'Preparing for the worst' by buying guns/ammo. Why?

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by Pazuzu

That's BS. The people on Galveston Island were told they were gonna be on their own, and it only took a few hours (it wasn't even windy yet!) before they were calling 911! The were being ferried out via expensive helicopters the next freaking day!

Cops love us and want us all to be happy and comfortable at all times, and will do whatever it takes to fight off the zombies if the citizens need comforting.

A 7.0 earthquake in LA is a little different than a hurricane in GI. There ain't enough helicopters in the world to get the residents here out. Apples to oranges.

[karosserieltd]

Because at any time congress can ban their sale, manufacture, or importation. There are many who have tried, and they will keep doing so. There are many who want the populace disarmed, and support the UNs global disarmament agenda. I have approx 15k of 5.56x45, 7.62x51, 7.62x39, 5.45x39, 45ACP. Lots of spare parts, and magazines. I am not paranoid, I don't sit waiting for something to happen. I can't accept the possibility of my not being able to defend me and mine if the need arose.

[id10t]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

So did the British in 1776.

And we had more/better than the Vientamese folks (as did the French). And more/better than the Iraqis....

[HardDrive]

Originally Posted by nostatic

A 7.0 earthquake in LA is a little different than a hurricane in GI. There ain't enough helicopters in the world to get the residents here out. Apples to oranges.

My sister lives in LA, out towards the border with Pasadena. She lives towards the top of a hill, and her immediate area is nice, but the areas in valley....NOT nice. Both of my parents and I have told them to have a shotgun in the house, just in case. They absolutely refuse to have a gun. I simply cannot fathom it. They both grew up in familys with folks that hunted. Were not asking them to become gun nuts, just have a box of shells and an 870 in attic just in case. I don't think it is far fetched at all to think that in the case of a major earthquake, you could have civil unrest in LA. Clearly the population has show that this is a possibility.


Guys, I was not arguing against having guns, I was just saying that I didn't see a point in have 10,000 rounds and 50 guns.

Oh....and the ammo prices argument? Dunno man, like gold prices, I think that ship sailed long ago. The time to stock pile ammo was 5 years ago. Prices today are insane.

[HardDrive]

Glad to see we were actually able to make it 3 pages without this turning into poltical mayhem.....

[Pazuzu]

Originally Posted by nostatic

A 7.0 earthquake in LA is a little different than a hurricane in GI. There ain't enough helicopters in the world to get the residents here out. Apples to oranges.

I should have used the [drippingwithsarcasm] tags, huh?

[JavaBrewer]

What's the shelf life of modern ammo?

[widebody911]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

So did the British in 1776.

Do you really think you have anything in your arsenal that's a match for what the Army/Air Force/Marines/Navy have at their disposal? And communications and backup aren't an ocean away anymore. Hell, the Long Beach PD probably has you out-gunned.

The price of liberty and freedom from tyranny has never been cheap.

Nice platitude, but irrelevant.

Like who? And what exactly constitutes a "gun nut"? Number of guns owned? Caliber? Rounds per minute? What exactly?

You know who they are; they incessantly post about their personal armory.

Do you bother to celebrate Independence Day? It sounds like from your absolutist perspective that this would be an inappropriate day for you to enjoy. So why not just report to work that day. Better still, why not relinquish your U.S. citizenship since it was ill-obtained and the result of "insurgent" rebellious activity against the legitimate government (Britain). I'm sure the U.K. will take you back.

Did you actually think that through before you posted it? There was nothing anti-American about my post, just clear, simple logic.

Seriously: any armed uprising would have to consist of a lot of people, well armed and under control - ie 'well regulated militia' - good luck with that. Anything less would be considered nothing more than someone 'going postal'. In a day and age where they send SWAT teams to serve bench warrants for skipping jury duty, they odds are not in your favor.

The question I put to you is: do you think a Second American Revolution be possible today, and if so, how would it be played out? The only way I see it happening is if 2 or more branches of the armed services 'turned'.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by dmoolenaar

What's the shelf life of modern ammo?

Longer than anyone who buys it is likely to live.

[legion]

Thom, I understand your POV. I think the answer to your question is a little different than how you are looking that the situation.

Many of the same things were true in 1860. It turns out that a geographic split made a real war possible. Soldiers from Virginia fought soldiers from Delaware...

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by widebody911

Do you really think you have anything in your arsenal that's a match for what the Army/Air Force/Marines/Navy have at their disposal? And communications and backup aren't an ocean away anymore. Hell, the Long Beach PD probably has you out-gunned.

