Vuitton Cup

[nostatic]

Holy crap. Just finished watching the first race, now between races on DVR. Amazing to watch and glad the two guys are ok.

[Neilk]

Originally Posted by nostatic

Holy crap. Just finished watching the first race, now between races on DVR. Amazing to watch and glad the two guys are ok.

Here is a little highlight of the action. amazing stuff

[nota]

race 2 at 6 pm today on NBCSPT 640 ON MY UNIVERCE-ATT cable

[TheMentat]

Wow... I can't get over how amazing those new boats are!

Anybody know if somebody has to actively control the pitch of those things when they are foiling?

[Bill Douglas]

No one in this country seems terribly interested in the race. Back in the day (Dennis Connor era) the whole country was following the big beautiful, hi tech ,single hulled yachts.

[tadink]

Originally Posted by TheMentat

Wow... I can't get over how amazing those new boats are!

Anybody know if somebody has to actively control the pitch of those things when they are foiling?

Yes, apparently they can control the pitch, if you look closely you'll see some wires running inside the wheel about 2" down inside the rim from the part the guy is holding onto, it is my understanding that is used to set the rudder pitch....but it appears to be an imperfect science at this point as the boats tend to hobby horse a bit....

they are truly impressive in person - and they just cook around the bay! Makes this place look really small!

pity they keep breaking and we cannot get good head to head racing going on....maybe in the finals.

also a pity that the magic of this has not resonated with the average unwashed public. coverage has been good but there are so many other distractions from the racing that a lot of peeps have just tuned it out.....sailors included!

fingers crossed we'll actually see some racing - at this point they are kind of a 'test pilot' air show - they go great until something breaks!

td

[cstreit]

Holy crap. No idea they had come this far, those boats are flying!

[nostatic]

It is spectacular to watch, both from a tactics and just the sheer performance of the boats. They strike me as being like F1 a few decades ago when the cars where wicked fast but broke a lot.

[Bill Douglas]

Originally Posted by nostatic

wicked fast but broke a lot.

Umm, one broke again today.

[Sunroof]

I do not know why they did not incorporate some type of cunnard or winglet on the front hulls to keep them slightly higher or elevated to avoid diving or pitch poling. Watching them at speed it seems that the forward portion of the hull just barely stays above the surface. The pitch could be electronically controlled like everything else on these monsters. Watching smaller catamarans sail, like a Hobie Cat 16, the crew can use the trapeze and hang out toward the rear to balance the hulls and shift weight to the rear to avoid pitch poling or diving of the hull in the water. Obviously this cannot be done on these Cup boats.

[livi]

Really magnificent boats! I would probably soil my pants on board.

[cairns]

They wrote the rules in a way that didn't (they thought) allow for such drastic changes in pitch and they outlawed trim tabs and moveable winglets.

The daggerboards are allowed to be moved in almost any direction. The can be being dropped or raised and they can be canted, the pitch can be altered, etc. But the rule states the windward board is not allowed to contribute to righting moment and the boards cannot protrude outboard of the hull.

The rudder is far more limited- it can only rotate about a single axis up to 10° off vertical and and trim tabs or moveable winglets aren't allowed.

Allowing the movement in the daggerboards allowed the boats to foil- which was never expected. The lack of trim tabs (esp on the rudder) makes them that much harder to control- most of the fore-aft pitch is controlled by the daggerboards (but also by the sails- releasing the jib for example would allow the bow to pitch up). Being in the center of the boat the changes are more extreme- a small change in daggerboard pitch could move the boats center of gravity foreward or aft in a big way.

Consequently the monsters are that much harder to control. Ironically, those who wrote the rule (I think that would be some very rich guy in San Francisco who owns most of the free world) now want to change it at the last minute to allow such changes and put moveable trim tabs on the rudder (which would make controlling pitch changes much easier).

It reminds one of Dennis Conner just before Australia II owned him. But...but...they cheated better than me- that's not fair!

Anyway I don't think Larry knew how far he was taking it. Fascinating but much more dangerous than ever before.

As on old beachcat sailor (Prindle 18 was my favorite but I owned Hobies and Nacras too) I find this pretty cool beans.

[Sunroof]

The new AC72's changed the sport from the old monohull 12 meter boats, but for a old guy like me that era of America Cup racing in Newport, Rhode Island provided just as many thrills. Anyone remember that interview with Ted Turner after his win in Courageous?! He was drunk out of his mind on national television! Now thats a sailor!

Today, its hard to find an American crew member let alone an American Captain, a boat hull without big dollar sponsership logos or owners who cannot approach the sport without shelling out tens of millions of dollars. Its a different game, but nevertheless a very exciting one. Best television coverage I have ever seen.

[Sunroof]

well explained Cairns....

_/)

[cairns]

The new AC72's changed the sport from the old monohull 12 meter boats, but for a old guy like me that era of America Cup racing in Newport, Rhode Island provided just as many thrills. Anyone remember that interview with Ted Turner after his win in Courageous?! He was drunk out of his mind on national television! Now thats a sailor!

Thank you and yes I do. I attended the last one in NZ and the one in Barcelona but doubt if I will be able to get to SFO this year. I was sad to see Larry take it away from Alingi (basically in court instead of on the water) but that's the way it's played nowadays. The one I most remember though was Australia II and the race of the century- 4 to 3 decided in the last race. Australia II is now in the Nautical Museum in Sydney and you can touch the keel.

Actually I should have explained a little better- it's not the movement of the daggerboards so much but the lack of limits on shape that allow the boats to foil. They look like an a L (and a reverse L on the other side) and are almost s shaped top to bottom to allow for pitch and foil angle changes as they are moved up or down. The bottom of the L is the wing (or foil) that gets them out of the water.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by cairns

As on old beachcat sailor (Prindle 18 was my favorite but I owned Hobies and Nacras too) I find this pretty cool beans.

That is where I am. I learned to sail on a Prindle 18 a friend of mine owned. He was on the sailing team at the Naval Academy and I really loved it.

Concerning the Cup: Wow.

[Sunroof]

We were in Newport last summer to see the smaller AC45s sail as part of the world wide demo races. They had an AC72 out of the water with the sail off for the public to get close too and touch. It was just about all carbon fiber. Lite as a feather and as thin as a piece of cardboard! What was really amazing was getting up close with the Oracle crew whose outfits made them look more like armored Ninja Turtles then the crew of old with blue blazers and ascots!

I have to wonder what old Nat Herreshoff would think of this racing technology today?

[Sunroof]

Emirates takes third race now making it a 2 to 1 lead due to equipment malfunction.

"New Zealand skipper Dean Barker moved his AC72 catamaran underneath at the start and made a slick move inside Luna Rossa at the first mark to take the lead. The Italians had their best start and stayed close until the control arm of their wing sail broke, forcing another withdrawal in a series beset by big breezes and breakdowns".

Third mechanical breakdown in three races on these AC72 monsters. Would'nt it be something if one of these teams wins because of mechanical malfunctions. Will they reassess wind speeds and limit racing to lower speeds?

[kach22i]

Brutal video

[vash]

i saw a small crane pulling apart that boat. that explains it.

thanks for posting that. that sailboat is flying!! is that 4 (300hp) motor boat that picked up the two guys, the same boat flying around the corner on the outside? man, amazing they need such high HP to keep up.

nice.