Buying a used camera: Shutter count

[GH85Carrera]

Shaun, you area already way ahead of most mom and pop restaurant food photos. Most shoot it with a single flash right on the camera, and a crappy camera to boot.

I worked as an assistant to a local food photographer for a TV commercial for a large chain. His studio looked like a grocery store had emptied all the fresh food in there.

food

He makes it look easy.

[LEAKYSEALS951]

One of the cool things about digital cameras is that there is no film, therefore no cost to taking pics (other than "shutter count").

When I started, a person once told me, for learning- "with digital (compared to the cost of film), the only bad pic, is one you didn't take."

When I got my first camera- a canon point and shoot powershot, I spent hours just taking pictures in manual experimenting with settings to see what happens.

Empowered by a glass of wine, and a successful tutoring session with my daughter, I remembered an experiment I used when I was first taking up camera-

Depth of field- (as mentioned by RWebb)

I whipped out my canon 50mm 1.2 lense tonight, placed a spare powershot as a subject(at 20 inches on the ruler). Next to it is a canister? of advil? Next to that is a ruler. At the end of the ruler ( zero inches) is a bottle of spray water to keep the dogs off the table. The 50mm canon lense / 5dmkIII(taking these pics) is at 36 inches at the end of the ruler.

Let's have some fun!
(and this sort of ties in to Zeke's 50 1.2 lense thread )
Aperture 1.2 :


At 1.2 aperture, from my SLR, the depth of field is very shallow- It is a knife edge. Look at the ruler- it' in focus between 20-21.5? inches, if even that. So that's a narrow DOF. Hard to work in unless you want to be artistic or really specific. Also- the water bottle at zero inches (background) is total blurr. Some of the brass pics earlier suffer from such a shallow DOF that they aren't in full focus.

Edit- also notice how clean my wife's table cloth is in front of the powershot camera... more on this later...

So let's back it off to 2.8 aperture:



Now the camera powershot is in focus, and the advil container is getting more in focus too. Look at the ruler- 19-22? (approx?) The DOF is increasing. Water bottle in background- still blurry, but you can sort of make it out against the chair back.

Now f 8.0




now the ruler is 18- 25? (I can't remember- and not going back to check)- The water bottle in distance is almost in focus.

Now f 22?




Now, almost whole ruler in focus. Water bottle in distance almost in focus, DOF even bigger.....

edit- aw crap, so are crumbs on table.

edit... and you can almost see my wife's "beautiful awesomely blue wallpaper choice" in the kitchen also...

"It's wonderful honey.."

The point being, go lock yourself in a closet or something and play with the settings to see how these functions affect the picture quality. Takes 100's of experimental pics. go have fun. This is a good way to learn what the settings do. Isolate each element- aperture, exposure, ISO, timing, etc.. .see what they do.

The good news with static product shots is that you are on a tripod, with a remote shutter release (get a remote release, or a tether into a computer, or worst case scenario, use 5 or 10 second delay if you are using camera button to take pics) so timing doesn't depend on camera stability or subject movement,- therefore you can concentrate on DOF and exposure more.

Have fun!

[flipper35]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

The reason a real photographer charged you a grand, he is a professional, with expensive equipment, lots of training, and knowledge.

You will be able to reproduce it with several thousand dollars worth of equipment, and several years of practice. Most likely you will get to a point it is "good enough" and you will be using that on your web site.

If you have lots of items to photograph, you might get the actual cost of each photo to a few dozen bucks each. Learning photography, especially studio photography is not something one picks up overnight.

The best example of that is look at any menu. Photographing food takes real talent to make it look really good. The menu at large restaurants the food looks great. At virtually all small single family owned restaurants the food photos look horrid. That is the difference a professional makes.

Good luck on you new learning experience. I have done for a living what millions of people rush home from work to do as a hobby.

A lot of the food photos for chain restaurants are not entirely edible food either since they use or add stuff that looks like fresh food but is not food or food products. The local places take pics of real food and print them in crappy menus.

[Eric Coffey]

Originally Posted by flipper35

A lot of the food photos for chain restaurants are not entirely edible food either since they use or add stuff that looks like fresh food but is not food or food products.

