 
					|   | 
 | 
 | 
| 
 | 
| 
 | |||||||
|  | 
|  | LinkBack | Thread Tools | Rate Thread | 
| Targa, Panamera Turbo Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Houston TX 
					Posts: 22,366
				 | 
				
				Lets See How Good You Are At Establishing the Failure Mode of this Bearing
			 
			Here are a few pics of a bearing I checked out last week.  There are a few interesting things at work here.  Lets see what you guys come up with.  feel free to use assumptions but keep in mind, the bearing is oil lubricated from a pump.  It holds a shaft that is turning a Titanium alloy cowl for the aerospace industry.  Very high pressure, very dirty, very hot.             
				__________________ Michael D. Holloway https://simple.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_D._Holloway https://5thorderindustry.com/ https://www.amazon.com/s?k=michael+d+holloway&crid=3AWD8RUVY3E2F&sprefix= michael+d+holloway%2Caps%2C136&ref=nb_sb_noss_1 | ||
|  12-19-2006, 02:45 PM | 
 | 
| Targa, Panamera Turbo Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Houston TX 
					Posts: 22,366
				 | 
			One side is a thrust bearing and the other is roller bearing.
		 
				__________________ Michael D. Holloway https://simple.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_D._Holloway https://5thorderindustry.com/ https://www.amazon.com/s?k=michael+d+holloway&crid=3AWD8RUVY3E2F&sprefix= michael+d+holloway%2Caps%2C136&ref=nb_sb_noss_1 | ||
|  12-19-2006, 02:47 PM | 
 | 
| least common denominator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: San Pedro,CA 
					Posts: 22,506
				 | 
			The flew is outa sque on the treadle
		 
				__________________ Gary Fisher 29er 2019 Kia Stinger 2.0t gone  1995 Miata Sold 1984 944 Sold  I am not lost for I know where I am, however where I am is lost. - Winnie the poo. | ||
|  12-19-2006, 02:53 PM | 
 | 
| Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2000 Location: Lacey, WA. USA 
					Posts: 25,309
				 | 
			The technical term for this particular failure event is "fukt up."  It results from the bearing undergoing heat and friction forces outside its design specifications.  Happens all the time in flux capacitors.
		 
				__________________ Man of Carbon Fiber (stronger than steel) Mocha 1978 911SC. "Coco" | ||
|  12-19-2006, 02:56 PM | 
 | 
| Targa, Panamera Turbo Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Houston TX 
					Posts: 22,366
				 | 
			Actually there are at least 4 failure modes at play...Scott and Supe...sorry dudes.
		 
				__________________ Michael D. Holloway https://simple.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_D._Holloway https://5thorderindustry.com/ https://www.amazon.com/s?k=michael+d+holloway&crid=3AWD8RUVY3E2F&sprefix= michael+d+holloway%2Caps%2C136&ref=nb_sb_noss_1 | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:04 PM | 
 | 
| #29 SCWDP (muhaahhh!!) Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Jupiter Florida 
					Posts: 1,747
				 | 
			Is that a Torrington tapered bearing?
		 
				__________________ IslandmanFL SOLD...78 911SC (ROW) cabriolet/widebody hear BEBE purr!! 92 325is Now living in Sunny West Palm Beach FL! | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:05 PM | 
 | 
|   | 
| Registered Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Arapahoe County, Colorado, USA 
					Posts: 9,032
				 | 
			Chicken and egg dilemma. I’ll speculate the taper attachment came loose from either the threaded end breaking off first or the nut just coming loose. During the “running loose” period, the bearing failed from the high vibration loads. When the bearing failed, the taper nose of the shaft completely failed. Judging by the size of the components, I suspect the rotating mass must have been significant. Hopefully no one was injured. Best, Grady 
				__________________ ANSWER PRICE LIST (as seen in someone's shop) Answers - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $0.75 Answers (requiring thought) - - - - $1.25 Answers (correct) - - - - - - - - - - $12.50 | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:12 PM | 
 | 
| Registered Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: I'm out there. 
					Posts: 13,084
				 | 
				
				Re: Lets See How Good You Are At Establishing the Failure Mode of this Bearing
			 Quote: 
 
				__________________ My work here is nearly finished. | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:16 PM | 
 | 
| #29 SCWDP (muhaahhh!!) Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Jupiter Florida 
					Posts: 1,747
				 | 
			Turbine shaft/jet engine/reversing thrust?
		 
