Will Algore Become a Pariah

[Red Baron]

Originally Posted by Jim Richards

Let's not. The internet causes Global Warming .

Without Global Warming, the terrorist win.

[Mule]

Originally Posted by nostatic

To me, it isn't an issue of "global warming" or "global cooling" but rather the reality that human industrialized activity is having a negative impact on the environment in a variety of ways. That's where the focus should be, not in trying to predict how we're changing the weather...

I'm sure you have some info to back up that statement or is that just an idea ya'll were kicking around down at the collective?

If you really want to accomplish that, we need to bomb India, China & Russia. All those "developing" economies are dirty as hell. Let 'em go back to hunting & gathering! Nervy b@atards!

[Jim Richards]

Whassup with the blog posts Mule? FOX too reputable for you?

Mule, I enjoy the heck out of many of your posts, but the links to opinion (like azzholes, we all got em) articles and all this pseudoscience propaganda from FOX affiliates is just fighting Algore on his own turf. You want to get dirty...just mud wrastle with ol' manbearpig, hisself!

[DaveE]

Originally Posted by Red Baron

It's not breaking news.

How about these 4 talking points to get back on topic?

1) People are going hungry thanks to "alternative" fuel programs sponsored by Al.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_Policy_Act_of_2005

Law was introduce in 2005 Republican Congress, signed by Bush

2) Fuel costs break new records almost daily thanks to a lack of exploration & new production.

Can't find it now but there was a thread last week regarding the Exxon Mobil Meeting where they announced they weren't interested in increasing production. Besides, my guess is if they did OPEC would simply cut back THEIR production.

3) A lack of production capacity has resulted from refusal to allow new refineries.

Isn't it true that as the oil giants swallowed up the small producers in the early '90s they CLOSED refineries?

4) Halting nuclear power contributes to the picture as does refusal to look at coal liquification.

Agreed, we need to increase nuclear energy capacity but I have concerns about private corporations, lack of responsibility. Coal liquification has been dissed here by those much more knowledgeable than me based on the assumption that it is only feasable above a certain price per barrel and OPEC could easily lower the price once the investment was made.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by nostatic

To me, it isn't an issue of "global warming" or "global cooling" but rather the reality that human industrialized activity is having a negative impact on the environment in a variety of ways. That's where the focus should be, not in trying to predict how we're changing the weather...

Yup, gotta look at the big picture. When they paved paradise and put up a parking lot, it adversely impacted drainage, and elevated local temps because asphalt gets a lot hotter and stays a lot hotter than a field of grass.

This is a large part of why you tend to see higher temps in cities than in the country, even on a day when not as many are driving, like on the "Day without an illegal alien" or whatever it was called when all the illegals took the day off to "show the white man how much he needs them"

This is basic physics, common knowledge stuff Mule

[Jim Richards]

Let's put a reactor in every home.

http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/2007/12/toshibas-home-n.html

[DaveE]

Originally Posted by Jim Richards

Let's put a reactor in every home.

http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/2007/12/toshibas-home-n.html

Just remember, Jim. When I bury my nuclear waste, the Chesepeake is downstream............

[MichiganMat]

Originally Posted by Tobra

Yup, gotta look at the big picture. When they paved paradise and put up a parking lot, it adversely impacted drainage, and elevated local temps because asphalt gets a lot hotter and stays a lot hotter than a field of grass.

This is a large part of why you tend to see higher temps in cities than in the country, even on a day when not as many are driving, like on the "Day without an illegal alien" or whatever it was called when all the illegals took the day off to "show the white man how much he needs them"

This is basic physics, common knowledge stuff Mule

But this ofcourse is just a matter of bad design. Cities like Chicago are leading the way in implementing green roofs on their buildings which is really improving the quality of life in the downtowns. Its just bad design in need of repair. Ford's River Rouge plant had the same upgrades a few years ago, the difference is unbelievable. Industry can live in harmony with nature if the steps are taken.

[Mule]

Originally Posted by Jim Richards

From another "source" in Red Baron's linked article, this time the Hadley Centre:

Climate change and global variability
5 March 2008

A significant drop in global average temperature in January 2008 has led to speculation that the Earth is experiencing a period of sustained cooling.

Why is cooling "speculation" when warming is unmitigated proof of a deadly trend?

A brief look at the graph depicting January global average temperatures reveals large variability in our climate year-on-year, but with an underlying rise over the longer term almost certainly caused by man-made emissions of greenhouse gases.

What the hell is "almost certainly caused by man-made emissions of greenhouse gases?" There's some science for ya'! Let's see, variance in the giant ball of atomic fire that provides the planet with light & heat, inconsequential, my 928, killing the panet. I'm super cereal!

There are a number of natural factors contributing to so-called interannual variability, the single most important being the El Niño Southern Oscillation or ENSO. The global climate is currently being influenced by the cold phase of this oscillation, known as La Niña (see Met Office: Expert speaks on La Niña).

And here, my dumb ass is thinking it's that big ball of atomic fire!

The current La Niña began to develop in early 2007, having a significant cooling effect on the global average temperature. Despite this, 2007 was one of the ten warmest years since global records began in 1850 with a temperature some 0.4 °C above average.

