Blown Engine – looking for advice

[kapple]

This summer I purchased a 1978 911SC Porsche through a private sale.

I have driven it for less than two months and the engine has blown. The car was towed to a garage that repairs Porsche's and other European cars and now the mechanic is saying that I need to rebuild.

He told me that I’d be better off replacing the engine with a 3.2L out of a Carerra from 1984-1986 since I have a 915 transmission in the car.

His reasoning was that it’d cost me about $1k for him to tear the whole engine down and even then from the sounds it’s making he thinks there’s a fair chance that it would cost more rebuild than get a newer used engine from a parted out car. Also he mentioned that the 3.2L engine is much more reliable then the 3.0L.

Any advice/thoughts are welcome.

[gigem75]

blown as in????

[Henry Schmidt]

The 3.0 is by far the most reliable 911 engine ever built. In the 30 years of building these engine no other engine comes close.
It sound like your guy doesn't really want to rebuild it.
Try to find a company close to you that has experience in 911 overhauls and bite the bullet. A quality rebuilt is far more valuable than a used anything. (the big unknown)
You could also buy a book and take a swing at it yourself.
This forum will be a source of infinite information if the DIY route suits you.

[dcriss]

Hi kapple,

Sorry to hear about your bad luck. However all may not be lost. First of all what is a "Blown" engine? In my case (and many other 911's) the large amounts of smoke and lack of combustion may be due to broken exhaust head bolts (again...this is a very normal problem with Dilavar exhaust head bolts).

Other questions to ask yourself are:
1) How many miles does the engine have on it?
2) Has the engine ever been rebuilt?
3) What do you plan to do with the car and how long to you plan to keep it?

$1K to tear the engine down sounds expensive, but $1K to for an entire rebuild sounds cheep. (which is it????) Also, how well known is your repair shop and can thy be trusted?

Finally, you won't be able to touch a 3.2L for $1K and if your builder says he can the run away very fast...funny business is going on. Even if you can get a 3.2L for $3K-$5K, it may not last you very long before it needs to be rebuilt also (it sure would give you a kick in the butt as far as HP though). Additionally, an original 3.0L that matches the car's VIN will help retain some value to the resale of the cars and a good 3.0L rebuild could last you another 150,000 to 200,000 miles (even with it built with more power than stock).

Remember, Knowledge is POWER with it come to dealing with repair shops and making decisions like you have ahead of you.


Good luck. Hope this helps you out.

[kapple]

Originally Posted by gigem75

blown as in????

I wasn’t very clear so I’ll try to clarify a few things.

I was driving it home from work one day and all of a sudden I hear a knocking sound as soon as I could I went to pull over the road to investigate then I started to loose power (I guess I lost compression maybe?) my revs went way down despite the gas being depressed. I was only going 60km/h so I wasn’t ripping around like a maniac or anything.

[kapple]

Originally Posted by Henry Schmidt

The 3.0 is by far the most reliable 911 engine ever built. In the 30 years of building these engine no other engine comes close.
It sound like your guy doesn't really want to rebuild it.
Try to find a company close to you that has experience in 911 overhauls and bite the bullet. A quality rebuilt is far more valuable than a used anything. (the big unknown)
You could also buy a book and take a swing at it yourself.
This forum will be a source of infinite information if the DIY route suits you.

The guy had said that he wouldn’t be able to take on a project like this until the winter time, so he was upfront about that part.

I picked up Wayne’s book on how to rebuild/modify a Porsche 911 engine.

I look a look through it but I’ll be honest when I say I am a little apprehensive about taking on that project myself because I have zero experience in car maintenance so I am currently examining all my options before I make a decision.

[kapple]

Originally Posted by dcriss

Hi kapple,

Sorry to hear about your bad luck. However all may not be lost. First of all what is a "Blown" engine? In my case (and many other 911's) the large amounts of smoke and lack of combustion may be due to broken exhaust head bolts (again...this is a very normal problem with Dilavar exhaust head bolts).

Other questions to ask yourself are:
1) How many miles does the engine have on it?
2) Has the engine ever been rebuilt?
3) What do you plan to do with the car and how long to you plan to keep it?

$1K to tear the engine down sounds expensive, but $1K to for an entire rebuild sounds cheep. (which is it????) Also, how well known is your repair shop and can thy be trusted?

Finally, you won't be able to touch a 3.2L for $1K and if your builder says he can the run away very fast...funny business is going on. Even if you can get a 3.2L for $3K-$5K, it may not last you very long before it needs to be rebuilt also (it sure would give you a kick in the butt as far as HP though). Additionally, an original 3.0L that matches the car's VIN will help retain some value to the resale of the cars and a good 3.0L rebuild could last you another 150,000 to 200,000 miles (even with it built with more power than stock).

