports and Rudtners are among the few who have attempted this with success. I have only good things to say about both of them, and I personally own a car that was converted to EFI by Bill Rudtner.

WERK I · WERK I's Garage

I was going through the Jeg's catalog the other the other day, thinking the same thing. Maybe there are U.S. COP that are lower cost? I know the Ford DOHC engines have a pretty deep recess for the spark plugs similar to Porsches.

jcge · 06-09-2008, 02:57 PM

John - try this site for dimensions of the module - looks like type PT

Ignition coils at Bosch Motorsport

Regards
John

304065 · 06-09-2008, 03:12 PM

That is a nice dimensioned drawing that I can use to see where the coil would sit on the valve cover-- thanks.

http://www.bosch-motorsport.de/pdf/components/ignition_coils/Single_PT.pdf

sourcandy · 11-09-2009, 06:21 PM

sorry to bump an old thread, but I currently have 6 beru coils wired up to a 3.2L motor that I'm trying to get running with Megasquirt. I was curious if anybody has made progress with modifying the valve covers? I was going to make a bracket, but the valve cover idea sounds like a cleaner solution.

Thanks,
-Ed

K24madness · 11-10-2009, 02:21 AM

While the coilover setup is desireable I find the Crane CDI unit to be the best solution when considering cost vs performance.

kenikh · 11-10-2009, 07:50 AM

there are several threads on this. some have used zx7 cops or audi cops effectively on 911 motors using an ems .

safe · safe's Garage

I'm using the Audi/VW coil-on-plug. I drove at least 4000 miles this summer, both street and track, with coils from the scrapyard. No problems at al.

rsscotty · 11-10-2009, 04:47 PM

This is a new setup developed by Rothsport in Oregon. You can call Jeff Gamroth for details. 503 885 9626

kenikh · 11-10-2009, 04:57 PM

Seems to me it would be cheaper to just fabricate an adapter ficture for existing valve covers that bolt to the existing fasteners. Billet = BIG BUCKS.

Jeff Alton · 11-10-2009, 08:01 PM

Billet does not need to equal big bucks for something as simple as a valve cover. With the right equipment valve covers can be made pretty inexpensively....

Cheers

lindy 911 · lindy 911's Garage

I was just over at Pro Technik in Houston and they have a 3.2 based race motor that uses Motech EFI and Toyota Tundra COP. This is a single plug motor running 10.5 :1 compression making 325 RWHP! They just welded a stud to the valve cover and bolted the coil to it. Very clean! Call Sam and he'll share the details.

safe · safe's Garage

I don't use any extra fasteners... Haven't fallen of yet.

But the Rothsport solution is beautiful!