Thinking of buying a Hybrid? Think again.

[Tervuren]

Originally Posted by rob justice

Forget the hybrids - small diesels rule the roost here just now.

65mpg is becoming the norm - with performance a hybrid could never think of.

I'm sure some have lower emissions than the hybrids also.

What's holding them back in the US?

US regulations adding very large amounts of weight to the vehichle, an building exterior car bodies larger than they have to be(more drag). My Porsche 944 is old technoledgy, but because its built small, does fairly well for me. If we could get cars de-regulated, cutting cost, it would be more practical to have two cars, a two seater, and then a bigger one for when you need to haul more. My family grew up with a 15 passenger van, because about half the time we drove places we filled it(living on the road, carrying work stuff, etc). But what if your just making a run for groceries? There wasn't really room for a second car due to costs.

Now we all have our little 944's, which is quite fun.

[911pcars]

"The gas model will still have a long, inexpensive, trouble free life ahead of it, which will be reflected by the market in the resale value."

Are you sure?

It's difficult to predict what the current technology will be 5-10 years down the road. What seems unfeasible now may turn out to be fairly common..... and vice versa. Placing the current situation into an unknown future isn't valid; it doesn't provide valid solutions or scenarios for the future.

For example, compare computer technology 10 years ago with products today. Does anyone know the impact, the role of computers, the capabilities we'll have 10 years from now?

Sherwood

[island911]

So you say the batteries and electronics of the then old hybrids should be completely obsolete? ...I can agree with that.

[layzee]

Anyone seen the 2006 documentary - "Who killed the Electric Car?"

From the doc it at least it looks that big oil and big automotive makers killed this promising technology.

As rob said, as a European the Prius doesn't impress me one bit. You can buy a BMW 5er and that will return close to Prius economy figures, the 520d. Same goes for the Audi A6 2.0 TDI. Both can return >50 imperial mpg.

The ludicrous thing is the breaks the hybrids get, whatever their size. To drive in central London it'll soon be ~$20 tax as soon as you enter the congestion charge zone. Stuff like the new Lexus LS hybrid and their hybrid SUV pays nothing! While using more fuel than the equivalent high-tech diesel.

Even crazier is the latest ultra-efficient diesels like the new VW Polo Bluemotion are still charged this congestion tax, while a Prius/Lexus is exempt. This thing will do 70mpg highway and only emits 100g CO2/km.

[island911]

Yeah? I missed it. ("Who killed the Electric Car?") ..are there laws against electric cars?

How does someone kill a technology? (other than with better/cheaper/easier technology)

edit; nevermind. ...I found refnces

[the]

Originally Posted by 911pcars

"The gas model will still have a long, inexpensive, trouble free life ahead of it, which will be reflected by the market in the resale value."

Are you sure?

It's difficult to predict what the current technology will be 5-10 years down the road. What seems unfeasible now may turn out to be fairly common..... and vice versa. Placing the current situation into an unknown future isn't valid; it doesn't provide valid solutions or scenarios for the future.

For example, compare computer technology 10 years ago with products today. Does anyone know the impact, the role of computers, the capabilities we'll have 10 years from now?

Sherwood

Of course, on most things you can't predict the future, but I really doubt that there will be any significant automotive technology that is unfeasible now, but common 5 years from now. Or even 10. Just not enough time to go from "unfeasible" to "common."

I don't think advances in computing power are going to have too much effect on a largely analog device like an automobile in the next 5-10 years.

[jyl]

Originally Posted by red-beard

your 15% gas inflation implies $5.25 gas in 5 years. Here gasoline is going down in price.

I guess it helps to have a time frame longer than a week.



Looks like about 17-18% per yr inflation over the past 6 years, eh?

[jyl]

Originally Posted by the

Using similar cars (Camry Hybrid v. Camry Gas), I wonder how resale value is going to compare 5 years down the road?

The gas model will still have a long, inexpensive, trouble free life ahead of it, which will be reflected by the market in the resale value.

Will people be interested in owning the Hybrid from years 5 through 10? Is that going to be feasible, given the technology in the cars?

? 2001 ?oyota Prius is worth, according to Edmunds.com's "private party" price, about $10,000. MSRP was $20,000.

A 2001 Toyota Camry is worth, same source, about $8,000 (LE V6 model). MSRP was $23,000.

Not seeing a problem with hybrid resale values so far.

[jyl]

The diesels available in Europe are great, no question.

Unfortunately, for us in the USA those cars are also unobtanium, for the reasons I mentioned before.

Eventually there will be a diesel-electric hybrid, combining the high mpg of the diesel motor with the hybrid's ability to shut off the motor much of the time. That'll be a hell of a car. Until fuel cells, etc, come along.

Originally Posted by layzee

Anyone seen the 2006 documentary - "Who killed the Electric Car?"

From the doc it at least it looks that big oil and big automotive makers killed this promising technology.

As rob said, as a European the Prius doesn't impress me one bit. You can buy a BMW 5er and that will return close to Prius economy figures, the 520d. Same goes for the Audi A6 2.0 TDI. Both can return >50 imperial mpg.

The ludicrous thing is the breaks the hybrids get, whatever their size. To drive in central London it'll soon be ~$20 tax as soon as you enter the congestion charge zone. Stuff like the new Lexus LS hybrid and their hybrid SUV pays nothing! While using more fuel than the equivalent high-tech diesel.

Even crazier is the latest ultra-efficient diesels like the new VW Polo Bluemotion are still charged this congestion tax, while a Prius/Lexus is exempt. This thing will do 70mpg highway and only emits 100g CO2/km.