Remember, Knowledge is POWER with it come to dealing with repair shops and making decisions like you have ahead of you.


Good luck. Hope this helps you out.

Well the car at this time doesn’t turn over, and it sounds like something has come loose somewhere inside and is being thrown about.

1)The engine has 116 000 miles
2)I have an original bill that looks like a top engine rebuild was done.
3)Well I bought the car because I have wanted a 911 since I was very young and was hoping to have it for a while. It wasn’t going to become my daily driver but just something I could take out a couple times a week into work or on the weekend.

The whole $1k thing I mentioned was that he’d charge me $1k to tear the engine down to determine what is wrong and if it can be rebuilt. He said the cost to rebuild would be $7k and that price could easily go up as the project goes on.

He had said that instead of rebuilding the engine I should weigh the option of replacing the engine with a used 3.2L that’s been parted out of another car.

[TibetanT]

Kapple:

I have a stock 1978 3.0L engine available. The car it came out of got into an accident. It runs strong, has good leak down numbers and compression.
I ran it in my 1983 911SC Targa last year for about 1200 miles. It is a good engine and would bolt right-up for you.

Are you interested? If so, Email me at
edward_paquette@hotmail.com

We can work out the details.

I am looking for $4,700.00 plus shipping costs, or if Ottawa is not too far you can come pick it up.

[Steve@Rennsport]

Kapple:

If Ed's engine checks out as he said, thats really good deal for your car,...

[efhughes3]

I will say, from recent experience in parts and machining invoices, that IF you need a complete rebuild on a 116K mile engine, it will most definitely cost more to rebuild (correctly and not cut corners) than if you were to find a used engine to buy. Having said that, when you buy a used engine, you buy a USED engine. It isn't an inexpensive proposition and you have some unknowns there.

But, these engines can run a long time, and perhaps Ed's piece could be a viable option for you.

I think SC's and Carreras are pretty reasonable to maintain from a cost standpoint if you do things yourself. But, engine rebuilds pile on cost pretty quickly.

[fintstone]

There is really not any way to do this cheaply. If you do not feel capable of doing the work yourself...you can buy a good used engine or pull the engine and send it to a Porsche engine expert like Henry (Supertec) for rebuild. It will cost a little more, but it will be perfect...and carry a warranty. You might even decide you want to try to increase the performance a bit since you will likely need to replace some of those parts anyways. That is what I did. He built mine in 2003 and I could not be any happier with my engine. Do a search and you will see some of his work here on PP.

[lindemans]

The youngest 3.2 engines are 18 or more years old; they too have had a life.
Often engines on the market were not removed from their chassis without reason.

So, when buying a 20 year old 3.2 engine without any clue of what it has been through: be prepared that it needs a rebuild too (if is doesn't you're lucky, but it would be foolish to bet it won't).

Then better save the purchase price of that used 3.2 and get your 3.0 done properly. 95% chance that it will turn out to be lowest total cost (desptite the fact that it will cost a bit).

I wouldn't worry about the USD 1k to tear it down, but be more worried about hiring the right skills to put it back together. Pick a guy who has done it succesfully before, really do...

[kapple]

Thank you everyone for all your advice, you've all been very helpful.

I think at this point it’d be best to rebuild it and not even think about getting another engine.
I’m going to take the engine I have and disassemble myself and see if I can rebuild it.

Looks like I have a nice little winter project for myself.

[cgarr]

Originally Posted by kapple

Thank you everyone for all your advice, you've all been very helpful.

I think at this point it’d be best to rebuild it and not even think about getting another engine.
I’m going to take the engine I have and disassemble myself and see if I can rebuild it.

Looks like I have a nice little winter project for myself.

Excellent, Just start a new thread, this is the place to do it, oh and get some pics up, I like pictures..

[lindemans]

Having read Waynes books (how to rebuild and 101 projects) about 10 times I plan on doing the job this winter too !

[Grady Clay]

Kapple,

Good for you. Disassembly yourself will save the $1K cost. With a digital camera and this Forum you should be able to diagnose the problem. I recommend you do this asap.

I recommend you consider working a ‘deal’ with Pelican TibetanT (Ed Paquette) and have his engine inspected and available. You may need it and the price is right.

This would allow you to rebuild his engine using the best of both engines. You can offset the cost by selling the good leftovers.

If this was a bearing failure, you need to pay close attention to cleaning the oil system (coolers, thermostats, lines and oil tank.)

I also recommend you get Bruce Anderson’s book (available from our host), copy the relevant sections of the Factory Workshop Manual and buy the Porsche ‘Spec Book’ WKD 422.720.(’78-’81).

You will find a lot of help here.

Best,
Grady