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Assembling 1966 901/05 Engine- Phase I- Bottom End

First order of business after obtaining a replacement crank was to clean it thoroughly. As some of you may know, I paid some "stupidity tax" for leaving my freshly micropolished crank in a garage coated only with WD-40. WD-40 is not an adequate rust preventive substance for long-term storage. My original crank, which had been reground .50mm under on the rod journals, rusted. I had it micropolished AGAIN and it was still unusable. It will live on with 2" NASCAR/Buick Journals! Anyway, after measuring the new crank (just to double-check )I soaked it inside and out with a can of Eastwood PRE, which is basically lacquer thinner and other nasty VOCs in a can. I highly recommend the use of a 3M organic vapor filter mask for this operation and eye protection. Anyway, after cleaning the crank to my satisfaction, the next order of business was to install the rods.

The rods were done by Steve Weiner who was kind enough to include an approximate torque setting for the correct stretch, which in my case was 0.0094". (ARP still thinks in decimal-inch) So the procedure was to zero the stretch gage, apply the approximate torque, then check the stretch and adjust.

Now a few comments. First of all, the Summit Stretch gage does NOT have an internal spring sufficiently strong to hold itself on the rod bolt dimples. You, the OPERATOR, must hold the gage in place, and squeeze the gage stem to both center the point in the dimples AND hold it on the bolt. The problem with this is that YOU then introduce a bending moment into the steel beam that's the gage itself? Don't think it matters? The harder you sqeeze, the more stretch you get. I finally resorted to using the "calibrated hand" with just enough pressure to hold the gage on but not enough to deform the beam. I CANNOT RECOMMEND THE SUMMIT STRETCH GAGE FOR THIS REASON. It had an inexpensive Chinese-made dial indicator and the point was too small for the dimple on the ARP bolts. In the future, I'm going to get a custom dial indicator with about 10 newtons of gaging force, with the additional hysteresis in the gage compensated for by the manufacturer. Also, such a gage cannot have a soft iron rack, it must be a quality part and there's only about three places in the world to get it . . . Here I am using the gage, by the way, the recommended torque resulted in just slightly too little stretch, like about 0.001", on the first pull. Not surprising, insofar as on the SECOND time these bolts were torqued, the nuts and threads were burnished, and as a result, had less friction than when the original torque setting was determined. Just for REFERENCE only the torque was about 55 ft-lb at final stretch but as you know it's not the torque that matters.



Which raises another point, you may have seen a photo of some turkey on the ARP web site torquing a rod bolt with his bare hand and a 1/2" box-end wrench, with the gage on the bolt. Here's a photo.



No way in hell you're doing that, the pain would be incredible, unless you had a Mr. T Hand or something (remember how Mr. T would undo lug nuts with his bare hands? Inspirational.) You use a torque wrench (I used the ultimate, a Stahlwille) with a 12mm twelve-point to engage the twelve-point wrenching feature.



Ok, 911SC Oil Pump in place, oil pump seal in case half already. I stuck these down with a TINY dab of Curil-T, don't worry. I did NOT use prevailing torque lock nuts even though I had some. . . how would I know correct preload without measuring stretch by approximating a torque if the deformed threads require a huge torque to lock the nut? So it was lock tabs for me. The oil pump was disassembled and cleaned, somebody had dimpled the gear teeth to indicate which mated with which, I'm not sure if the factory did this. There was a surprising amount of debris inside the pump, even though I had run it through my ultrasonic cleaner first. That all got cleaned out, I was tempted to surface the housing on my surface plate to reduce the end clearance on the gears, but as it's a street engine I left it alone. I torqued the M6 bolts (10mm ATF) on the pump body to the generic spec and applied red loctite for insurance. The pump spun freely prior to assembly, no problem, and I filled it with Aeroshell Fluid 2F with a squirt bottle and spun it a few times. (Aeroshell Fluid 2F is an anticorrosion aviation oil designed for engines that are not turned over in wintertime). Intermediate shaft assembly spun freely although it was a challenge holding the chains on. Ultimately I safety-wired the chains in place.



Next photo: this is my thrust bearing, note the slots all the way through. I know this differs from the factory bearing, this is a Glyco. We'll see if there's any difference at the next rebuild.



Crankshaft installed in case. I used Three Bond 1211 to glue the outboard half of the Number Eight main bearing into the bearing saddle. It needed to be seated in the case slightly with a mallet, the bore was checked and was fine but I heeded Henry's suggestion to glue it in place. I left the back half open for the o-ring and the oil pressure relief groove. Pulley seal was installed DRY, no Curil-T, just a thin coat of Fluid 2F on the nose of the crank to allow it so smoothly go through the coil spring.



