I must be insane

[HHI944]

because I want this
http://savannah.craigslist.org/cto/1109220618.html
I know, it's easily one of the ugliest cars to ever come out of Italy. I still want it though.
Just not for 7700 when NADA high value is only 6200. Hell, my 944's NADA is higher.















Yeah, still want the stupid thing

[svandamme]

check the price for spare headgaskets before you buy it...
Then come back and report back here, and we'll know if your truly insane or not.

[HHI944]

There are a couple of em on ebay for the 2.5l around the $200 mark. Not great, but not bad either.


Probably can't pick up oil filters at Autozone like for the 944 though.

[Jared at Pelican Parts]

I've seen them sell for around $300. For a reason.

Avoid.

[HardDrive]

Why would you do this to yourself? Dear lord....

[Porsche-O-Phile]

When you can smash yourself in the balls with a five-pound sledgehammer without flinching, you're ready for the degree of self-loathing and masochism that is the Maserati Biturbo.

I too considered one of these a few years ago and you wouldn't believe the horror stories that were urgently thrown at me. It was enough to make me abandon the idea and run away screaming in terror.

[Willem Fick]

I have a friend who had one. He reconed that you couldn't undertake a journey to a place without a Maserati service agent, as by mile 100 all the warning lights would be on, and a US$1000 service would be called for to get it sorted. Apparantly another big proble was that the Italians didn't understand the concept of standardisation either, meaning that parts differed a lot from year to year, making sourcing spares a near impossibility.

[svandamme]

there was a guy with a 2.5 BT in the place where i worked on my 911... that's 4 years ago, and he couldn't find a headgasket anywhere for less then 700 euro's... from the dealer it was even more expensive...

[DanielDudley]

I have seen a few that had over 200K on them that ran like trains.

Still not on my short list. The thing is, like a 928, everybody wants a cheap one, but nobody wants to do the services. Well sorted, they will run hard all day.

[MrScott]

Hey! I resemble that remark!

Parts prices aren't bad, cheaper than the 911 for most stuff but once in a while you run into limited supply parts like a distributor cap, for $90. Parts availability hasn't been a problem though, you just need to know where to look.

Cheap to buy not cheap to own so like a 944 you'll find many neglected examples. I bought mine pampered w/21K on the clock and it's been relatively problem-free. 'Buy the best one you can afford' definitely applies here -- the best being maybe 7K. $7700 is way out of line for this one.




My biggest problem with the car's been DIY support. If you're a mechanic, great, there's the factory service manual but for the layman there's no Haynes/Chilton and certainly no 101 projects.

[HHI944]

Cheap to buy not cheap to own so like a 944 you'll find many neglected examples

Isn't that the truth. I can't count the 'why would I change the timing belt if it hasn't broken's I got back from seller when looking for my 944.

I've got a fairly serious buyer coming to look at my bike today. If that goes off without a hitch I may go take a look. I can't see paying more than 6 though, and depending on condition I'd probably offer 5.

His 'only one on the block' statement made me laugh. There are probably a dozen vintage alfa's and a 308.

[MrScott]

Ha! And yes, this is an interference design so make sure the timing belt was changed. Valve adjust is also important. It's done with shims so best left to someone who knows what they're doing.

Hard to tell condition from those photos but if it's ratty I wouldn't pay more than 2K. Here's mine for comparison (which I'm looking to sell for 6,500.) Those are the rare 14" x 6.5" wheels (vs the standard 6" ) Good for fuel mileage I guess? Haha, carburetor + turbos = 13mpg with city driving.









Engine pic for reference. Common sign of neglect is missing air filter hoses -- not sure why, I guess they get tired of removing/replacing with constant repairs

[HHI944]

[QUOTE=MrScott;4591899] It's done with shims so best left to someone who knows what they're doing.
QUOTE]

Oddly, I'm actually used to the shim set-up. My first motorcycle was shim under bucket.

I get the impression that this isn't nearly as clean as yours. In my experience, failing to mention service history usually means that there is none or it was done by an idiot. I'm wondering what the 'few issues that need addressed' are.

[Dottore]

A good friend of mine had one of these. The experience provided him with a huge repertoire of party stories about what a complete POS it was.

[MrScott]

Great, you're at least one step ahead of me.

With the air pump and cat in place they tend to overheat -- you're better off if they've been removed early on. Be sure to note the condition of all air hoses -- it's a complex combination of carburetor and turbos (and tacked-on, 80's-style emissions equipment.)

Post when you find out what's wrong. Hopefully I can help. If you see smoke on cold start it's likely oil in the turbos. The later cars used water-cooled turbos; these are oil-cooled and run hotter so idling after a hot run is advised but not often observed.

To give you an idea, this is my 2nd biturbo. My first was my dad's that had been sitting for about a decade. After a few years (and several dollars) fighting a losing battle I gave in and bought a sorted one. It wasn't that things broke, that's expected on a 25 year old car, it's that they broke faster than I could fix them!

There's a pretty active Yahoo group: http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/BiturboZentrum/
You can check there for advice and maybe find someone local to help out.

[Dottore]

Originally Posted by MrScott

It wasn't that things broke, ..... it's that they broke faster than I could fix them!

Great line. Sums these cars up nicely...

[MrScott]

Originally Posted by Dottore

A good friend of mine had one of these. The experience provided him with a huge repertoire of party stories about what a complete POS it was.

Ha! Do we know each other? Again though, it's a little unfair. It's a limited-production sport(y) car, so sure, you're not going to get the benefits of lessons learned from a long production run or the reliability of an economy car but overall it's pretty solid. The engines are bullet-proof, the brakes (4 piston calipers) are solid, the A/C (suprisingly!) is ice cold and hasn't failed me in either car (of course, it requires you adjust your clutch usage as it takes the idle down about 200rpm.)

They require periodic maintenance -- this isn't a 'fix it when it breaks' deal. The problems with this car are more due to the owners than the car itself. And sitting unused takes its toll on the seals and hoses (and there are a lot of hoses.) To give you an idea of the overall reliability (and the lack of forethought in design) in the 12K and 5 years I've driven mine it's needed:

New clutch (due to previous owner)
Clutch master cylinder
Carburetor float
Steering rack -- apparently the cowl drain is right above the input for the steering shaft (which isn't protected by a rubber boot) and in trying to diagnose what turned out to be a leaky windsheild I eventually filled the rack with water.
Brakes, rotors
Fiddling with the slipping window lifter (it uses a threaded steel cable that wears out every 20K )

That's pretty much it off the top of my head. Not bad for any 25 year old car much less an Italian car from a small, independent company. That said, there's a reason I'm "in the market for a nice SC"

[Heel n Toe]

HHI. Dude. Just drop a small block Chevy in there and you'll have several levels of awesome happening.

[HHI944]

Now there's an idea. Something tells me this guy isn't gonna budge on price and is hoping for a sucker though.

[LeeH]

Here's a GRM article:
http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/maserati-biturbo/