				__________________ IslandmanFL SOLD...78 911SC (ROW) cabriolet/widebody hear BEBE purr!! 92 325is Now living in Sunny West Palm Beach FL! | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:19 PM | 
 | 
| Registered | 
			Shaft is slipping inside the bearing, which equals heat and a breakdown of the hard face ?
		 | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:22 PM | 
 | 
| Registered | 
			Motormeister will repair it for $695.00
		 
				__________________ --------------------------------------------------------------------------- "There is nothing to be learned from the second kick of a mule" - Mark Twain | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:24 PM | 
 | 
| #29 SCWDP (muhaahhh!!) Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Jupiter Florida 
					Posts: 1,747
				 | 
			LMAO!!!!! Good one Craigster59!
		 
				__________________ IslandmanFL SOLD...78 911SC (ROW) cabriolet/widebody hear BEBE purr!! 92 325is Now living in Sunny West Palm Beach FL! | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:25 PM | 
 | 
|   | 
| Un Chien Andalusia | 
			Is it a twin row tapered roller bearing and is that one of the rollers sitting on top of the casing in the individual photo? Was the damage visible caused by parts of the bearing itself or was there some nasty introduced to the bearing possibly via the oil feed? Certainly the bearing has siezed, spun in it's housing, and probably dropped a roller. I'd guess that dropping the roller probably freed it back up due to the additional play which caused the shaft to run out-of true, probably lost control of it's end clearance and ran whatever the titanium part mounted to the shaft was into the nearest immovable object. But that's just a wild stab in the dark... 
				__________________ 2002 996 Carrera - Seal Grey (Daily Driver / Track Car) 1964 Morris Mini - Former Finnish Rally Car 1987 911 Carrera Coupe - Carmine Red - SOLD :-( 1998 986 Boxster - Black - SOLD 1984 944 - Red - SOLD | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:35 PM | 
 | 
| Registered | 
			How did the pump check out ?
		 | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:36 PM | 
 | 
| Registered Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Lawrenceville GA 30045 
					Posts: 7,384
				 | 
			Yep, they will only replace those parts needing replacement, using their skills at rebuilding bearings in race cars.
		 
				__________________ Mark '83 SC Targa - since 5/5/2001 '06 911 S Aerokit - from 5/2/2016 to 11/14/2018 '11 911 S w/PDK - from 7/2/2021 to ??? | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:37 PM | 
 | 
| Registered Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Central Washington 
					Posts: 457
				 | 
			OK I'll give it a shot.  Even though I don't have any reference material here at home. The roller pitting looks like overloading or corrosion. The color in the outside race indicates over heating. There also appears to be galling / pitting in the overheated area to indicate overloading. Is this the thrust / load direction? I cant tell what you are showing us in the picture of the shaft. The pic of the end of the bearing races looks like corrosion or foreign material intrusion. I will assume that overloading was prevented by design engineering, so, heat, pitting, foreign material... possibly the lube pump inlet slowly became blocked causing bearing over heat and failur. Maby throw in a baked seal or two? From what is presented that would be my first guess. OK let the flaming begin   | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:44 PM | 
 | 
| Registered | 
			it'll buff out?
		 
				__________________ -The Mikester I heart Boobies | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:51 PM | 
 | 
| Seldom Seen Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: California 
					Posts: 3,584
				 | 
			Does this have anything to do with your butt?
		 
				__________________ Why do things that happen to white trash always happen to me? Got nachos? | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:52 PM | 
 | 
| Registered Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Central Washington 
					Posts: 457
				 | 
			Wow 16 posts and no one has started to rant about Iraq or President Bush.
		 | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:55 PM | 
 | 
| Registered | 
			The discombobulator was miscalibrated?
		 
				__________________ Matt J. 69 911T Targa - "Stinky" 2001 Boxster "Stahlgewehr" | ||
|  12-19-2006, 03:58 PM | 
 |