Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How to deal with musluims that state we must all die or c
 

I know hundreds of Christians and Jews, and none of them worship Allah, the god with Mohammed as his messenger.

You forgot this part;

Kafir (Arabic: ???? k?fir; plural ????? kuff?r) is an Arabic word meaning an unbeliever, a person who hides, denies, or covers the truth. ...Debate exists between some Muslim scholars as to whether the term applies to Jews and Christians.

Also, Wikipedia is not a thouroughly reliable source. Is is written by liberal Islam apologists like yourself. ;)

A good take on the topic;

Daniel Pipes' Weblog

Are Christians Infidels (Kafirs)?
March 21, 2005

"Islam never refers to Christians as infidels," announced Mohammed Fahmy, professor of industrial technology at the University of Northern Iowa, at the three-day annual Iowa Conference on Islam sponsored in part by Iowa State University's Muslim Student Association and the university's Office of Multicultural Student Affairs. Among others in the audience was Ted Tedesco, mayor of ISU's hometown, Ames, who thanked the group for its efforts to educate and correct misconceptions about Islam.

All very friendly. But is it true? The English word infidel is the standard translation for the Arabic word kafir (Arabic pl. kuffar), which Hans Wehr, Dictionary of Modern Written Arabic (Beirut: Librarie du Liban, 1974), p. 833, defines (among other things) as "unbeliever, infidel, atheist."

In fact, the word has historically been regularly applied to Christians. Muhammad Al-Mukhtar Al-Shinqiti, director of the Islamic Center of South Plains, Lubbock, Texas, recently explained the matter this way at an Islamist website where learned sheikhs answer questions. To the inquiry, "Are we allowed to call a Christian person kafir?" he replied:

Kafir in Arabic has two meanings: 1) a non-Muslim, a person who denies Allah or Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him); 2) ungrateful, a person who is not thankful to the favors of Allah. The second meaning can be also used for Muslims who do not show gratitude to Allah. Kafir in this meaning is the opposite of "shakir" (thankful). Christians and Jews are kuffar because they rejected the Prophethood of Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him). …

However, kafir is now a derogatory term, and that is why I would encourage Muslims to use the term "non-Muslims" when referring to people of different faiths.

What Al-Shinqiti writes is correct: Christians are technically speaking kafirs and it is, to put it mildly, an impolite term.

Well maybe they're making some "progress" after all. Political Correctness appears to be coming.:)

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How to deal with musluims that state we must all die or convert
 

No you won't... how do you keep them lit?

Whereas Jews, Christians, and Muslims all believe in the same God of Abraham and Moses (Old testament Moses not PPOT Moses)

However Jews and Christians categorically do not believe (edit: I should have said recognize) Mohammad the (edit: or as a) profit who wrote (edit: their book of theology) the Koran and I think that would put them [Jews and Christan's] on the infidels list.

But I didn't stay at a holiday Inn last night nor do I claim to be an expert on Islamic theology.

scott..you must stay at a holiday inn 'express' in order to be enlightened. therein accounts for your gap in knowledge.. ;) try it tonight..you'll see what i mean.

LOL oh contrare, my biblical friend. First of all, are you saying Wiklipedia is now "wrong" because it disagrees with you? Additionally, provided two sources. Thirdly, what on earth am I or this article supposedly "apologizing" for? :rolleyes:

Truth of the matter is, I've known Muslims who feel a Kafir is simply a non-muslim and nothing more, and others who think it's a Pagan (or polytheist believers, idol worshippers, athiests, etc.). Also, the tierm Kafir isn't necessarily deragory.

But the bottom line is, we are Dhimmi. Well maybe you aren't....maybe you're some sort of devil worshipper or something in long flowing robes.....

Um, not quite, my long-beard buddy. What he writes is what you want to hear, and nothing more. It helps to justify your irrational thoughts.

Beard? Robes? Devil worship? Nah. Just a beer swilling infidel like you. :D :D :D

No, no.... it's much worse than that...

He's a RAIDERS fan (shudder)

Raiders who?


BWWWAAAAAA

Cool Chick, so glad to see you've sobered up, don't have a hangover and are back on board. When you've finished giving us your inspired input here perhaps we could also have your considerations in the other muslim thread.

Glad to see you have absolutely no clue what you're talking about as usual. Just another day in Isabo's troll-life world.

WTF are you talking about?

Edit: ahhh.......I get it now....Isabo's jealous......

Moses, Scott, don't be civilized to me, you make Isabo feel bad about herself.....

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: How to deal with musluims that state we must all die or convert
 

I just wanted to elaborate on this a bit. The belief is we got the "incorrect" word of God, but we are believers of God nonetheless. So no, technically, we'd not be infidels, we're believers, except for Moses (the PPOT Moses, that is). Infidels are nonbelievers.

No splitting hairs here...I'm pretty sure I'm an infidel. And a heathen. :>)

Mike

What I don't like is all the mollycoddling going on in European countries. I forgot where, but some country banned flying their own flag in their schools, because it offends muslims.

WHISKEY TANGO FOXTROT???!?!?

When countries and nations start betraying themselves and their identities so as not to offend an immigrant ethnic or religious group... they are already lost.

Muslims will infiltrated under the guise of immigration, multiply at greater rates than the native population, and eventually become a majority. Then.. wait for it...

SHARIA LAW

Mate,

My Job requires Security Clearance which I have, so I do have an understanding of that "all of the above"

The only people who have to be afraid are the people who are unethical or do things which are wrong.

Trust me I sleep extremly well at night. Beside's God's got's got my back anyway........

MY girfriend is worth any number of braindead racist redneck's you'd care too mention and then some.

Cos bro, I've been there, done it, got the tshirt. So take your foot outta ya a$$ before you even try and step upto me. cos you aint ****

Re: Re: Re: How to deal with musluims that state we must all die or convert
 

Hey peace man :)

welll and truly retracted........

no offense bro :) :)

I have been a white boy, a goy, haole, a gaijin and if I am a "kafir" I could not care in the least. Considered derogatory? I don't care about that either.

That the Union Jack does not fly over British prisons (note the embedded St. Georges Cross), that the perpetuation of South Asian caste and class systems continues in the U.K. and the Euros are so stupid to give up on faith and think that all that have been invited in would do the same is not amusing to me. But they have a long and nasty history over there - and they are stupidly creating problems faster than solutions - what can anyone expect?

But in places like Darfur - being a Kafir, a non-Muslim and non-Arab has real and nasty consequences. Like you and your family becoming dead. After being starved, raped or shot. It is those people and others being persecuted around the world that we should remember that words like "kafir" have real meaning..:(

In darfur it don't even matter if you're a muslim. If you're not part of the arab ruling class, you and your entire family are subject to the worst possible persecutions.

Not that anyone even cares...