Yep, lots of photo tricks when it comes to food advertising (not just restaurants). The one that always stuck with me was using Elmer's glue for the "milk" in cereal ad pics.

[GH85Carrera]

Most but not all food pics are actually real food, but you may not want to eat it. Jello is made two or three times more concentrated to make it jiggle more. Turkeys are browned in the oven to make it look perfect, but they are mostly raw.

So yea, it might have a layer of glycerin on it, but it is real food. Ice cream might actually be just colored Crisco and many other tricks. That is all part of making it look like something you really want to eat. And why a food photographer will hire a cook that know how to make it just right for the camera.

At one shoot I helped at, they were cooking apple pies. The chief made about 12 pies to get one that looked just right. They were all perfectly good pies and we all pigged out until we did not want to see another pie. The rest went in the trash.

[RWebb]

they also use a "Food Stylist"

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

Shaun, you area already way ahead of most mom and pop restaurant food photos. Most shoot it with a single flash right on the camera, and a crappy camera to boot.

I worked as an assistant to a local food photographer for a TV commercial for a large chain. His studio looked like a grocery store had emptied all the fresh food in there.

food

He makes it look easy.

I would love to attempt some "professional" food shots. Especially for my international sandwich food truck second retirement. I've found that much of food shops is plate design in itself. When I was a garde manger years ago, that was my specialty. It has to look as good on the plate as it tastes making it always tasting better that it really is.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

[img]
Shaun, I don't know how to attach an image to a PM, so I sent a PM to you regarding this image.

Got your emails Patrick, busy day at the doctor, I'm apparently missing some cartilage, I'm going over them tomorrow, thank you!

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by Eric Coffey

Yep, lots of photo tricks when it comes to food advertising (not just restaurants). The one that always stuck with me was using Elmer's glue for the "milk" in cereal ad pics.

I recall a big controversy about Campbell’s putting marbles in the bottom of bowl to make it look like there were more vegetables In the soup than there really were.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by RWebb

ok, set the knob that says P S A M on it to A for close ups (for general photography, just start out with the P setting)

A means you will set the lens opening (Aperture) yourself and let the camera do the rest of the thinking

for most closeups (not "arty" shots) you will want the most depth of field, and that means the smallest aperture, depth of field DoF is what will look sharp at what distance from the camera (the focal plane + things in front of and behind it)

so set it to A, and then crank the lens down to the smallest aperture (greatest depth of field); you should see an indicator in the viewfinder change as you do this

smallest aperture (greatest depth of field) means the largest numerical values - f/32 is smaller than f/8

take a pic at the smallest aperture, e.g. f/32 or f/16 (I forget which is smallest on that lens)

now, take another pic after opening the aperture up a couple of stops (to about f/11) - then compare the 2 pics (there is an optical effect called diffraction we want to avoid, but it may not show up)


3 things determine the exposure that the sensor will record at any given light level: the aperture, the shutter speed (for product photos, use a tripod so you can set a slow shutter speed), and the ISO (which relates to the sensor - higher ISO means you can use slower shutter speeds and bigger lens openings but will raise the noise level in the image)

Focus:
the camera is smart enough to focus by itself; but not always smart enough to decide what to focus on

you will see a focus indicator in the viewfinder - because of depth of field you will usually want to set the focus indicator not on the closest part of the image but at something a little behind it - you'll then get the closest part of the subject and (maybe) the furthest part of the subject nice and sharp

Light:
- for product photography it is easy to increase the light level

you will be concerned with getting hollows evenly illuminated and not cast in darkness - use small LEDs for that (or light pipes)

the other issue is specular reflections - hot spots on part of the subject (you have some in the pics above) - lots of ways to deal with those, some easy, others very advanced

the easy & cheap way is to put LED lights inside an empty plastic milk jugs or a piece of one you cut up - this will diffuse the light

that's your primer - have fun and take a lot of different shots while changing things - take notes to find what works best

This is super helpful, thank you! I'm hoping Sunday will be a fun picture day to try some of this out.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by Scott Douglas

I predict we'll see even better food pictures in the near future too.

