mini 14 versus ar-15

turbo6bar · 12-14-2009, 09:07 AM

Is this more or less a Ford vs Chevy thing? I want to buy a rifle sometime over the next few months. I have read the gun threads here as they appear. Intend to use this for playing, blasting coyotes (packs that can be heard, but so far, rarely seen), and killing zombies. Thinking about the mini 14 and .22LR conversion kit to keep costs down. I don't anticipate needing to hit anything over 150 yards out. Seems like I can get similar performance from the mini 14 for less bucks.

Is there a rifle that would be the equivalent to the Porsche 911 (rugged, reliable, functional)?

I've been debating this for the last several months, and I keep changing my mind: AK, Mini 30, mini 14, bolt action ranch rifle (recent thread by Jeff Higgins). Last thing I need is multiple rifles. I want one that can do it all. Already have too many vices.
jurgen

porsche4life · porsche4life's Garage

There is no clear answer... An AR done right is rugged, reliable, and functional... But so is an AK... Now IMHO the AR will be more accurate out of the box... I have no experience with a mini 14....

daepp · daepp's Garage

Jurgen - I don't know where you live (somehow I thought CA based on your real estate expertise) but in Cali our senator identified banned assault weapons by what they looked like rather than what they were capable of. In light of that fact I went with the mini-14 as it is practically the same gun as the AR (at least to my amateur mind).

I can tell you that I absolutely love the mini-14!

legion · 12-14-2009, 09:19 AM

Yes, this is exactly a Ford vs. Chevy thing. Get what you want.

One thing I like about the AR is that there are A LOT of magazines availabe, and parts are really easy to find.

What would be a "Porsche" rifle? I'd say an AR-50. Precision-built for a single purpose.

Ferrari? Barret.

Bugatti Veyron? Dillon Aero.

red-beard · red-beard's Garage

My vote is AR-15. If price is an issue, go for a lower end one, and then build it up over time.

sammyg2 · 12-14-2009, 09:21 AM

I've never owned or fired an AR-15.
But I absolutely love my mini.

Shawn 357 · 12-14-2009, 09:56 AM

I have used both and this is my order of preference:
AR15
AK
Mini14

I can't comment on mini 30's because I do not have experience with them. If you are just going after coyotes and aren't concerned about plinking or zombies then a bolt action would do great. I don't know the area you are in but I know that I would not be able to reach out far enough with 22LR to go after coyotes in the areas that I do...

FYI:
In the AR/Mini debate you will notice that a lot of people will just push for whatever they spent money on....it reminds me of 911 sway bars and how everyone who own's Smart Bars say they are the best and everyone who own Tarret's say they are the best...

jtkkz · 12-14-2009, 10:00 AM

mini-14's are great, no problems so far, owned one for many years...

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

How can you own just one rifle? It's impossible. Get one of everything mentioned here. I've had rifles down before while waiting for parts or researching how to repair an issue. You need at least two rifles.

jtkkz · 12-14-2009, 10:34 AM

Iam sure most of us own different caliber rifles.. the .223 is fun to shoot cause it causes less pain on the shoulders, you can pretty much shoot this rifle all day long

Jeff Higgins · 12-14-2009, 10:39 AM

One caveat on Mini-14's - the older ones are notoriously inaccurate. The ones produced in the last several years have been markedly improved. So, if you like the Mini-14, buy a new one. Used ones are suspect as being dumped by someone who couldn't get it to shoot.

That said, even with the new ones, "good" Mini-14 accuracy is considered anything less than 2" - 2 1/2" groups at 100 yards from a bench. Good Ar-15's will better than halve that. The big question, though, is "does that really matter". The answer is "probably not". It all depends on what you expect out of it. For rolling coyotes at the ranges you describe, either will work wonderfully. Either one is a great plinker. Either one will give great service, and outlast you, if taken care of.

Unless you buy a cheap AR-15. The good, worthwhile ones run at least double, triple, or more above the cost of a basic Mini-14. They have become fashionable. With that, prices have climbed drastically, (IMHO) far oustripping the actual value of the rifle. Remember, these were designed to be produced in large quantities very cheaply; designed to a price, if you will. Unfortunately, that philosophy is no longer reflected in their price.

I guess what I'm getting at is that the Mini-14 is a far better value. Don't let its lower price fool you - it is simply priced where the AR-15's should be priced. It's a fantastic little rifle.

Jeff Higgins · 12-14-2009, 10:44 AM

Of course, the ultimate in simple, cheap reliability and accuracy would be a standard weight bolt action in .223. It will be inherently more accurate than any semi auto (until you start spending really big bucks on one, anyway). It will have a better trigger hands down, be easier and cheaper to mount a scope on, and will not be nearly as fussy about ammunition. Or cleanliness. It will shoot far, far longer before fouling becomes an issue and it must be cleaned. There is only one little hole to clean - the bore - with no gas system to strip and clean periodically. The perfect rifle for someone who doesn't want to have to work on one.

pwd72s · 12-14-2009, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by porsche4life

There is no clear answer... An AR done right is rugged, reliable, and functional... But so is an AK... Now IMHO the AR will be more accurate out of the box... I have no experience with a mini 14....

