what is the general consensus on getting the proper construction permits?

[schamp]

If something goes really wrong- why give the insurance company an out. When big money is at play something like an addition built without permits is just enough to void a policy.

[Hugh R]

The whole concept of a "Permit" equates to "Permission" which I don't think I need from anyone for my property. That said, yes, I get permits for most things. Helps when selling a house, cause the buying agent will ask. Doesn't really protect you if the buyer sues you, like the POS LAWYER who bought my last house. He sued me for everything that I disclosed, was identified in the home inspection, and even things that I have him money for in escrow. I swore I'd fight him to the death, but this guy had done it twice before and knew every angle. I ended up giving the POS LAWYER money in the end to go away. One day, I'll be in a restaurant and see the POS LAWYER and he'll choke of what he's shoving down his throat and I'll be the only person in the place who knows how to aid a choking victim, and I'll laugh as he chokes to death.

[Dueller]

Generally speaking, in my area, any work done within the existing structure and done by the owner does not require a permit. But we don't have the permit nazis many other states/localities have. If you're adding to the structure you need a permit.

[911Rob]

My Home Reno's: no permits; ever. But no insurance breaches either, my plumbers and electricians ALWAYS pull their permits, period.

Commercial Projects: Always a permit, no exception.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Originally Posted by dd74

I think unlicensed/non permit upgrades truly hit when a home goes up for sale. Until then, enjoy that illegal rec room.

Yep.

Assume everything more extensive than one-for-one bona-fide maintenance (i.e. replacing cabinet doors, lightbulbs, etc.) needs a permit. Call the city and save yourself problems later. Don't be stupid or cheap - they're starting to get very aggressive about this kind of stuff. Yes, it costs money but what in construction doesn't?

[Porsche-O-Phile]

"Renovation" = depends on local AHJ. You need to check. A lot of times it's not required but better to have that in writing from them.

[URY914]

I did a project in a small town in rural Alabama years ago and the inspector was the Chief of Police. He had no clue what he was looking at. He checked that the plumber and electrican had journeyman cards and signed off on everything at the final inspection.

[RWebb]

The local govt. "permission" is based on the idea that screwing up certain constructions can cause an electrical fire that spreads to other people's houses and requires City Fire Dept.; plumbing screw-ups can contaminate everyone's drinking water or cause a nasty flood; & etc.

There are often substantial fines for not getting a required permit. It is a good idea to find out if a permit is required. Here, non-structural work is usually non-permitted, with the obvious exceptions of electrical & plumbing.

Yes, they do look at permits to see if they can raise your property taxes - that's "fair", right? I got hit big time for this - they are required to re-asses on the VALUE of the improvements, but instead they used the COST - which was much greater. I sued & forced them to back off on part of it. For some reason, they don't "like" me anymore...

If you are doing a renovation - say a kitchen, then it is likely legal to just get permits for the required sub-components of the job. The cost shown on the permit would be much less and you might escape a lot of the tax increase. But check to be certain before going ahead - attorneys can help you - they are, in essence, hired guns.

[VINMAN]

Here in Joisey, you need a fuchin permit for every little thing you do.

Need to replace sheetrock on more than 1/2 of one wall? permit

Replace more than one kitchen cabinet? permit.

Want to put paneling in a room? permit.

[RWebb]

sounds like you replace things one at a time over there...

[McLovin]

Originally Posted by Rot 911

That is pretty much the test I use.

The test I use is this:

Do you have chickens running around in your yard?

If you answered yes, you don't need no permit.

[RWebb]

a good general guide, but will not work in Orygun as even us urbain sorphistercates has done got checkens raht here in the big city

Gardening in Portland Oregon | Growing Gardens Digs at the Root of Hunger - Chickens

[Noah930]

Originally Posted by dd74

I think unlicensed/non permit upgrades truly hit when a home goes up for sale. Until then, enjoy that illegal rec room.

Even then (at time of home sale) what difference does it make? (I mean that cynically.) When I went house shopping last year, a fair number of properties had additions that were non-permitted. They just disclosed it while you were walking through the property, and that was it. It's not in the official square footage. It's not taxed. What negative consequence comes about not having permitted rec rooms/offices/maids quarters/etc?

