What SUV? Wait, What’s An SUV? My Query.

[cantdrv55]

Or GX470. I have a 2008 and it’s fantastic but only gets 15 mpg on supreme. My Sequoia gets the same but on regular. The GX is plush so it’s wifey’s.

[ramonesfreak]

[911boost]

200 Series like mine, except we do not get that diesel motor in the US. Otherwise almost all of the features he mentioned were still being used 13 years after his was made if that was an '08.

Thank you for sharing.

Yes they were expensive new (I worked with Toyota so got a really good deal) but used they can be had. Gas mileage is a bit rough, but it takes regular gas.

[look 171]

John, I hope we are convincing enough to get you consider looking into a Toyota SUV. They are not cool, not by a mile, like a Rover, BMW or any of the European co but hey, its for utility and getting you back home.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by cantdrv55

Has anyone suggested a first gen Toyota Sequoia yet? I recently went looking for a Land Cruiser to fit my budget but came up short. The cheapest I found was a 2000 LC with about 240k miles for $14000 on the SF Bay Area. Then I looked for alternatives on YouTube and came across a huge following for the Sequoia or “Tree” on YouTube speak. Anyway, that’s what I bought.

Here’s my 2003 Sequoia Limited with all the bells and whistles including 4wd. This already had the lift and wheels installed. I put BF Goodrich KO2s on and had the timing belt, water pump replaced. I changed the tie roads and ball joints myself. The SUV cost me only $4500 but it does have 223,000 miles on the ODO though the 4.7 liter V8 has a reputation for being a million mile motor. It’s the same engine in the LC, Lexus GX470, FJ and Lexus 470.

That's one hell of a vehicle if you ask me. My neighbor next door to the house where I grew up bought one new. It has over 350k on the clock. They bought it to replace their ford truck and used it up in their cabin in the local mountains. They haul stuff to the dump, drive dirt roads and traveled across the US in it three times. No issues but shock and the typical suspension rubber parts replaced by a certain miles. There's no redundancy built in to that truck like the LC or LC450. For example, they have two alternator belts in case one breaks out in safari so you and your family can come home.

I remember reading about the automatic transmission in the 80 series. It came out of a small commercial bus from Japan. The 80 was the last one built in their specific truck factory.

[red 928]

Before you poo-poo this for being ugly,
keep in mind it looks 100 times better
than a new bronco.





PS
the smart move is to gobble these things up,
in a few years they'll be MONEY!

Heard it here first

[911Ghia]

[911Ghia]

Then there’s always a Crown Vic

[HobieMarty]

https://youtu.be/MCvcjfG72NM

This!!!!
I want to do this to our 2006 Quest, gotta convince my wife.

In all actuality, I added a hitch to our Quest and it is a really nice tow vehicle for my Hobie Cat. It has plenty of room for everything and I can lock up the beach wheels inside the vehicle instead of having to leave them tied down on the trailer.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[HobieMarty]

Originally Posted by 911Ghia

Nice!!! We lived in Destin, Florida in the late 70's, 607 Gulfshore Drive, goggle it now and there is only a vacant lot with some boat docks on the canal there, Hurricane Opal washed the house away in 1995. Anyhoo, the Mills family as in Olan Mills, as in Olan Mills Picture Studios, had their beach house across the street from us and my family became friends with the Mills family, very nice people. Mrs. Mills' parents, last name Malone, would come down quite often.
The Mills had a Yellow Jeepster and one day Mr Malone had it out and I was admiring it. He said let's go for a ride and we went to the end of Gulfshore drive where it ended near the east pass and he hooks it left and we head off into the sand toward the beach. There were signs all around stating fines for driving on the beach! Mr Malone was quite the character. Fun people and very nice!!!

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[matthewb0051]

Originally Posted by jyl

Examples of vehicles that might fall in the category - old Jeep Grand Wagoneer, Toyota Landcruiser, first gen Range Rover and Discovery, I’m sure I am overlooking many others and that’s one reason for this query.


Ideas? I come at this from a position of ignorance, having owned a Series Land Rover and a gen 1 Range Rover but otherwise with no experience in SUV-land.