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/03/070315101129.htm

The La Niña has strengthened further during early 2008 and is now the strongest since 1988/89, significantly contributing to a lower January temperature in 2008 compared to recent years. In addition, global average temperature has been influenced by very cold land temperatures in parts of the northern hemisphere and extensive snow cover.

However, once La Niña declines, it is very likely that renewed warming will occur as was the case when the Earth emerged from the strong La Niña events of 1989 and 1999.

January 2008 may seem particularly cold compared to January 2007 — the warmest January on record and largely due to the warming phenomenon El Niño — but this merely demonstrates the year-to-year natural variations in our climate.

Best phrase in the article, "this merely demonstrates the year-to-year natural variations in our climate."

In future, while the trend in global temperatures is predicted to remain upwards, we will continue to see inherent variability of this kind.

Not all agree. http://ibdeditorial.com/IBDArticles.aspx?id=287279412587175

Some figures are presented here: http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/research/hadleycentre/news/cc_global_variability_figures.html#g_a_r_temp

[Jim Richards]

Originally Posted by DaveE

Just remember, Jim. When I bury my nuclear waste, the Chesepeake is downstream............

No worries. I live right off the Potomac.

[Mule]

Originally Posted by Tobra

Yup, gotta look at the big picture. When they paved paradise and put up a parking lot, it adversely impacted drainage, and elevated local temps because asphalt gets a lot hotter and stays a lot hotter than a field of grass.

This is a large part of why you tend to see higher temps in cities than in the country, even on a day when not as many are driving, like on the "Day without an illegal alien" or whatever it was called when all the illegals took the day off to "show the white man how much he needs them"

This is basic physics, common knowledge stuff Mule

Well, since concrete is white & reflective, concrete should be cooler than dirt. Balance the use of blacktop & concrete & we should be cool!

I'm not saying we have zero impact. But I am saying that one good volcano has more impact in an afternoon than man has in 10,000 years. The Earth has very good recovery ability.

[Jim Richards]

Originally Posted by Mule

MuleOxArmadillo, I'm not saying I beleeb in Global Warming , nor am I defending the NASA or Hadley Centre. I'm just pointing out that the articles referenced by Red Baron's linked article (from The Austrailian), were not in agreement. So, his linked article is, IMO, just crap journalism, much like the blog articles posted here.

I'm all for debating Global Warming , and sticking a fork in both Algore and manbearpig!; however, I'm not gonna get excited by pseudofacts intended to make people get all excitable. Sho' me the science!

[Jim Richards]

And time fo' mo' popcorn! F' using corn for ethanol!

[MichiganMat]

http://www.amazon.com/Earth-Under-Siege-Pollution-Global/dp/0195142748/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1210616596&sr=1-1

This book covers all the chemistry involved in the grand discussion of global climate change including smog, COx, NOx reactions, carbon sinks, indoor air quality, mercury deposits in the polar ice caps, and beyond. If you can get through it all, you're a bigger man than me.

This is science, ie chem1+chem2->reaction producing chem3. Its not as fun as bashing and trashing the messengers, but its worth knowing if your interested in scientific method.

[Mule]

Originally Posted by Jim Richards

MuleOxArmadillo, I'm not saying I beleeb in Global Warming , nor am I defending the NASA or Hadley Centre. I'm just pointing out that the articles referenced by Red Baron's linked article (from The Austrailian), were not in agreement. So, his linked article is, IMO, just crap journalism, much like the blog articles posted here.

I'm all for debating Global Warming , and sticking a fork in both Algore and manbearpig!; however, I'm not gonna get excited by pseudofacts intended to make people get all excitable. Sho' me the science!

MuleOxArmadillo Great!

The founder of the weather channel, who I'm guessing knows a lot more about climate than Algore, says it's crap. I've seen his (impressive) data showing temperature change more closely linked to sun activity than to anything else. It's on one of those links I posted above.

[Jim Richards]

You needed mo shizzle.

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by nostatic

To me, it isn't an issue of "global warming" or "global cooling" but rather the reality that human industrialized activity is having a negative impact on the environment in a variety of ways. That's where the focus should be, not in trying to predict how we're changing the weather...

I agree that our actions are creating pollution and screwing up the ecosystem due to extreme over-population, but I don't buy into the concept that it is changing the climate.
I believe solar flares have a gazillion times more influence on the climate than mankind ever will.

How come whenever politicians or "scientists" talk about man's effects on whatever, the subject of over-population seems to be taboo? It's almost not politically correct to say that there are just too darned many people alive, but it's true.
Things would be better if there were only about half as many people. Or a third.

[Jim Richards]

I'm all for ZPG/NPG.

[sammyg2]

Originally Posted by Jim Richards

I'm all for ZPG/NPG.

I agree. According to the national census, one ethnic group of people who live in California has a negative population growth but another ethnic group has a significantly positive reproductive rate and they are essentially out-breeding the first group.
The result, along with uncontrolled illegal immigration, is a quickly increasing population and the less-than gradual trend towards disapearance of the first group.

[Mule]

Neuter the third world!