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3.4 build part 2!
23 months ago was the last time I heard my car running. In feb of last year I started this thread http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/267221-3-4-has-begun-part-1-a.html
about taking the motor apart. The plan was to have it back on the track in 1 year...... So, today, it so happens that the head tuner from Microtech (the ecu I purchased) was in town, from Australia, helping my tuner with some programming. They invited me down and Jon confirmed my suspiscions about an error in the wiring diagram for the injectors. Came home tonight and moved the connectors to the appropriate injectors. I had left the harness long in anticipation of the diagram being incorrect. So, here is how my night went...... Turn on key. Run motor over on starter button until oil pressure builds. Confirm basic (very basic) timing with a timing light while motor is cranking to build pressure. Jump in the seat. Turn on ECU switch. Turn on fuel pump switch. Have a sip of Mission Hill Occulus (very tasty, been saving it) Take a deep breath. Think in "fast forward" about all the things that could go wrong. Push starter button. . .. ... .... ..... ...... ....... ......... .......... ........... She fires right up with a little pressure on the pedal!! :) Nearly soil myself, take deep breathes to slow heart rate down. Turn motor off quickly. The motor only has an very basic initial tune from Microtech in it. But it fired. It will now go on a flat deck down to the tuners. (Nice and close to here) where it will be broken in on the dyno and then give a max power tune. We will be tuning it for 100 octane, 94 octane adn 91 octane. I can get 94 at the pumps here, 100+ at some of the tracks I go to and 91 if I travel in the NW USA with it. The computor will store 4 different programs in it. I will document with pictures and hopefully video the tunning process. I will also be calling on the expertise of two very well known contributors to this, and many other, forums to help me with the text to go along with the process. I want to be able to show what worked for ME, and what did not. Show what the tunning process is like. Here are the specs again.... 3.4L based on a 3.2 (case, crank, rods, and heads) 10.5:1 compression (measured) Balanced rods and pistons. Twin plugged. Microtech ECU and ignition box. 6 dual tower MSD coils DC44 cams on 108 lobe centers Race valve spring and Ti retainers Jenvey 48mm ITB's with blended manifolds and custom linkage. B&B 1 5/8 headers with heat. M&K GT3 style twin center outlet muffler. Big Setrab front mount oil cooler. Man, I really want to go fire it again, but I made a commitment to break it in on the dyno. Unfortuanetly, I don't think that will happen for another 8 days...... Here is a pic of the motor.... http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1186717015.jpg Okay, here is another of it in the car! http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1186717046.jpg Cheers |
CONGRATS!!!
I can't wait to see what kind of power the DC44s make. I am building a 2.3 w/ DC44s on 102 lobe centers and can't wait for a seat of the pants assessment of the character. |
Nice Jeff, she looks beautiful.
ITB's of course look sweet, but I really like the lack of SS lines and the silver/black valve cover look. Start up's never fail to get the blood pumping, it's one of my favorite adrenaline rushes. You have much better self control than I do...I would have cruised it a little round the block:) |
Hmmh, I have wheels (just picked them up today) but tires are not mounted. Windsheild is not in.... tail lights not installed... I think I am just going to have to pretend for a while on the dyno.... :)
Thanks for the compliments. I tried to keep it as low key looking as possible. Painted the shroud body color and the exposed aluminum bits are bead blasted or poweder coated satin black. No funky color fan and housing. Black igintion wires blah blah blah blah...... I have build quite a few engines in the past, but always with the existing fuel and ignition system. This was a very healthy modded 3.2 that I took a part. I was very very very nervous about firing it with a completely different ECU, intake system, and ignition system. Very frightened in fact. For the few seconds it ran it was lumpy. There is a ton of work to go here still. Need to balance the 6 throttles, tune the fuel maps, tune the ignition maps, break the motor in................ I am actually looking forward to long days with the ear plugs in at the dyno shop! If it doesn't make 255 at the wheels there may be and accident..... :) Cheers |
What's your redline? Those cams will make almost 100HP/L at 8000 RPM. Those revs are a unattainable for 98mm pistons on 74.4mm crank, but curious nonetheless.