I have a stainless mini 14...it doesn't group like a bolt action rifle, but groups quite well. With a scope, easy to get 1 1/2" inch groups with fmj ammo at 100 yards. Jeff? Maybe I just got a good one? It's no youngster, purchased back in the 70's. Not for sale, BTW...

t951 · t951's Garage

I have a mini30 and it is great. It is not nearly as accurate as my buddies AR, but I paid a lot less, and it hits what i point it at. Never jammed, and ammo is cheap.

Highly recommended. A lot of countries use this as their weapon, as do a lot of prisons. Reliable and cheap, good combo.

Jeff Higgins · 12-14-2009, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pwd72s

I have a stainless mini 14...it doesn't group like a bolt action rifle, but groups quite well. With a scope, easy to get 1 1/2" inch groups with fmj ammo at 100 yards. Jeff? Maybe I just got a good one? It's no youngster, purchased back in the 70's. Not for sale, BTW...

Ruger used to buy barrels from a number of vendors. Quality was all over the map. They finally started making their own barrels in-house sometime in the '80's or '90's (I really can't remember when) and quality became far more consistant, and of a much higher level all around. We noticed a real difference, particularly in their #1's, which are very, very sensitive to poor barrels and poor tolerances. The M77's improved as well, but they didn't have as far to go.

The Mini-14 has historically been the most inconsistant of the lot. Some early ones shoot like a house-a-fire, but they are rarer than hen's teeth. Hold onto that one - you got very, very lucky... Most early Mini-14's were lucky to group under 3"- 4" at 100 yards. Any that did better were no fault of Ruger's.

The new ones will typically halve the group size of the old ones. On the average, they won't shoot as well as that one in a thousand old one, but this also means that the one "really good" new one you might stumble accross will be a real tack-driver. Just don't count on it.

It's important to emphasize that the Mini-14 did not benefit as much as the #1, or even the M77, when Ruger brought barrel making in-house. It had other, more deeply rooted problems, that even the best barrel made could not overcome. Stories are legion of folks that rebarreled these things to no avail and finally gave up. The root cause was some inherent problems in the manufacturing methods used to produce the actions; Ruger completely re-tooled Mini-14 production about 4-5 years ago to address this. So, while in the past there was a very slim chance you could luck into one where all of the tolerances stacked up the right way (and wind up with one like yours), the average accuracy of the rifle has gone up dramatically today. And the chances of getting a real dog are all but eliminated. Hell, I had one once that literally would not stay on the bottom of a coffee can at 100 yards, no matter what I did. Those days are gone.

JavaBrewer · JavaBrewer's Garage

Turners just had a sale on the Mini-14. I believe it was just under $700 band spanking new. That's a bunch cheaper than the $1100+ they were getting earlier this year.

jtkkz · 12-14-2009, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JavaBrewer

Turners just had a sale on the Mini-14. I believe it was just under $700 band spanking new. That's a bunch cheaper than the $1100+ they were getting earlier this year.

wow they have gone up in price since I bought mine a few years ago... I remember only paying $400+ for mine..

Mrmerlin · 12-14-2009, 01:26 PM

if you get a mini 30 then you can also use the ammo for an AK47.
Mini 30 with a scope can be used for deer hunting

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

I think the local Wal-Marts have them for under $700, but that may only be in blued and not stainless.

m21sniper · 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbo6bar

Is this more or less a Ford vs Chevy thing? I want to buy a rifle sometime over the next few months. I have read the gun threads here as they appear. Intend to use this for playing, blasting coyotes (packs that can be heard, but so far, rarely seen), and killing zombies. Thinking about the mini 14 and .22LR conversion kit to keep costs down. I don't anticipate needing to hit anything over 150 yards out. Seems like I can get similar performance from the mini 14 for less bucks.

Is there a rifle that would be the equivalent to the Porsche 911 (rugged, reliable, functional)?

I've been debating this for the last several months, and I keep changing my mind: AK, Mini 30, mini 14, bolt action ranch rifle (recent thread by Jeff Higgins). Last thing I need is multiple rifles. I want one that can do it all. Already have too many vices.
jurgen

If you want one rifle that can "do it all" i don't think you want a rifle in .223 at all.

That being said, the Mini-14 is a great rifle, and is a hell of a lot less money than an AR (I have owned both AR's and Mini's over the years). AR's are typically a lot more accurate and possess much greater range, but the Mini-14 is more resistant to fouling/dirt.

Either one is a great choice.