How do republicans explain this

[legion]

Once again, the president does not pass (or add all sorts of hidden spending items to) the budget. Congress does that for us. Where Bush's culpability lies is in not vetoing when the spending gets out of control.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/showthread.php?threadid=243302&highlight=veto

[legion]

It's long been my idea that each legislative session in Congress (and each state) should begin by reading all of the laws on the books. They can't pass anything new until the reading is done.

[Seahawk]

Table 7 seems to show that all descritionary spending has gone up fast under Bush Jr not just defense

Agree...my point was that as a percentage of the Total Budget, a 23% increase on less than 4% of the Total Budget isn't top of the fold material. It is, however, symptomatic of the larger problem: too much spending, period.

[cool_chick]

Originally posted by legion
It's long been my idea that each legilsative session in Congress (and each state) should begin by reading all of the laws on the books. They can't pass anything new until the reading is done.

Hell, I'll settle for just reading the damn bills.

[cool_chick]

Originally posted by Seahawk
The interesting point to be made here is that there is no such thing as a zero sum analysis where the federal budget is concerned. Discretionary spending is, including defences spending, less that 8% of the total budget! The rest is law: Social security, Medicare, etc. In addition, each of those spending lines is indexed for inflation, often well above the inflation rate.
Congress passes laws...it is the entire budgetary mechanism that has become an absolute sham, and knows no political boundaries.
No one wants to take on Social Security and Medicare, which is akin to policical suicide. And they all have their snout in the trough.
It is not just Bush, folks, or the Republicans.
I think this whole country needs an f'ing civics class.

No democrat is claiming it's just Bush or the republicans.

However, it's the republicans who claim it's just the democrats. "spending democrats." "fiscally conservative republicans". These buzzwords are drilled in on a daily basis. You need to talk to the republicans about this, not the democrats.

[widebody911]

Bartender! Gimme what he's having, and make it a double!

(*GULP*)

(*BLEEGH*)

Whis is this crap? Kool aide? WTF? Well, OK, I did say "gimme what he's having."

Originally posted by RoninLB
Even w/the Rep's extraordinary spending on social spending household wealth has been steadily increasing since the tax cuts. The trade deficit means we're exporting inflation +. Jobs are plenty full and economic velocity is high. There's so much liquidity available that blue collar guys can speculate on housing. Congress passes business restrictions and still the economy keeps bopping along.

[M.D. Holloway]

Originally posted by cool_chick
Ahh, I knew someone wouldn't fail me.

I'm presuming you're including this Republican idiot (LA Governor 1996-2004).

Edit: forgot to include this fine link: http://www.sos.louisiana.gov/73.htm It even talks to you!

oh ya! I know you are but what am I? I know you are but what am I? I know you are but what am I?

[kach22i]

The republicans are spending liberally.

See, it is the liberal’s fault.

[turbo6bar]

Bush hates Spendin...OH, wait, nevermind.

[techweenie]

It's faith-based budgeting, people.

In the End Times, $7.8 trillion in debt will be meaningless!

[Nathans_Dad]

The bottom line is that the Republican party has unfortunately shown their true colors since they have been in control of the Congress. It seems that whatever party is in power spends like crazy to try and buy up more votes and keep themselves in power while the minority side suddenly turns "fiscally conservative". I remember somewhere where there is a book that talks about the fall of any great civilization and it begins when the populace depends on the government for their livelihood. I fear we are heading down that path. I would do a dance the day we finally have a REAL balanced budget (with no funny math or leaving out this or that spending catagory) and a reasonable tax code. I personally like the idea of a flat tax, even with a luxury tax for high dollar items to augment it, but that's just me.