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Well, the bottom end is balanced and has ARP rod bolts.... But, I chose this cam specifically off the recomendation of John. I have only 1 5/8 headers and he thought with the 48mm throttle, 10.50 CR and that exhaust that this was a good choice. If I remember correctly, he thought the motor should make peak power around 7200-7500rpm.
We will see... The goals of this motor were a fairly wide powerband, and snappy throttle response. I also wanted to be able to pull into the low to mid 7K rpms. John had said that similar 3.4's were making well above 300hp at the flywheel with this cam and 46mm PMO's. The outright HP number is not important to me. I will know when I drive it if it met my goals. Car will be 2400lbs +/- a few so it should scoot. I am a throttle response junkie so I am hoping it meets those needs. Cheers |
Cant wait to hear what she puts down to the ground...
Chuck |
Jeff - I would be suprised if you were not in the 270-280+ rwhp. That engine is a work of art.
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sweet Jeff... congrats!
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Jeff, that is great news. I was also very excited when my EFI started for the first time.
I just wish I had the funds to tune on a dyno. I have been tuning on the street and its really running well now. the datalog files are your best friend. Just watch out for the off-idle response. I find that with 46mm ITBs they dump a lot of air with very little change in rpm. The engine wants to go quickly lean when you crack the throttle. This means it will be crucial to get your base VE map and acceleration parameters correct. I had a lot of problems with the engine stalling until I figured this out on my own. Nothing like seeing the AFR spike above 18 when opening the throttle. I am sure you are in great hands with your tuners. Best of luck. I can't wait to see the dyno charts. I think you will be above 300 if you are spinning above 7K. |
Congrats Jeff !!!
Keep us posted on the tuning progress & can't wait to see your final results :) |
Looks great Jeff. I cant wait to see the numbers.
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Congratulations Jeff, looks fantastic.
I know how hard it must be to not go out to the car and fire it up just to hear it run. Looking forward to your updates as you get it set up on the dyno and then on the road. Regards, Bob |
SCHWING!!!!
Nicely done. Hope it rips asphalt like a......well.......... like a flat six should with those kinda credentials!!!! |
Very exciting!
-Chris |
255 is very conservative!!!
i'm sue you'll meet that goal and then some, but like you said, #'s are not the purpose, it fun in the hot seat that counts, and thats what high(er) compression N/A is all about!!!! cannot wait to see you results! we should start the intial 'betting' as to what the dyno results will be... i'll say first full run something like 260hp, after 'long days with ear muffs on' i'll bet 285ish, if you can get it to peak between 70-7200rpm, for mainly a street driven car i can't see you actually wanting to wind it up past there... this is coming for a 20yr old kid, who has a similar (minus the fancy ITB fuel injection) setup, which was intially set to wind to 7200rpm, but has been pulled down to 7000, ps, the B&B's + M&K sound best right aound 55-6000rpm's, 6-7 happens so fast you cannot eally remember if you heard anything :P |
What kind of dyno is your tuner using Jeff? I'm hoping a dyno-dynamics or dyna-pack:)
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He has a dynojet, and there is a mustang and another dynodynamics all with in 5 miles. Once it is done, I am going to do a little test to see how the different dyno's/operators compare with each other.... :)
Cheers |
Well, tonight I did a little adjustment on the timing and and did my best to set the static postition of the ITBs and then fired it up again!!
Ran it for about 1 mins. (last time before the dyno, I promise! :) ) Lots of oil pressure!! It certainly needs some proffesional help for the tunning..... it farts and sputters a wee bit below 1500 rpm. It has unbelievable throttle response, like nothing I have ever felt. That is the most welcome news for me, as that is the number one reason I built this thing. Just touch the throttle and it is like lightning! Totally blows my mind. Oh, it is really really really loud........ I had my garage door open (town house complex) and in about 30 sec I had 6 spectators........ Ooops! Oh well, at least my dogs don't bark! Cheers |
subscribed to see what the outcome is #s wise
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More importantly though I would highly recommend tuning on the dyno-dynamics. Once your familiar with mapping the tables and the need to tune different cells(and thus load the car to get it to a particular cell and hold it there to tune), the difference in dyno's will become more clear. |
Well, thanks for the advice. Dyno tuning is all new to me. Especially with a laptop! I am used to tools that fit in my hand and that I can turn to tune something.... :)
At any rate, Marco is a "Master tuner" for mictotech, so I will let him work his magic (while I learn) on his dyno (dyno jet). If I am not happy with it when it is all done I may well attempt some fine tunning on the dyno-dynamics one. I am just now getting a little familiar with the software and how to move between screen and how to adjust different parameters. It seems pretty user friendly (thankfully) but I am not a wizard at this software stuff. Someday I hope to be!!! Cheers |
Nice to hear it lives Jeff!