After watching two bank robbers hand LAPD their lunch in the N. Hollywood shootout, I not only wouldn't want to rely on the police for any kind of help, I also wouldn't worry about their outgunning me if it came to gun confiscation raids. I doubt the military would be able to muster enough men willing to fire on American citizens. Short of a declaration of martial law, they'd be committing several crimes by even thinking about assisting police in such an action. Lots of military folks are regular, law-abiding gun folks. And if you were assigned such a task, would you find such a government still worth defending?

[speeder]

Originally Posted by widebody911

Do you really think you have anything in your arsenal that's a match for what the Army/Air Force/Marines/Navy have at their disposal? And communications and backup aren't an ocean away anymore. Hell, the Long Beach PD probably has you out-gunned.

I don't think that anyone sane plans on shooting it out with the police and military. More like protecting yourself/family/home from unfettered gangs of criminal looters/robbers/rapists/etc. in the event of total breakdown of public services, which is more than a possibility. It's actually happened several times recently in the U.S. When it happens in L.A., it's a little different from happening in Galveston or even San Jose.

Even the vegetarians with cardboard shoes were looking for gats and bullets during the L.A. riots. It was terrifying for people to be a prisoner in their houses watching the local news and trying to figure out if the rioters are getting near them. That's a realistic scenario, not fighting the government.

[nostatic]

reminds me, I need to buy that 870...

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by speeder

I don't think that anyone sane plans on shooting it out with the police and military. More like protecting yourself/family/home from unfettered gangs of criminal looters/robbers/rapists/etc. in the event of total breakdown of public services, which is more than a possibility.

I concur. But I can't help but think of a quote I read somewhere recently. Somthing to the effect that, if people had fought back, even in vain, with chairs and kitchen knives when Stalin's NKVD or KGB came to arrest them, Stalin would have had a lot fewer willing participants in his purges. When's the last time BATF decided to conduct a massive raid? I think they learned a good lesson at Waco.

[deathpunk dan]

I'm thinking either Mini 14 or M1 Carbine.

Both are available at a shop a few blocks away. Having a tough time deciding. What would you pick?

[onewhippedpuppy]

Right now I could only kill 7 people with really good shots. Would that even qualify me a serial killer?

[nostatic]

depends. Are they zombies or in-laws?

Oh wait, one of those groups is un-dead...

[onewhippedpuppy]

Originally Posted by nostatic

depends. Are they zombies or in-laws?

Oh wait, one of those groups is un-dead...

They're both kind of a gimmie.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by deathpunk dan

I'm thinking either Mini 14 or M1 Carbine.

Both are available at a shop a few blocks away. Having a tough time deciding. What would you pick?

Very tough call. I think .223 is a little easier to come by than .30-06 and it's a lot cheaper. I think the Mini 14 would be easier to lug aroung and they take a folding stock pretty easily. Everyone needs an M1, but man, they are heavy to lug around and I sure wouldn't want to shoot one without ear protection. The guys who carried them in WWII truly were the greatest generation.

[carnutzzz]

I think you're kind of missing how a modern revolution would go down. You would see large portions of law enforcement, the miltary, and government unwilling to apply lethal force to their own people. You would also see many join the revolution. Sections of the country would be on their own as it were.

It would be ugly, but it would be very possible.

It wouldn't be a full-on in the streets shoot-out. There would be demonstrations, diplomacy, and certainly some pockets of violence when things got out of control.

Our government would not be equipped to defend against it. It sounds awful and unspeakable yes, but it's also the most patriotic thing one can do when the government no longer serves the needs of the country.

I'm certainly not saying I would organize such a thing- or even that America needs one. Being a bit of a history buff it's hard for me to ignore that we had some good times following our last one.

Originally Posted by widebody911

Guns are useful to maintain power with the people. The better armed the society, the better reminder that our government is supposed to work for us.

While this is a nice sentiment, it is really just a dream:

a) the government has bigger guns than you do and more of them
b) if you managed to get more than a couple dozen like-minded comrades organized, you're be declared 'enemy combatants' via an NSL (thanks to GWB - oh the irony!) and hauled off to gitmo.
c) judging by the coherence of the posts of some of the gun nuts here, you'd get your asses handed to you by a troop of girl scouts armed with slingshots
d) seriously: what do you propose to do? Drive to your local capitol building and start expending rounds? Sounds like a mix of Columbine and a mid-life crisis.