[legion]

Originally posted by Nathans_Dad
The bottom line is that the Republican party has unfortunately shown their true colors since they have been in control of the Congress. It seems that whatever party is in power spends like crazy to try and buy up more votes and keep themselves in power while the minority side suddenly turns "fiscally conservative". I remember somewhere where there is a book that talks about the fall of any great civilization and it begins when the populace depends on the government for their livelihood. I fear we are heading down that path. I would do a dance the day we finally have a REAL balanced budget (with no funny math or leaving out this or that spending catagory) and a reasonable tax code. I personally like the idea of a flat tax, even with a luxury tax for high dollar items to augment it, but that's just me.

And budget overruns come out of Congress's salary...

[widebody911]

Originally posted by kach22i
The republicans are spending liberally.

They blew the budget...

[Rodeo]

Originally posted by Nathans_Dad
The bottom line is that the Republican party has unfortunately shown their true colors since they have been in control of the Congress. It seems that whatever party is in power spends like crazy to try and buy up more votes and keep themselves in power while the minority side suddenly turns "fiscally conservative". ***

There is no question that Democrats have a reputation as big spenders, and the Republicans as fiscal watchdogs. Those reputations I believe were fairly earned.

I have an announcement. That was 30 years ago people! Things change.

Of the four presidents since 1980, Bill Clinton was the only democrat, and the only one to show even a trace of fiscal sanity. Granted, he had a Republican Congress to deal with much of the time, which is the key to everything, as far as I'm concerned.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely. And right now, the Republican Party is as corrupt as they come. We need some balance back.

And don't worry, when the Democrats begin to become intoxicated with power, I'll rail on them too!

[Rondinone]

Originally posted by Seahawk
The interesting point to be made here is that there is no such thing as a zero sum analysis where the federal budget is concerned. Discretionary spending is, including defences spending, less that 8% of the total budget! The rest is law: Social security, Medicare, etc. In addition, each of those spending lines is indexed for inflation, often well above the inflation rate.
Congress passes laws...it is the entire budgetary mechanism that has become an absolute sham, and knows no political boundaries.
No one wants to take on Social Security and Medicare, which is akin to policical suicide. And they all have their snout in the trough.
It is not just Bush, folks, or the Republicans.
I think this whole country needs an f'ing civics class.

True, true. Most people are not aware that we could bail out on the entire non-defense discretionary budget and most years we would still be in debt. Entitlements must be held in check.

At some point, the US gov't ability to borrow will drop to the point that capital will not be available to fund these entitlement programs. I think this will happen in less than 10 years if the entitlement laws don't change. IMHO long-term the gov't will default.

[Rondinone]

Originally posted by Nathans_Dad
The bottom line is that the Republican party has unfortunately shown their true colors since they have been in control of the Congress. It seems that whatever party is in power spends like crazy to try and buy up more votes and keep themselves in power while the minority side suddenly turns "fiscally conservative". I remember somewhere where there is a book that talks about the fall of any great civilization and it begins when the populace depends on the government for their livelihood. I fear we are heading down that path. I would do a dance the day we finally have a REAL balanced budget (with no funny math or leaving out this or that spending catagory) and a reasonable tax code. I personally like the idea of a flat tax, even with a luxury tax for high dollar items to augment it, but that's just me.

"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.

Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage. " -- authors unknown.

Hey, I buy it. Seems like were somewhere around 'selfishness to complacency'

http://www.geocities.com/nerolsnilloc/library/tytler.html

[Nathans_Dad]

Ah! There's the quote! Someone on Pelican comes through!! I think I'm heading into apathy...time to move to Bermuda.

[hardflex]

Last week, to my amazement, GWB actually threatened to veto a bill!!! But his reason was there was NOT ENOUGH defense spending. As it is, we spend as much as the rest of the world combined...

[Mulhollanddose]

Originally posted by kach22i
The republicans are spending liberally.

See, it is the liberal’s fault.

There would absolutely be cuts if Democrats didn't yell 'RACIST, BABY KILLER...STARVING GRANDMA...HOMELESSNESS...MEAN NASTY REPUBLICANS'...every time Republicans tried it.

Republicans have no balls, Democrats have no scruples or sense.

[Mulhollanddose]