Intermediate shaft backlash? WHAT intermediate shaft backlash? I couldn't determine there was very much at all. Now, this is the original intermediate shaft "O" gear and the crank came out of a '69E which also had a "0" gear I believe. So I'm chalking up the lack of backlash to the very cold temperature of the case (about 45F) on assembly. We'll see if there are any issues. By the way, finding a way to setup for the measurement was a huge pain in the rear, somebody should design a jig.



Here we go, chain props in place, just about to put the oil pump seals and case-to-case seal in. By the way, these look the same as the oil pump seals (3), there's just one big one and three smaller ones compared to the one big one and two smaller ones for the oil pump. No big deal, just make sure you don't forget them.



In this photo the assembly lube on the bearings and the 574 have just been applied and the stopwatch started. The case was assembled and torque begun inside 10 minutes and all torque was complete at 45 minutes after the 574 hit the case. Note that I used a very thin bead, and did NOT use any on the main bearing webs. I also put the sealant on the LEFT case half only.



Next photo shows installing through-bolts with the nuts on the same side of the case as the other nuts, this is the way it is in the factory workshop manual. Wayne's book has a diagram for the torque sequence, but it's hard to follow if you're not on the same side of the case. Somebody suggested marking the case with the torque sequence, this isn't a bad idea, although we were able to do it by calling out which one to put the breaker bar/15mm socket on so it wouldn't turn.



Ok, here's one to pay attention to. When I was torquing the case perimeter nuts, two of the studs at the aft bottom of the engine were taking WAY too much effort to get the wrench to click. All the studs had the same black oxide coating with a thin coat of oil wiped off. So I'm torquing away and I hear this sickening "pop" and immediately realize that a stud has failed. I shrug it off and go on, the 574 is setting. The next stud. . . POP! Some execrable Prior Owner probably tried to fix an oil leak in this area by overtorquing these studs. . . so they failed! And the heck of it is, there's just no way to tell, I couldn't measure the installed length of the stud and didn't see any obvious signs of over-stretch e.g. necking down. So if you want to be safe always, change your 41-year old studs! Another stud at the top of the engine was also experiencing plastic deformation that I could actually FEEL- so I stopped before it broke and removed it. You can see it in the photo below.
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Ex-'88 Carrera (Sold 3/29/02)
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Last edited by 304065; 11-26-2007 at 10:49 AM..
Old 11-25-2007, 03:36 PM
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So I took a hefty bag and put it over the engine and put a small hole over the stud so as not go get chips in the engine. I put a punch mark at the approximate center of the jagged stud and used a dremel tool with a 2mm drill bit, first on 8000 rpm to start the hole, then on 2000 rpm to drill it, with plenty of PB blaster for lubricant and to loosen up the stud. I hammered in an EZ-out and turned it with an adjustable wrench (I don't have a tap handle yet). And I'll be a monkey's uncle, the stud came out! Next photo is of the removal of the adjacent stud, hefty bag removed for clarity. A double stroke of luck indeed!



The money shot. I have never turned a wrench so carefully, as so many times when I've tried to do this, the damn EZ-out breaks off, or the stud cracks in half, or Bernanke changes interest rates or some other crap happens.



Ok, this next photo is just the engine case assembled. You can see the missing stud at the top. I don't think this is going to cause an oil leak, there was no gap between case halves at the top, I used 574 to seal it and the adjacent studs were torqued to spec. Likewise at the bottom, when I replace the studs I'll torque to the correct setting. Ordinarily this kind of damage would require that I tear the case back down, but I was able to remove the broken studs so I'm going to proceed as normal, worst case is the engine will leak and I'd be in the same position of having to tear it down again. (Of course the top end would have to come off but there's a procedure to do that in chunks.



Next, I started installing head studs. Two of the studs would NOT go in with finger pressure with the long threads lubricated with red loctite, so what does the monkey do? The monkey forces them! So then I broke my Japanese-made stud remover trying to get them back OUT. ON went the hefty bag and OUT came the Vise-Grips, the only tool a monkey needs! That and the Pelican Parts web site to order TWO new replacement factory steel studs. And while I'm at it, a correct Snap-on stud remover/installer, I should never have tried to save money on that item, and a M10 tap to clean out the holes. I think some ZoopSeal got in the holes and hardened, the threads were perfectly clean before I did that step. You can see the two missing studs.



