Volt & Leaf Tested in Hell

[john70t]

GM's Volt at first seems like a good idea...but it's a few decades late and a few $10,000s short of any realistic sale price.

Japan is going to be offering the low-mpg Prius in several variations for the American comsumer, so the Volt is planned to end up in the scrapyard. By design.

[kaisen]

Originally Posted by john70t

GM's Volt at first seems like a good idea...but it's a few decades late and a few $10,000s short of any realistic sale price.

Japan is going to be offering the low-mpg Prius in several variations for the American comsumer, so the Volt is planned to end up in the scrapyard. By design.

What are you talking about? Low-mpg Prius? Planned scrapyard by design?

Please expand

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by Pazuzu

That family is making the Leaf their PRIMARY commuter car, with a 70 mile round trip.

They're paying $80 a month for unlimited access to the EV grid here in town, which means that it's unlikely they will need to do any more than top off at home in the evening.

So...$80 a month total for commuting costs gets 2 adults to work, one with a 70 mile round trip. Yup, those damned useless electric vehicles...

How long do you think this subsidy for the energy use of the car will last?

[kach22i]

Originally Posted by RWebb

which, obviously, is in Michigan

Chevrolet Volt and Nissan Leaf, Driven Back-to-Back - NYTimes.com

Hell was not chosen for its charming Halloween-friendly name, but because it is surrounded by challenging two-lane roads.

This is where I drive my P-car in the summer.

The article was published October 26, 2010.....................I didn't see them, was driving into December (no heat in my car).

The styling of the Volt is sexy. The Leaf leaves something to be desired.

[cgarr]

What do they use for heat in a total electric car? and AC for that matter? What does that do to your mileage on a -20 morning?

Any testing on the EMF's yet? Any extra tumors growing yet?

[RWebb]

Originally Posted by red-beard

How long do you think this subsidy for the energy use of the car will last?

Longer than the subsidies for oil.

[Scott R]

Originally Posted by cgarr

What do they use for heat in a total electric car? and AC for that matter? What does that do to your mileage on a -20 morning?

Any testing on the EMF's yet? Any extra tumors growing yet?

Electric heat and an electric a/c compressor.

Cross-town commute on a hot day: 68 miles

Speed: Average 49 mph

Temperature: 110 degrees

Climate control: On

Driving from a rural area into the city at an average 49 mph with the a/c on high may produce this range. Under these conditions, climate control combined with higher-speed driving produces increased energy consumption, hence the effect on range.

Nissan LEAF Electric Car | Answers | Features | Does it have air conditioning, CD player, GPS, etc?

I've sat in one with the "a/c" running, it's not enjoyable. Nissan tested one going up i-70 here in Colorado. Uphill on a 23% grade with the climate system on netted about 35 miles. So you won't be driving this to go skiing around here.

[mattdavis11]

The electric a/c compressor on the Prius works well, I actually tried to convince one of the 911 racers to go that route. He runs in some series that requires a/c, SCCA maybe, I forget. He chose instead to run the a/c off the half shafts. Good move, but with an all electric vehicle?

[kaisen]

Originally Posted by mattdavis11

The electric a/c compressor on the Prius works well, I actually tried to convince one of the 911 racers to go that route. He runs in some series that requires a/c, SCCA maybe, I forget. He chose instead to run the a/c off the half shafts. Good move, but with an all electric vehicle?

Wouldn't work if you were sitting still, unfortunately. Traffic jam = sweating profusely.

[Hugh R]

I don't know too many people who can shell out the dough for an all electric car that they can't drive from LA to Orange county and back (say 80 miles), let alone drive anywhere else. It means you need to have at least two cars, one for around town, and one if you want to go anywhere else. In LA you get a lot of electricity from Indian power plants on reservations near Four Corners, and they have few air pollution controls on those power plants. BTW, the air pollution blows back towards LA.

[Pazuzu]

Originally Posted by red-beard

How long do you think this subsidy for the energy use of the car will last?

Not a subsidy, it's an account with NRG. AFAIK, it's the same as a payment to Reliant or any other. Pay your electric bill, pay your car-electric bill.

[HardDrive]

Well clearly electrics are not going to replace gas engines any time soon. But I think they will start to make quick inroads in the urban markets with a compact central core. A long range commuter no, but a grocery/drop kids off at school/errands car yes.

[RWebb]

the Renault version of the Leaf should sell huge in the Far East mkts - it will be fleet sales to postal services & etc.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by Pazuzu

Not a subsidy, it's an account with NRG. AFAIK, it's the same as a payment to Reliant or any other. Pay your electric bill, pay your car-electric bill.

That $80 would be about 800-1000 kWh at my electricty rates. Is that enough for regular commuting and driving?

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Conceptually the Volt is a neat car. Even at $41k with an $8k tax credit I could see paying $33k for one.

I won't support the UAW however - good car or not, I don't want a single dime of my money going to that institution. They already get enough of my money through taxes and government-authorized bailouts/handouts. I'd love to see them be shut down (yeah like that'll ever happen under this administration especially) because there are a number of neat American made models in recent years I'd otherwise consider and I like the idea of keeping my money here in the USA.

Oh well. Maybe a Leaf. Or a Tesla...

If I could find a Tesla for under $50k I'd be all over it.

[David]

Originally Posted by red-beard

That $80 would be about 800-1000 kWh at my electricty rates. Is that enough for regular commuting and driving?

The $80 covers installation and rental on the home charging station and all the electricity your car can use whether it's charged at your house or at one of the public charging stations.

I believe the Leaf batteries have a 24 kwh capacity so if you use a full charge everyday which is unlikely it would be about 720 kwh's a month.

[slakjaw]

Originally Posted by cgarr

What do they use for heat in a total electric car? and AC for that matter? What does that do to your mileage on a -20 morning?

Any testing on the EMF's yet? Any extra tumors growing yet?

What does -20 do to the range? Batts dont like low temps.

[kaisen]

Originally Posted by slakjaw

What does -20 do to the range? Batts dont like low temps.

If there aren't warmers on the battery, the batteries lose 30% of their 'ability' by 32F and 50% by 0F and 80% at -10F. They also need warmers to take charge as quickly at those temps. This was just on 'Good Question' on WCCO news last night.

Nissan says range will diminish 30-40% at colder temperatures. So 100 miles turns into 60-70 which is still fine for an urban commuter.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by LubeMaster77

Planting trees is just stupid, the surface area on a leaf is nothing compared to that of grass! Compare an acre of O2 production from an acre of grass vs. that of a tree - no comparison!!!

God almighty this country is more F***'d up than a soup sandwich!!!

In the midwest, if you plant grass and don't maintain it, you eventually get trees. If you plant trees to begin with, you end up with trees. It's a conspiracy. The trees are going to take over unless we are diligent in combating them.

[scottmandue]

Let's all go back to horse and buggies.... technology is dead... there are no new ideas to be had.