[Jim Richards]

Not everyone knows how to properly add on to the electrical system or plumbing. Further, not everyone knows how to make/keep a basement dry. If licensed contractors can screw these things up, and some of them do, imagine homeowners that think all they need to do is ask advice from some schmoe at Home Depot.

[dd74]

Originally Posted by Noah930

Even then (at time of home sale) what difference does it make? (I mean that cynically.) When I went house shopping last year, a fair number of properties had additions that were non-permitted. They just disclosed it while you were walking through the property, and that was it. It's not in the official square footage. It's not taxed. What negative consequence comes about not having permitted rec rooms/offices/maids quarters/etc?

Well - and this is just a guess - it's the seller that loses out in a situation like this as they would not be able to include the non-permit room in the overall square footage of the house, which is one of the basis in a property's asking price. This happened to a house nearby ours, where because a room was non-permitted the seller had to lower the price by a few $ thousand.

[dd74]

Originally Posted by Jim Richards

Not everyone knows how to properly add on to the electrical system or plumbing. Further, not everyone knows how to make/keep a basement dry. If licensed contractors can screw these things up, and some of them do, imagine homeowners that think all they need to do is ask advice from some schmoe at Home Depot.

This too. Inspectors are a good thing. You wouldn't want to turn on your rec room lights and have your whole house catch fire, or even a wire burn, get the FD to come out, and have them find out the rec room was not inspected.

[Noah930]

David, your example (I think) is fairly rare. Does anyone actually confirm square footage? Certainly not either of the real estate agents involved. They just list whatever the previous sale or city has listed. And even if the square footage gets amended, what difference does that make? So you pay $400 per sq ft instead of $450. What's the house worth to the pool of buyers? The house is listed at $800K. Do you want it or not?

As I mentioned, I ask these questions cynically. The house we purchased last year was listed at 2100 sq ft. That's what was on the listing. That's what was on Zillow. That's what was on the previous sale from 2 years earlier. As my wife walked through, she commented that the house felt smaller than 2100 sq ft. We had looked at close to 100 homes by then, so we certainly had a feel for size. So I took out a measuring tape, sized up a few of the main rooms (i.e. left out closets and small nooks)...and came up with an estimate closer to 1800 sq ft.

Interestingly, after more digging I finally found that confirmed on propertyshark.com. Eventually when we received our city tax assessment, that's what they had listed, as well. But at the end of the day, do you want the house at this price, or not?

[Scuba Steve]

The City of San Antonio sums it up in short.

If you are building more than 100 sq ft or moving walls or doors, a building permit is required. Homeowners (owners) can obtain building permits and hire licensed contractors to perform the work. Homeowners can obtain a home repair permit, plumbing and mechanical permit to perform repairs or replace fixtures in a single family home. Electrical repairs must be performed by a licensed electrical contractor...

Question: What is a general repairs permit? Answer: It is a residential permit to allow for sheet rock repair, window replacement, door replacement, etc.

That said, I have never heard of anyone actually getting a permit to repair or replace fixtures or broken pipes. DIY work is completely under the radar.

What the city and county is really concerned about is septic tank work in order to protect the water supply. That sort of work they absolutely sign off and follow up with.

[RANDY P]

If you are going to do something that will alter the measurements of the home VS. what's on record then you are asking for it.

Come the day you want to sell or refinance the house and the appraiser determines there is a gross discrepancy between what you have and what's on record then they will not give you credit for the additions, but dock you on what it costs to restore the house to what it should be unless you turn up permits to prove otherwise.

It makes for a mess if you're trying to sell, that's for sure. No lender will recognize or even lend on a place that has been tattooed like that on an appraisal.

rjp

[jyl]

As a general rule (if there is one), if you hire licensed electricians and plumbers to do minor work (adding some outlets and switched light fixtures, moving a sink a few feet, replacing a 1/2" gas line with a 3/4" line - that's what I'm thinking about) and they pull electrical and plumbing permits, but you don't go as far as getting a full building permit, will the city send an inspector to sign off on the work and give you trouble for not getting the building permit? This would be for a kitchen remodel that is just replacing cabinets, replacing appliances, adding some outlets and lights, and moving a sink, paint, counters. No walls being moved, all work inside the house, no change to footprint or footage.

How about if you have the electrician install a larger electrical panel and a 240v outlet, and have the plumber replace the house's supply line from the street?

I know individual cities do things differently, just wondered if there is a typical, usual practice.