I only had time to do one side, but I'll clean the holes carefully with the tap, no doubt the ZoopSeal blocked some of the upper holes here too.



Ready for the rest of the head studs, three replacement perimeter studs, and then it's on to pistons and cylinders.

What did I learn? A helper is invaluable in the process, it would be VERY difficult to lower the case down accurately without one person to lower it down and one to spot that the studs are aligning correctly. Also, somebody to hold the crank when the rods are torqued is useful unless you are using a factory-style jig to hold the crank between bench centers.

I didn't push the 574 setup time, through-bolt torque was applied inside of 10 minutes. One step that was helpful was preassembling all the through-bolts with washers and o-rings and Dow Corning 111 (no RTV for me) in advance. I used the cap of my Sharpie with the clip filed off to make it smooth, this was placed over the threads to allow the o-rings to slide on over them without getting sliced. Also, you wouldn't think it would work once the through-bolts are poking up through the case and there's only thread sticking out, but it actually worked extremely well. Thanks Jon for the tip!

And at this point let me thank all the experts and contributors here on the forum, you know who you are, for your invaluable contributions at getting to this point. I can't wait to get to the next step.

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Old 11-25-2007, 03:40 PM
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Awesome job John, what are your plans for this car?
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Old 11-25-2007, 04:38 PM
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Old 11-25-2007, 05:23 PM
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Jasam, my plan is to restore this car to original with the exception of invisible performance updates.

Chad, thanks for the post! I know you know a lot about 2,0 engines and have done a few.

Here are the broken studs.



length 50.7mm
length of long thread 19.5mm
length of short thread 16.5mm

Now, the PET claims these are BM 8x35, the original Parts Manual lists these studs as BM 8x35 SN 1115 DIN 835-8G phr. That means a metric stud, nominal diameter 8mm, 35mm protruding length. . . hold it a minute.

DIN studs are described NOT by the overall length but by the length of the stud that would ordinarily protrude from the surface into which it's inserted. Wow what a sentence, try translating THAT into German.

Anyway, there are really three parts to the stud:
the short threaded portion or "tap end" (e in diagram)
the unthreaded portion
and the long threaded portion or "nut end" (b in diagram.)
The "length" measurement of 35mm in this example refers to the length of the nut end and the unthreaded portion, shown in the diagram as "l."



A few more rules of thumb for DIN studs. Generally, the length of the tap end e, is, for a DIN 835 stud, 2.0x the nominal diameter of the stud. So for an M8 stud, the e is about 16mm, pretty close to my measurement. For DIN 939 the multiplier is 1.25x, 938 1.0, 940 2.5.

A guideline for calculating the nut end b is, for studs whose l is equal to 2x their nominal diameter but less than 125mm, then 2.0x the nominal diameter plus 6mm. So in my case M8x2 = 16mm +6mm is 22mm. I measured 19.5mm, not exactly right, but a little more length we can live with (as Bruce Anderson would say.)

So I'm looking for a DIN 835 stud with an l of 35mm. This would imply that the tap end is 16mm, the nut end is 22mm, and the overall length around 51mm. Let me see what I can come up with.
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Last edited by 304065; 11-26-2007 at 07:56 AM..
Old 11-26-2007, 04:16 AM
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dumb ?

john,
great work, its beautiful.
but a question just occured to me.
what allows you to reach final torque on a stud nut?
does the stud bottom out in the hole or does the locktite secure it?
when you install the stud, do you torque it to a higher setting than the nut?
keep up the good work!
bob
Old 11-26-2007, 08:01 AM
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A couple things.
Why no sealant on the webs?

Guage blocks to get the feel for any measurment tool are a big help in getting correct (or corrected) readings.
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Old 11-26-2007, 08:41 AM
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Bob, the studs are normally an interference fit, freeze them overnight and heat the case and they thread in with a torque way below the elastic limit. They don't bottom. The interference fit holds them when you apply final torque.

JP, some say sealant is OK and hundreds, maybe thousands of engines done that way, I didn't see the advantage of gluing the bearing webs for this street application and the likelihood that I would increase the bearing clearance by putting too much on kept me from doing it. Also, since the webs and the perimeter flange are in the same plane, when the through-bolts are torqued the webs come together which puts more clamping pressure on the perimeter (which has sealant of non-zero thickness between the case halves). Not sure if this makes a difference but I thought it was the right approach, not knocking others who do it differently.

