Click & Clack & Hypocrasy

[BlueSkyJaunte]

Any of you guys listen to Car Talk on NPR?

I had it on the radio last Saturday as I drove home from my martial arts class (a good 30 mile trek).

At some point during the show they did their usual "brought to you in part by..." and rattled off a bunch of commercials. One was for EPIC:

Originally Posted by EpicInfo.org

The Ethanol Promotion and Information Council (EPIC) aggressively builds positive perception about ethanol’s benefits, including its role in energy security, its value to consumers and its contributions to a cleaner environment.

As past studies are being proven correct ( http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=7308 ) and food prices are driven higher, many of us have come to the conclusion that fuel ethanol represents a false economy.

Just recently the Tappet Brothers had their own episode of NOVA, where they -- get this -- established that ethanol really wasn't all it's cracked up to be.

These guys are funny...but they should stick to taking money from Toyota.

[Jim727]

Yeah - I listen to them for the humor value. They are, unfortunately, pretty much exclusively partial to Japanese cars and don't really understand German cars.

Anyhow - I also thought the epic bit was a bit off-kilter. In reality, I would like a source for fuel ethanol. Before everyone gets their shorts in a bunch, I'm not talking about etoh made from corn or etoh mixed with gasoline. I mean real 190+ proof etoh made from something sensible like sugar cane. In Brazil it's produced very cheaply and it makes a great fuel.

Somehow we turned etoh production into a welfare program for ADM. It would be hard to imagine a more backward way of using the stuff than making it from food crops - and an inefficient source at that. Then we mix it with gas to try to burn it in engines with about an 8-9 compression ratio. Etoh wants about 14 - 14.5 c.r. and runs great at that. Of course, we could import etoh from Brazil where they make it efficiently, but instead we slap a $0.54 cent/gal import duty on it.

Turn a bunch of politicians loose on an engineering problem and you get stupidity.

[onlycafe]

i noticed that too.

corn on the cob....................good
corn squeezins in a jug.......good
corn dog.............................good
corn in the gas tank.....no good!

[slakjaw]

I am going to stop buying ethanol fuels.

[slakjaw]

All my beloved CRP land is going away damnit.

[anotherblack944]

Originally Posted by slakjaw

I am going to stop buying ethanol fuels.

Good luck with that!

[slakjaw]

In MN and nebraska its labeled 10% or whatever.

[911pcars]

OTOH, isn't most of the corn crop used to manufacture high fructose corn syrup and cattle feed?

High fructose corn syrup in your diet will shorten your life span (hot dogs, fast food, soda, etc.)

Corn for cattle feed fattens cattle quicker than grass feed. However, cattle become sick and unhealthy eating this stuff due to its lower nutritional value. Cattle companies compensate by feeding them medicine so they can make it to the slaughter house before they die.

It also costs more to produce corn-based ethanol than other plants.

Sherwood

[Eric 951]

Gasahol didn't work in the 70's, no reason to beilieve ethanol(renamed) will work now.

[berettafan]

They run with the NPR crowd, what did you expect?

Love them myself and really enjoy the show. There are biases to be sure but overall i think they are pretty on point. They are very pragmatic as well hence the jap car bias. Jap cars, Honda, Subie, etc. ARE in fact better than euro vehicles. there really is no contest there in terms of reliability and cost of ownership. some premium euro cars may be nicer inside and sportier but these guys lean heavily towards the 'cars are appliances' attitude and there certainly is nothing wrong with that.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by Eric 951

Gasahol didn't work in the 70's, no reason to beilieve ethanol(renamed) will work now.

It was a Methanol mix then. Actually, methanol would work great as an alternative liquid fuel. It can be made cheaply from coal. It would run well in the flexfuel vehicles and would actually cost less than $2/gal for M85, without subsidies.

[URY914]

Of course they pander to the sponsers of the show. They sell out like anyone else.

I always try to listen to the show. I like trying to guess the solution to the caller's problem before they do.

[berettafan]

puzzlers are good too.

[varmint]

got tired of listening to these guys wheeze/laugh at their own jokes.

[tangerine911S]

My buddy was over a few nights ago and apparently his girlfriend's dad is either click or clack (cant remember which one).

[BlueSkyJaunte]

I can't believe I spelled it "hypocrasy".

[Heel n Toe]

Is "May contain up to 10% ethanol" gasoline harmless to most/all engines?