I currently own 2 Disco II, a P38 Range Rover, and a Disco 4 (LR4 in USA). Have owned two other Disco II and a Disco 3 (LR3).

Loved them all. The Disco 2 has this crazy issue with ABS/Traction Control triggered by the ABS wheel sensor. Three lights will go on dash, known as the Three Amigos (ABS/TC/Hill Descent Control). Doesn't really affect anything but the lights are a nuisance.

Not sure what your price point/range is but the early RR models are going for high dollars these days as are the Series models. What could have been 10k or less a few years ago is now 30k or more. The P38 isn't far behind. Same for Disco 1 and 2. I recently saw a Disco 2 for sale that had some off road stuff on it for over $30k. Guy had to lower price but still it wasn't cheap. The common belief is the Disco 1 is the next up and coming thing on that market. I picked up my P38 three years ago for under $3,500 in very good condition. The market on those is now about quadruple what I paid.

Better act quickly. Another option is an imported Defender but those are getting pricey too.

Don't you just hate it when you like a marque and the prices are reasonable then everyone else catches on and prices get stupid?

Edit: I used to think the original Grand Wagoneer was cool until I saw it on Wheeler Dealers a few years ago. The interior was a velour disaster.

[Nordwest]

That Crown Vic video is awesome!!!!! I love people like that Dude.

[Yorkie]

To echo what Matthewb0051 said, Land Rovers are on the up and my '61 Series 2a sold in two hours last month for asking price at what I thought was a stretch. I regretted it pretty quickly.

[jyl]

I sold my 96 RR County LWB for $3000 in 2006 :-(

Another RR classic would probably meet my needs, but BTDT? Anyway my wife still has PTSD from getting 10-12 mpg (short trips, cold weather, leadfoot) when gas was $4-5 back in 2006-07. She’d let me get another Series truck but I’m not really man enough for that anymore.

[matthewb0051]

Originally Posted by Yorkie

To echo what Matthewb0051 said, Land Rovers are on the up and my '61 Series 2a sold in two hours last month for asking price at what I thought was a stretch. I regretted it pretty quickly.

Is that a drip pan under the engine?

[jyl]

So I was asked exactly what are my needs? Following jeep tracks to fishing holes, pushing through snow and ice in ski trips, occasional DD, a couple 1,200 mile (RT) roadtrips at 75 mph each year and some 400 milers. The only hauling I do is from Costco, I don’t tow, want to be able to easily pass on a curvy two lane, but am not otherwise a speed demon. I don’t like seeing $80 on the pump but can pay it, have pretty much rationalized accepting mediocre mpg in return for not causing a new car to be built. I am ok with putting $3-6K in annual maintenance into a car if I don’t have a car payment. I’m way better at replacing parts than troubleshooting what parts to replace, and have come to appreciate the magic of code scanners and diagnostics. Unlike some on PPOT, dropping an engine is a big deal for me, but work that doesn’t involve hoists and machining is mostly ok, as long as I have a spare car (and I will). However, getting randomly stranded roadside is a huge turnoff.

I’ve been increasingly interested in Cayennes, but honestly can’t figure out if they are money pits.

[cantdrv55]

I think you’re less likely to get stranded roadside or anywhere else in a Toyota product. Cheaper and easier to maintain. Lots of YouTube content even about LC’s or the Lexus 470. Both are very much sought after. Not out of place in dirt/mud or valet parking.

[bleucamaro]

Thinking JDM: https://carsandbids.com/auctions/9lzGwxbG/1997-mitsubishi-pajero-evolution

[Yorkie]

Originally Posted by matthewb0051

Is that a drip pan under the engine?

Of course it is. The only problem is that it is not long enough.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally Posted by jyl

So I was asked exactly what are my needs?

Following jeep tracks to fishing holes,

pushing through snow and ice in ski trips,

occasional DD, a couple 1,200 mile (RT) roadtrips at 75 mph each year and some 400 milers.

The only hauling I do is from Costco,

I don’t tow,

want to be able to easily pass on a curvy two lane,

but am not otherwise a speed demon.