I actually have a set of 87 metric gage blocks and I could have set up a stack of, say, 66.3mm (the average length of the ARP bolts I used) and then changed out a block to increase the stack length by .239mm (0.0094") and zeroed out the indicator on that. The problem is that my hand doesn't repeat its pressure the same way a spring would, so even if I was able to figure out the exact pressure to exert on the indicator's stem, I would have to repeat that at least 24 times.

If I had it to do over again with more time, I would have used a micrometer with ball tips that would fit in the dimples. Zero the mic, stretch to torque, check with the mic. Oh well, the good news is I attained the required torque setting on each bolt so they won't suffer from too little preload, and I'm trusting the properties of the alloy ARP uses to take care of the high side.
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Old 11-26-2007, 09:21 AM
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OK, I can see why you might consider this gluing bit causing excessive clearance.
I see it a bit differently. Pressing 2 "flat" surfaces will cause them to contact each other on their 3 highest opposing points. I feel that the glue will be squeezed out of these areas and metal to metal contact will result......unless the glue has an extremely high viscosity which doesn't seem the case with 574.

The downside in not having glue are gaps which will allow oil to flow out from the thru bolt oil passages. Taken individually, we are not talking about much leakage but together that could be a considerable amount and every bit that passes thru these gaps is taken away from main & idler shaft bearings, not to mention piston squiters. Granted, we are talking gaps of some fraction of thousandths of an inch (WAG) but for hot oil at 6 bar.....

I just glued my case together this last weekend and ya got me thinkin'.
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Old 11-26-2007, 07:02 PM
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JP, a fair enough point. I thought about that but then considered that I'd rather be sure of the correct bearing clearance vs. the flow of oil from the right case half to the left. The factory didn't use any sleeves in the case to ensure uninterrupted flow across the bearing webs, nor did they use sealant on the webs, so perhaps they didn't consider this to be a problem. Consider also that when squeeze-out occurs there will be uncured 574 inside the oil passage. The main bearings are fed from the right case half which means that the oil doesn't have to cross the gap to feed them or the squirters in the right half. I am using an SC oil pump with the oil bypass modification so I'm confident flow will be adequate.

Of course I'm not saying this is the only approach, what this forum is all about is the informed exchange of ideas about issues that confront us as we rebuild our engines. Ultimately I'm sure it won't make much of a difference either way, but it is a good discussion to have.
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Ex-'91 Carrera 2 Cabriolet (Sold 8/20/04)
Old 11-27-2007, 06:07 AM
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John looks great!!
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Old 11-27-2007, 08:16 AM
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Another fantastic instalment John.
Each one full of great visuals and info.

Thanks and can't wait to see and read more.
That is really going to be a beauty.
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Old 11-27-2007, 04:14 PM
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Beautiful work John. I see some tap handles in your immeadiate future!

I'd love to assist when you do the top end and cam timing.

As you know I see some top end work in my immeadiate future

I happen to be stopping a a good tool supplier today so if you need anything give me a call.

See you Fri nite,
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Old 11-28-2007, 05:48 AM
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Old before shot.



After.

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Ex-'88 Carrera (Sold 3/29/02)
Ex-'91 Carrera 2 Cabriolet (Sold 8/20/04)
Old 12-05-2007, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john_cramer View Post
DIN studs are described NOT by the overall length but by the length of the stud that would ordinarily protrude from the surface into which it's inserted. Wow what a sentence, try translating THAT into German.
What do you mean sentance???? The Germans would have a word for that!

Chances are it's something like...

" die Längedesbolzensgewöhnlichvonderoberflächehervorste henwürdeindiesieeingesetztwird "
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Old 12-05-2007, 01:21 PM
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LOL John, why use a standalone adjective when you can make the word longer?
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Ex-'88 Carrera (Sold 3/29/02)
Ex-'91 Carrera 2 Cabriolet (Sold 8/20/04)
Old 12-05-2007, 02:42 PM
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I don't quite now why that space crept into the word there!
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Old 12-05-2007, 02:53 PM
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Beautiful John. I second the opinion on the Summit stretch gauge; I had the same issues.
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Old 12-05-2007, 04:23 PM
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Hello John,
I am very impressed by your skilles and and performance and patience.
Your engine is a beauty and will run better than everything else that I have seen.

But I have some question in regards to my project?

First tightening sequence! Please correct me if I am wrong.
Engine case:
First long M10 main studs with 35Nm and then the outer perimeter nuts. 25Nm.