With your help, I hope so Scott!

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by RWebb

they also use a "Food Stylist"

I have a friend who is a food photographer for a couple of magazines. He uses a Nikon 7100 and loves it. He spends tons of time with tweezers setting a shoot up. Typically sprays food with Pam to make it look juicy.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by LEAKYSEALS951

One of the cool things about digital cameras is that there is no film, therefore no cost to taking pics (other than "shutter count").

When I started, a person once told me, for learning- "with digital (compared to the cost of film), the only bad pic, is one you didn't take."

When I got my first camera- a canon point and shoot powershot, I spent hours just taking pictures in manual experimenting with settings to see what happens.

Empowered by a glass of wine, and a successful tutoring session with my daughter, I remembered an experiment I used when I was first taking up camera-

Depth of field- (as mentioned by RWebb)

I whipped out my canon 50mm 1.2 lense tonight, placed a spare powershot as a subject(at 20 inches on the ruler). Next to it is a canister? of advil? Next to that is a ruler. At the end of the ruler ( zero inches) is a bottle of spray water to keep the dogs off the table. The 50mm canon lense / 5dmkIII(taking these pics) is at 36 inches at the end of the ruler.

Let's have some fun!
(and this sort of ties in to Zeke's 50 1.2 lense thread )
Aperture 1.2 :


At 1.2 aperture, from my SLR, the depth of field is very shallow- It is a knife edge. Look at the ruler- it' in focus between 20-21.5? inches, if even that. So that's a narrow DOF. Hard to work in unless you want to be artistic or really specific. Also- the water bottle at zero inches (background) is total blurr. Some of the brass pics earlier suffer from such a shallow DOF that they aren't in full focus.

Edit- also notice how clean my wife's table cloth is in front of the powershot camera... more on this later...

So let's back it off to 2.8 aperture:



Now the camera powershot is in focus, and the advil container is getting more in focus too. Look at the ruler- 19-22? (approx?) The DOF is increasing. Water bottle in background- still blurry, but you can sort of make it out against the chair back.

Now f 8.0




now the ruler is 18- 25? (I can't remember- and not going back to check)- The water bottle in distance is almost in focus.

Now f 22?




Now, almost whole ruler in focus. Water bottle in distance almost in focus, DOF even bigger.....

edit- aw crap, so are crumbs on table.

edit... and you can almost see my wife's "beautiful awesomely blue wallpaper choice" in the kitchen also...

"It's wonderful honey.."

The point being, go lock yourself in a closet or something and play with the settings to see how these functions affect the picture quality. Takes 100's of experimental pics. go have fun. This is a good way to learn what the settings do. Isolate each element- aperture, exposure, ISO, timing, etc.. .see what they do.

The good news with static product shots is that you are on a tripod, with a remote shutter release (get a remote release, or a tether into a computer, or worst case scenario, use 5 or 10 second delay if you are using camera button to take pics) so timing doesn't depend on camera stability or subject movement,- therefore you can concentrate on DOF and exposure more.

Have fun!

This is awesome, thank you!

[LEAKYSEALS951]

This thread made me think about product shots, and how it's a little easier since there is no movement ( I shouldn't say "easier", but one less variable to worry about), but, then I was thinking about timing value and motion, and how it's fun to play with that as well. I remembered a pic of a friend in a local mtb race, and how a slow exposure timing and a pan with the subject can sometimes luck out! Especially with cars at a local events. Make sure to play with timing for everyday shots!

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Started reading the manual and watching youtube videos and websites on using the camera and immediately came up to a roadblock. When I bought the camera, the seller showed me how to focus with the AE-L/AF-L button and then press the shutter button to take the pic. I thought that was both odd and cumbersome but what do I know. Anyway, like every other camera I've owned, pressing the shutter button halfway in is supposed to focus it. Mine does not. I have reset the camera, made sure that all appropriate buttons are in autofocus mode both on the camera and the lens but it won't focus pressing down on the shutter button.

