Originally Posted by trekkor (Post 6453135)

If I was hiring, I would start a good candidate at $15 with the opportunity to make $20 by the end of the first year.


I have not had employees for about four years now.
I hire other tile contractors as 'subs' and 1099 them at the end of the year.



KT

Originally Posted by look 171 (Post 6453463)

I am very thankful to have them.

Originally Posted by Zeke (Post 6452891)

Let's start with your example of HVAC and plumber. I'll leave electrician out for now since even electrical employees in CA have to carry a license (residential). The first plumber out to the house on any job is no more than an apprentice w/o a journeyman's help or supervision. When he gets in trouble, someone shows up. But they don't care if it takes a long time because they're mostly not on a fixed price. Pretty much all the first line guys are Hispanic and a lot of them have a hard time being understood. They're garbage disposer changers.

HVAC is just as bad. All but the guy filling the A/C system are grunts. They all speak Spanish at work and do pretty much a fundamental job. Nothing unusual about seeing crooked registers and sloppy duct work. You know those restaurants where all the stuff is exposed above and looks like race car headers? Not your typical residential guys.

Now commercial is dead just like residential, so the best workers are working; not necessarily the best paid. That falls right in with my statement that there is nothing new about people who will work harder and longer for less. We've seen that in CA agriculture all along.

"But in areas where true skill is required..." I like this. No, real skill is not required to paint. Most people can do it themselves and get by. I'm a union trained painter that had to leave that business in 1980 because of the cheap labor problem. But when I paint interior work, it's beautiful work that you just don't see anywhere anymore. Most can't even tell. They don't see the [i]lack]/i] of brush strokes, they only see when it's bad.

And then they accept that is how it looks.

No, the art of a trade is lost to cheap flimsy workmanship.

...but there is still a place for a skilled craftsman (like yourself) in our country. No, not really. I think I saw the last of it a few years ago. It's kinda like, "The day the music died."

There was a time when every trade on a job had an interest in seeing the job completed to a fine standard and chided those that weren't stepping up. I know I haven't seen that in years.

My problem is I don't want to work with any of these clowns. I just need a little money to get by while I look around for my next enterprise. I still do the best I know how.

Originally Posted by onewhippedpuppy (Post 6453684)

Ever consider your location? Because most of your comments don't apply here. There are of course illegal workers, but you'll usually find them doing menial jobs. I spent 6 years doing residential remodeling in KS, so I do have some background to support my comments.

Originally Posted by Rot 911 (Post 6454688)

1. Housing: your $600,000.00 house in California will cost you about $150,000 here. Seriously.

2. A family making $40,000 a year here can afford that $150,000 house and still have money to do things.

3. The housing market here (and the economy in general for that matter) didn't take the hit that the housing market did in other locations. That $150K house is still worht $150K.

4. Good tradespeople are still in high demand here. You won't make $45.00 an hour, but even a new welder can pull down $12.00 to start and that money goes a lot farther here.

Originally Posted by silverwhaletail (Post 6454748)

This is an oversimplification.
.................................................. .................................
What does health insurance cost for a family of four, per month, in Missouri???

Originally Posted by Zeke (Post 6454767)

.................................

But, I've seen the light. I'm ditching that kind of work.............

Originally Posted by asphaltgambler (Post 6454800)

Me Three............................I have not stood idle and watched the world go by. I have invested a lot of money and time to change direction. It's an every day effort.