Can I use M8 selflocking nuts with new aluminum washers? I read some concerns?

Oil pump.
I have a question in regards to the oil pump. What is the torgue of the internal pump studs.
I like to control the torque and secure them with loctide like the rod bolts.

Rod bolts.
Now a question to the rod bolts. Porsche documents are listing to torque them with 50Nm.
Waynes book says 20Nm + 90 degrees. Why is here a mismatch of data?

Case 7R
On my case I replace all outer M8 perimeter threads with Helicoil inserts.

I installed case savers on all six cylinder. They came out real straight. I did it on my own. No risk no fun. I took case savers from EMPI. Some people call it bad. I compared them to others and they were fine. Outer 1/2 inch inner M10 on my 2.7. I did not used M14 case savers for two reasons

No. 1) Bottom copper cylinder gasket surface was to narrow on the case saver section.
No. 2) Cylinderwall ist to narrow as well. Like Frank Sinatra said. "I did it my way" I probably will earn now a lot of critics but the reality will show if it works.

I gave all my std. headstuds bolt away to chrome them. I also gave my chromer some dilavar bolts. Is dilavar elctrical conductive so I can also chrome them as well ?

Next week I will repleace gears on my intermediate shaft. I tested them. They are very tight pressed or. I tried my sears big tripot puller. No chance. I guess I have to use a press.
What is your experience about this?

My last question is on the marking on the bousing and intermediate and crankgrear.
I can find the 0 on the housing and intermeadiate. But I can't find any making on the crankshaft gear. Where is it placed? Is it hidden somewhere. A picture would be great?

Thanks and no broken studs at all.

Bob
Old 01-13-2008, 02:17 AM
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Bob,

Some suggest that tightening the perimeter nuts first helps prevent oil leaks. I believe that tightening the through-bolts first is critical to establishing the bearing clearances, and the fact that the case perimeter and the main bearing webs are all in the same plane means that the sealant gets squeezed out of the perimeter anyway when you tighten them down.

For your magnesium engine, aluminum washers and M8 self-locking nuts (DIN 985) would have been standard. Be careful, there is a particular chemical composition of the washers that is required, imitations do not have the same properties and will crush and deform. Be sure to use only Porsche original parts.

After you clean the oil pump, you need to torque the housing bolts. Since Porsche does not specify a torque, I used the generic torque for an M6 stud, 11NM (8.1 ft/lb). This is not very much torque at all. I also used red loctite to keep the nuts from wandering, probably not necessary.

Rod bolts. The factory changed the torque method later in 911 production to the "angle" method. In this method, the fastener is tightened beyond the yield point-- the advantage is you get a relatively constant clamping force independent of the friction of the nut and bolt. Of course the disadvantage is the bolts cannot be reused. For the VERBUS bolts I would use the original torque method as outlined in the period workshop manual-- I don't know whether this method is appropriate to use with the earlier rod bolts, only the later ones. I used aftermarket (ARP) bolts so the stretch method of establishing preload was used, which is a superior method to torque or angle.

Only experience will tell whether your case saver installation will hold. Good luck!

Chromium plating of headstuds? I have never heard of this process. Chromium plating is usually used for appearance purposes or occasionally as a wear surface for cylinder bores. If anticorrosion resistance is what you desire, I would have the headstuds plated with Zinc. Observe post-plating heat treatment as well to prevent hydrogen embrittlement due to the acids used in the plating process. My headstuds (steel) are black oxide. Dilavar is a conductive metal so it should electroplate but I cannot predict the effect on its mechanical properties, you are a test pilot! I personally would not take any risks with these critical components because of the difficulty of replacing them in the event of a failure and the comparatively limited reward offered by improving their properties.

Did you remove the circlips for the intermediate shaft gears? I would heat the body of the gear to 150C and use the gear puller to remove it. Wear gloves and do not burn yourself. I sent my intermediate shaft to a machine shop with a press to have the gears removed and installed.

The "0" is stamped on the side of the aluminum gear, below the teeth.

Good luck! I hope this answers your questions.
__________________
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Ex-'71 911 PCA C-Stock Club Racer #806 (Sold 5/15/13)
Ex-'88 Carrera (Sold 3/29/02)
Ex-'91 Carrera 2 Cabriolet (Sold 8/20/04)
Old 01-14-2008, 08:02 AM
  Pelican Parts Technical Article Directory    Reply With Quote #20 (permalink)
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