And more fun. I have misled you all on the kinds of pictures I need to take. I need to take four kinds of pictures shown below. I am happy to get another lens which I absolutely have to do. But first have to figure out the camera and why it's not focusing with the shutter button.

[wdfifteen]

The camera and the lens need to work together for autofocus to work. Are you sure your lens is set to auto focus and the lens is compatible with the camera?

[Scott Douglas]

The lens is compatible with the camera according to page 304 of the owner's manual. I think the camera needs to told what lens is attached. The lens pre-dates the camera so is non-cpu I believe but could be wrong.

[JavaBrewer]

Best of luck with your new camera Shaun. I hope you have great fun and success with it!

A few years back I needed to take pictures of our home to put up for rental. Of course I read all the camera related threads here for guidance and ended up buying a used D5100 with the kit lens and usual accessories for $250. It did ok for outdoor shots but I never really had time to play with it and get great shots. Yep the lens was pretty basic and I was considering going to a prime lens, 35mm f1.8, but it never happened. The deal breaker was my daughters prom day, wife armed with iPhone X and me the DLSR. Her pictures came out amazing, all of mine forgettable. So many ways to tweak a DLSR, I came from the old days of 35mm film, with a Nikon FM manual, just film speed, f-stop, and shutter to really mess around with (outside the darkroom). When I retire I might try the DLSR market again with a full frame or mirrorless version which are far more $$$ and a couple good prime lens options.

[LEAKYSEALS951]

THIS!!!!! (is the beauty of product photography...) You have a fixed focal length (If you have a tripod).

Back to the future:
"Where we are going, we don't need autofocus"

The bolts aren't going anywhere.

And with a tripod, neither is the camera.

You do not need autofocus at all. Switch to manual.

Luke- "you have turned off your targeting computers...."

On the picture of Matt (the guy I took a MTB pic of) - I think I disabled autofocus on the shot. The MTB riders were coming down a 2 ft wide singletrack. I was standing stationary. I didn't need autofocus, they were in a (fairly) set range. I set DOF as wide as possible to include them in the pic (within reasons for low/natural light- it was raining in pic/overcast) and instead of worrying about distance from (me- to - them) I worried about left to right tracking.... In your case, You know the distance and the subject is not moving. I'd focus on the half-axle splines (perhaps the brake calipers) as focal points as a starting point (because they seem to be the midpoint between raised/ and on the table focal lengths, get a reasonable DOF and go from there.

edit- another (constructive suggestion)- When you are lining up the bolts / etc. in the pics, use a ruler on the bottom edge of the bolts to line up their position. Then remove the ruler and line up the next line of parts in the next column down. This will keep the bolts lined up in perfect up/down alignment. To help with multiple rows of bolts, I would use a yard stick, which is very long and would overshoot the picture right to left. Out of picture shot (to the right and left), would be a board with graph / measurements/ markers to keep the yard stick in alignment from one row to the next, but out of sight of the pic. This would make product layout quick and easy.

p.s-- I'm liking the 1/4 window release handle pics! At least in terms of contrast/tonal value. They do look (again constructive) like, perhaps a mismatched pair, but that could be the angle, especially if you are shooting at a wide angle. I would also angle the allen bolt on the right window release knob down to be not visible.(as a side note- any 911 I've owned without that feature- I've installed it with the corresponding windows! great upgrade!)
Good luck!

[deanp]

Confirm lever switch near lens barrel (lower right front when viewing from front) is on AF not M.

Press button in hub of same lever switch and look through view finder to see if camera is on AF-S or AF-C. You want AF-S (single focus) not AF-C (continuous focus) for these shots. Rotate the command dial on back (right thumb) to scroll between the two.

Go into Menu>Custom Setting Menu>Autofocus>A2 (AF-S) Priority Selection and Choose Focus. This means the shutter will only release if focus is achieved.

While in Autofocus, scroll down to A8 Autofocus Activation and choose Shutter/AF-On. This allows either the shutter button or AF-On button to be used for acquiring focus.

If it is set to AF-On it will do as you describe. This is useful for locking tracking on subjects in motion. Your thumb stays on AF-On you can fire the shutter at will while panning.