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Thanks Ed,
How is your motor comming?? Still waiting on machine shops? Cheers |
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But, I'm headed the other direction. With the new job, I'm travelling a ridiculous amount. But, the plan is to start on the assembly Labor Day weekend; at least getting the rods on the crank, if not getting the case together. |
Well, here she is sitting on her own 4 legs for the fist time in almost 2 years. I forgot how good they look when not on jack stands!! Took some screwing around to level it (I have taken 250lbs out of an already light Carrera since she came off the road) I also had to do a wee toe adjustment up front as I narrowed the track slightly from where it was previously set to help squeeze the tires it (935 front suspension make that easy to do) :)
Yes, it will be going to paint once it is tuned! Windsheild is out and the rest of the Lexan windows are on their way as well as the lighter weight mirrors from TRE. I will weld up the holes on the rockers/mirrors/antenae before I ship it out for paint. It is off on the flatdeck Wed to be broken in on the dyno, not sure how much tunning we will get done as the main goal will be setting a decent AFR and timing and then seating the rings. Planning at least 2 oil changes that day as well. Here she is....... http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1189317324.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1189317345.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1189317377.jpg Cheers |
Nice Jeff, looking very purposeful, love that color!
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Thanks, Pacific Blue...... Strange how the only thing stock on this car is the tub and I feel compelled to repaint in the original color because the original owner special ordered it that way. The color was not available (unless paint to sample) the year the car was built (84).
I would prefer and orange or mexico blue car, but at this stage after repainting the engine bay and front of the trunk where I welded the oil cooler baffle in I just can't see changing the color. Maybe on the next project....... :) Cheers |
Awesome....
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i actually really like the colour of your car.
IMO much more suiting then mexico blue or orange. I know those were IROC colours, but they're also old, and IMO look a little off anyways. keep us updated on the dyno tuning. which brand of wheels are those? they look amazing! |
Those are the latest set of Kodiaks I made. 16lb front and 16.5lb rear (17x7.5/9.0) My track set will be a different style and completely black......
Cheers |
Jeff...the car looks great already.
Love the wheels. You've done an incredible job with it to date. Keep up with the updates. |
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I love your car Jeff - glad to see the end is in site
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Jeff,
The car is looking great! Those wheels look even better on the car. Are you going to run rocker panels or keep it how it is? I have been going back and forth as to whether or not to put rocker panels on my car before it goes in for paint. What mirrors are you going to run? -Shawn |
Very cool Jeff, now I have a better idea of what your talking about. You'ra a man after my own heart!
I can'y wait to put my new Kodiaks on! |
Thanks guys, your comments keep me motivated.
Shawn, I am not sure yet about the rockers, some guy made me a great set of 964 ones that maybe I should put on... :) Jeremy, the end is in sight? OK, I will take your word for it! (after we have a drink at RRIII you can judge that..) Mike, your wheels look cool, I can't wait to see pics of them on your car! They should go out this week. Thinking about a set of identical ones but completely black as my second set. Mind you I have 5 sets there being done so I guess I can be choosey.... Nick, I hear you on the colors and have bantered back and forth with Shawn and others about the color and whether or not I would still think a bright orange car is cook in a year or two... Next pics will be of it going onto the flackdeck and beign rolled up onto the dyno. Hopefully no pics of smoke and fire and melting aluminum... :) Cheers |
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Good to see you got the motor running and the car off the stands. When I was there a month ago I didn't think it would be possible so soon...:) Can't wait to see what transpires when you make the dyno carousel... Ralph |
Ok Jeff, the color of the new wheel centers is perfect. What is it?
Bob |
Ralph, sounds good to me, Lets get together with boys down there, glad you are going to make it!
Bob, that is the "hardcoat anodyzing" I was mentioning to you on the phone. I am pretty pleased with the look of them. cheers |
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