I don’t like seeing $80 on the pump but can pay it,

have pretty much rationalized accepting mediocre mpg in return for not causing a new car to be built.

I am ok with putting $3-6K in annual maintenance into a car if I don’t have a car payment.

I’m way better at replacing parts than troubleshooting what parts to replace, and have come to appreciate the magic of code scanners and diagnostics.

Unlike some on PPOT, dropping an engine is a big deal for me, but work that doesn’t involve hoists and machining is mostly ok, as long as I have a spare car (and I will). However, getting randomly stranded roadside is a huge turnoff.

I’ve been increasingly interested in Cayennes, but honestly can’t figure out if they are money pits.

I thought it best to put these in list format to better address your wants and needs. But first I can tell you what not to buy: A 2022 Grand Cherokee Limited. Might be surprising but this vehicle is only good for one thing: youngish parents with 3 to 5 kids that need to tow a boat or go on trips. I got one as a rental while my Cayenne was getting a new front bumper and while there was plenty I like, they were doodads. It was fast but drove like a Cadillac. No brakes to match the hp. Basically a boat.

Making the case for a Cayenne. You may want to look at a much newer model than my 2010 for a variety of reasons. I loved the body style, well, everything about this truck, so it was the one to get. I got mine at 130K miles and it just hit 151K miles. Here's what I've done to it in 21K miles:

New MAFS. Previous owner put in K&N filters and overoiled them fouling the MAFs. New ones were $130 each. Easy install.

Cats rewelded. This is an issue with 955-957 Cayennes. Only one was bad but I did them both just because. $1500 for both. Since this is an issue, if you look at 957s, make this an important thing to ask about.

Driveshaft bearing. Same issue as W124s, quick and easy to do with an aftermarket kit, $475 I think, took less than an hour to do.

Thermostat stuck open: Easy fix but haven't done it for the last 5K miles, just haven't had time. I say easy but it's a little more involved than doing one on an average 80s-90s straight 6.

Coolant tank replacement: $80 and 30 minutes to replace

Rotors and pads: $550 for all 4 wheels direct from Brembo. $20 for pad wear sensors. On a GTS, the rotors are huge. I would have been happy to pay $800 for the kit. Literally 20 minutes per wheel

Door lock actuator on driver's door. A known issue. $375 and 2 hours to replace.

I think that's it. Is that worse or the same as a 130K to 150K Toyota? No idea but my 2001 Tundra ran from 167K to 215K with nothing breaking other than needing brakes and exhaust work.

Addressing your needs listed above

Truck can go anywhere. AWD is pretty phenomenal. Tires are important. I have summer high performance tires and a second set of wheels for with proper snow tires winter. I think you would do well with a since set of all-seasons.

With mounted snows, truck goes through anything safely.

Drove to Colorado and back, 31 hours each way to pick up a Scirocco. It can "safely" tow at 100+mph for over an hour to get to a BBQ restaurant before it closes. And seriously, like any big SUV, you arrive refreshed more than tired.

No towing, ok.

The GTS is a proper sports car that happens to be able to haul 4-5 comfortably. It is amazing to drive. All other SUVs will be boats. A GTS is actually fun to drive. Fast.

Gas is now cheap enough for me to turn off Porsche Stability Management now and again for fun which makes it even sportier and extremely fun to drive. But yes, it drinks gas but at least it's rewarding.

Have owned it for 2 years now, have put a small fraction of $3k to $6K annual maintenance into it. I change the oil with an FCP Euro kit for $110 every 5K miles.

Cayennes can be money pits. PPIs and proper ownership are key indicators of future success. Older Cayennes have fallen into the 944/928 category where deferred maintenance is the standard. But there are plenty of adult owner trucks out there to choose from. I looked at a 55K mile one 3 weeks ago. It was perfect. Wealthy owner. Wanted $32K. $25K I would do but too little for him.

My $.02.

Final note: my 30+ year friend who owns an air-cooled only independent, hates anything new and water cooled, hates Cayennes with a passion, borrowed it for a weekend, raved about it when he dropped it off.

There's nothing else on the road like a Cayenne, especially the GTS and Turbo sport variants. They are in a class by themselves.