Need some help - Do you have Time of Day Metering?

[red-beard]

Please chime in either way. I'm looking to produce a product that can offset time of day metering. As SMART meters are rolled out, some utiities are offering day/night or normal/peak rates, based on time of day.

Please post yes or no. And if Yes, how many peak hours and your electric rates, if you know.

Thanks for the help!

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Nope, flate rate per kWh. One price for the first few hundred kWh in a given month (forget the exact # offhand, I'd have to dig up my spreadsheet that I use to track all this stuff) and another rate once you exceed that. It averages out to about $0.14 for my use IIRC. FWIW it's off the local nuclear power plant a few miles away, so rates are pretty low.

We're ripping out large hot/chilled water storage tanks on one project I'm working on (large commercial high-rise) where they were used as part of a HW/CW plant to enable the chillers to run off-hours back in the 1980s when there were large enough price differentials between day & night to make it worthwhile, then they'd heat/cool the building off what was in the tanks so they could shut the chillers down. Now it's all peak demand pricing, so it doesn't matter - easier/better/simpler to just run new efficiency chillers whenever needed and stick in VFDs all over the place so you don't "spike" the demand and pay for it on motor starts and similar events.

Seems most places are going this way also. The system we're modifying/removing was pretty interesting and innovative, but doesn't really serve a purpose now because of changes to the pricing structure.

[Cloggie]

Had it for decades here in the Netherlands. It actually is two separate meters with different rates for each. Most appliances have the ability to switch on when the low rate kicks in and that is a fairly common way of operating. For example, our dishwasher (which heats its own water) is set to come on when the rate is low....

I think if widespread use is there, it becomes a good way to balance the load and make the overall system more efficient.

D.

[Joeaksa]

We have had it for years here in the desert. Am on a plan that power is much cheaper from 9 pm to 9 am. We do all of our "heavy useage" like washing clothes, pump on the pool and so on during the evening or early morning and it really cuts the electricity bill.

That said I am slowly switching over to solar and once I get a good system cobbled together will run the pool totally off of solar, cutting my power bill by at least half.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

Nope, flate rate per kWh. One price for the first few hundred kWh in a given month (forget the exact # offhand, I'd have to dig up my spreadsheet that I use to track all this stuff) and another rate once you exceed that. It averages out to about $0.14 for my use IIRC. FWIW it's off the local nuclear power plant a few miles away, so rates are pretty low.

We're ripping out large hot/chilled water storage tanks on one project I'm working on (large commercial high-rise) where they were used as part of a HW/CW plant to enable the chillers to run off-hours back in the 1980s when there were large enough price differentials between day & night to make it worthwhile, then they'd heat/cool the building off what was in the tanks so they could shut the chillers down. Now it's all peak demand pricing, so it doesn't matter - easier/better/simpler to just run new efficiency chillers whenever needed and stick in VFDs all over the place so you don't "spike" the demand and pay for it on motor starts and similar events.

Seems most places are going this way also. The system we're modifying/removing was pretty interesting and innovative, but doesn't really serve a purpose now because of changes to the pricing structure.

VFDs have come WAY down in price. Another product I'm working on is using VFDs on oil field equipment.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

And utility companies often give rebates for installing them.

[krystar]

although they're in no hurry to do the install. i've been on the install list since april

[john70t]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

We're ripping out large hot/chilled water storage tanks on one project I'm working on (large commercial high-rise) where they were used as part of a HW/CW plant to enable the chillers to run off-hours.....

What do you plan to do with these, and how much do they cost brand new?

With solar/fan and insulation, that could potentially take a residential off the heating grid.

[Joe Bob]

That's one of the selling points for electric vehicles. It is assumed that they chearge at night when demand is low. One would think that most people get home after 5-6 pm....they should have a timer to kick in charging after "Leno"....

[pwd72s]

Originally Posted by Cloggie

Had it for decades here in the Netherlands. It actually is two separate meters with different rates for each. Most appliances have the ability to switch on when the low rate kicks in and that is a fairly common way of operating. For example, our dishwasher (which heats its own water) is set to come on when the rate is low....

I think if widespread use is there, it becomes a good way to balance the load and make the overall system more efficient.

D.

Also very efficient for electronic eavesdropping of your electricity use. I'm concerned about privacy here. Will refuse such metering even if it costs me more.

I hate being monitored. 1984 was quite some time ago, I know. Still, I hate being monitored by everybody...grocery stores, etc. Especially GOVERNMENT!

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Originally Posted by john70t

What do you plan to do with these, and how much do they cost brand new?

With solar/fan and insulation, that could potentially take a residential off the heating grid.

They're huge - 25,000 gallons a pop IIRC. Whoever gets the demo contract can do whatever they want with them. They might be able to be gotten out of the building whole and if so, they'll probably try to salvage them otherwise they'll end up being cut up and the materials scrapped probably.

[red-beard]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

They're huge - 25,000 gallons a pop IIRC. Whoever gets the demo contract can do whatever they want with them. They might be able to be gotten out of the building whole and if so, they'll probably try to salvage them otherwise they'll end up being cut up and the materials scrapped probably.

Jeff,

Is there Asbestos in there? One of my clients does asbestos demo as their primary business.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

None known. Building went into service in the 1980s so it's the post-asbestos era but we might still get someone in there to test just in case. I haven't seen anything that looks suspicious when I've been down there, but it pops up in all kinds of weird places and if it's there, it'll be found ($$$) - I've seen it in mastic, caulk, floor tiles, pipe insulation (obviously), etc.